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Can people make equivalent characters of the Horus heresy two ww2 characters I'd like to see it happen
Here I'll start it off make any changes you want at any timeline

hitler: horus
Winston churchhill: marneus Calgar, yarrick, the emperor or some other famous person.

You can do other races as well remember this is equivalents.

Countries:
Tau: russia or china
Space marines: America
Tyranids: Germans -_- ?!?!? I don't know they eat everything!

The Imperium is literally like, the definition of fascism.

Eldar is Isreal.

Tau is 'Murica.

The rest of the factions are either too straight up evil (Chaos) or too mindless (nids) to really approximate with any real life nation. Even the Nazi's, who are considered by many to be the most "evil" faction in history, were never as omnicidal as the Tyranids or mustache-twirlingly villainous as Chaos.

Marneus Calgar was born thousands of years after the Horus Heresy and the same with Yarrick, to put it simply people can come up with any ludicrous similarities that their minds allow but this is just stupid

The Horus Heresy's base is that of the fall in heaven in Christianity

Horus = Lucifer (Highest of God's servant, who fell)
The Emperor = God

Hitler wasn't created and trusted by Churchill only for Hitler to cause civil war, there's no real parallels here

BlaxicanX wrote:
Tau is 'Murica.

Woah woah woah, did you just equate a bunch of damn blue space commies to the Land of the Free? Son, I think you and I need to have a talk.

^^^^^^^^^. This

 xSPYXEx wrote:

BlaxicanX wrote:
Tau is 'Murica.

Woah woah woah, did you just equate a bunch of damn blue space commies to the Land of the Free? Son, I think you and I need to have a talk.

America isn't a melting pot of different cultures all striving for collective betterment through the purchase of goods and or services?

The Big E - Saddam

Horus - Uday.

No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

We also have big manly guns and tanks, not little hovering animu suits that fire sparkle guns.

^^^^ win !

Imperium of Man: Population active in free-market activities = 0.000000000000000000000001% (e.g. Rogue Traders)
Tau Empires: Population active in free-market activities = 25% (e.g. Water Caste)


If you want a capitalist equivalent in 40K, Tau are by far your best bet.

Just like to say that a communist state is a classless society, the Tau caste system is more akin to a capitalist society.
Yeah, their 'Greater Good' ideology is sort of communistic, but they have more in common with the good ole' Nazi party. Anything not the Tau race is a second class citizen, like the Aryan race to everyone else.
Spheres of expansion? I'm sure you mean Reichs.
The Greater Good is having everything in a place, no mixing, no breeding, all under control of the 'master race'. Tau are closer to Nazis than a communist state, but really, they are neither. People just don't really grasp what communist means.

Back OT, the Horus Heresy has about as much in common with WWII as I have in common with Nicki Minaj.
Marneus Calgar also did not take part in the Heresy, however the Primarch of his legion, Roboute Guilliman, did. You should really learn the history of the Universe before asking this sort of question.

There's very little in the way of WW2 parallels in 40k. The Armageddon Steel Legion and Valhallan Ice Warriors are loosely based (appearance wise) on Germany and the USSR at the time respectively, but that's really it.

The only war in 40k that I know of that has a true IRL parallel is the Macharian Crusade and Alexander the Great's conquests. The Siege of Vraks (at least the early phase) has a heavy WWI ascetic to it as well.

As has said already, the Horus Heresy was based off the fall of lucifer in biblical christianity. Originally this was even more so as it was a mythical event that people in the Imperium weren't sure even happened.

Reading this thread suggests to me that a number of people need to re-visit their history, political science, and economics classes.

 Psienesis wrote:
Reading this thread suggests to me that a number of people need to re-visit their history, political science, and economics classes.

Care to elaborate?

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:
Just like to say that a communist state is a classless society, the Tau caste system is more akin to a capitalist society.

What, what? No.

Yeah, their 'Greater Good' ideology is sort of communistic, but they have more in common with the good ole' Nazi party. Anything not the Tau race is a second class citizen, like the Aryan race to everyone else.
Spheres of expansion? I'm sure you mean Reichs.
The Greater Good is having everything in a place, no mixing, no breeding, all under control of the 'master race'. Tau are closer to Nazis than a communist state.

People just don't really grasp what communist means.

That's okay, just like you really can't grasp the difference between Facism and plain Racism, so you break even.

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

Tau aren't communist, and America isn't capitalist. If we were Capitalists, there would never have been a "bail-out", nor state-funded healthcare, social security, or any kind of taxes at all. America is definitely not, and never has been, a capitalistic state.

 KplKeegan wrote:

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:
Just like to say that a communist state is a classless society, the Tau caste system is more akin to a capitalist society.

What, what? No.

Yeah, their 'Greater Good' ideology is sort of communistic, but they have more in common with the good ole' Nazi party. Anything not the Tau race is a second class citizen, like the Aryan race to everyone else.
Spheres of expansion? I'm sure you mean Reichs.
The Greater Good is having everything in a place, no mixing, no breeding, all under control of the 'master race'. Tau are closer to Nazis than a communist state.

People just don't really grasp what communist means.

That's okay, just like you really can't grasp the difference between Facism and plain Racism, so you break even.

And where is the racism there?
The Nazis were both racist AND fascist, as are the Tau.

Sir Samuel Buca wrote:And where is the racism there?
The Nazis were both racist AND fascist, as are the Tau.

You are either a massive troll, or you have no clue what you're blabbering about.

If anything, the Imperium is a spitting image of facism/racism than the Tau, which incorporates other races into 'The Greater Good'.

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist

Relatively little about their society is communist, Feudalist perhaps in some ways, but not really communist. That's just sillyness that internet hyperbole applies to the Tau.

The Tau really, more than anything else, are a Feudal/Fascist hybrid, an aggressive expansionary ideology built around "a place for every man and every man in his place" subordinate to the unquestionable will of a singular noble/political class that exerts total control over society in an effort to build a "greater society", though not necessarily an equal and egalitarian society as a communist society would aspire to.

, they use a full caste system which you can't move out of

which is not in any way communist, at least, not under *actual* Marxist principles.

and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

That depends entirely on what end of the political spectrum you're sitting on there.

 KplKeegan wrote:

Sir Samuel Buca wrote:And where is the racism there?
The Nazis were both racist AND fascist, as are the Tau.

You are either a massive troll, or you have no clue what you're blabbering about.

If anything, the Imperium is a spitting image of facism/racism than the Tau, which incorporates other races into 'The Greater Good'.

A Greater Good for the Tau race. Any other race that is absorbed is a second class citizen, the Tau come out on top. And I'm not arguing that the IoM isn't, I'm ust saying that the Tau are. Do you have some problem reading what is written, or do you prefer to just put your own twist on things? You're not making any points yourself, your only argument is "No, you are wrong", without having any actual input.

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:

 KplKeegan wrote:

Sir Samuel Buca wrote:And where is the racism there?
The Nazis were both racist AND fascist, as are the Tau.

You are either a massive troll, or you have no clue what you're blabbering about.

If anything, the Imperium is a spitting image of facism/racism than the Tau, which incorporates other races into 'The Greater Good'.

A Greater Good for the Tau race. Any other race that is absorbed is a second class citizen, the Tau come out on top. And I'm not arguing that the IoM isn't, I'm ust saying that the Tau are. Do you have some problem reading what is written, or do you prefer to just put your own twist on things? You're not making any points yourself, your only argument is "No, you are wrong", without having any actual input.

I'd argue that they're not just in it for the greater good just the Tau race, but rather selected groups. Each caste and subject race is put to where they are most valuable. I'd say they're in it for the greater good of the society as a whole regardless of constituent parts, save for the Ethereal caste.

There's never been an indication that say, Tau Earth caste have any noticeably better lives than say, Human subjects of the Tau empire.

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

You are aware that you contradict yourself here? With the sole exception of their utilitarian ideology there is nothing about the Tau that makes them even remotely comparable to most known socialist societies.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:

 KplKeegan wrote:

Sir Samuel Buca wrote:And where is the racism there?
The Nazis were both racist AND fascist, as are the Tau.

You are either a massive troll, or you have no clue what you're blabbering about.

If anything, the Imperium is a spitting image of facism/racism than the Tau, which incorporates other races into 'The Greater Good'.

A Greater Good for the Tau race. Any other race that is absorbed is a second class citizen, the Tau come out on top. And I'm not arguing that the IoM isn't, I'm ust saying that the Tau are. Do you have some problem reading what is written, or do you prefer to just put your own twist on things? You're not making any points yourself, your only argument is "No, you are wrong", without having any actual input.

You confuse race with species. Neither the Tau nor the Imperium of Man are racist, although the later can certainly harbour racist societies.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BlaxicanX wrote:

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

Tau aren't communist, and America isn't capitalist. If we were Capitalists, there would never have been a "bail-out", nor state-funded healthcare, social security, or any kind of taxes at all. America is definitely not, and never has been, a capitalistic state.

At the end of the day capitalism means little more than that the ownership of capital goods and the means of production is in private hands. What you describe is pure laisez faire capitalism, which is one variant but certainly not the only one.

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Reading this thread suggests to me that a number of people need to re-visit their history, political science, and economics classes.

Care to elaborate?

The "Greater Good", as practiced by the Tau, has absolutely nothing to do with Communism. All societies exist to serve their "greater good", however it is that society might interpret that very fuzzy concept. The closest one *might* come to that is certain interpretations of Socialism, but even then, it's... not a very good comparison. The "Space Commie" appellation applied to the Tau as part of this hobby is taken far, far too literally by people who fundamentally don't know what they are talking about.

The Hitler/Churchill comparisons.... just stop. Setting Godwin's Law aside for the moment, if you want to talk about Hitler-like activities, then both sides of the Heresy are Hitler. Both Horus and the Emperor have caused the deaths of billions, the Space Marines and Imperial Army eradicated entire civilizations under the Emperor's orders, and the Emperor was not a jolly drunkard who happened to rise to the occasion when his country needed him. Someone mentioned the Biblical story of the Fall of Lucifer in the Emperor vs Horus thing, and that's correct. That's the inspiration for the story.

On history? Churchill and Hitler had no prior relationship before their nations went to war. They damned sure didn't have a father/favorite son relationship, with Horus going about gassing Xenos by the millions because Dad told him to, but getting out of line when he decided that he wanted to gas whomever he wanted.

 Psienesis wrote:

 Sir Samuel Buca wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Reading this thread suggests to me that a number of people need to re-visit their history, political science, and economics classes.

Care to elaborate?

The "Greater Good", as practiced by the Tau, has absolutely nothing to do with Communism. All societies exist to serve their "greater good", however it is that society might interpret that very fuzzy concept. The closest one *might* come to that is certain interpretations of Socialism, but even then, it's... not a very good comparison. The "Space Commie" appellation applied to the Tau as part of this hobby is taken far, far too literally by people who fundamentally don't know what they are talking about.

The Hitler/Churchill comparisons.... just stop. Setting Godwin's Law aside for the moment, if you want to talk about Hitler-like activities, then both sides of the Heresy are Hitler. Both Horus and the Emperor have caused the deaths of billions, the Space Marines and Imperial Army eradicated entire civilizations under the Emperor's orders, and the Emperor was not a jolly drunkard who happened to rise to the occasion when his country needed him. Someone mentioned the Biblical story of the Fall of Lucifer in the Emperor vs Horus thing, and that's correct. That's the inspiration for the story.

On history? Churchill and Hitler had no prior relationship before their nations went to war. They damned sure didn't have a father/favorite son relationship, with Horus going about gassing Xenos by the millions because Dad told him to, but getting out of line when he decided that he wanted to gas whomever he wanted.

You sir, are one of few people in here with their head screwed on.

Tau could be interpreted as either Fascist or Communist, too little about the inner-workings of their society is known. Both Fascism and Communism would claim to strive for the Greater Good, though Fascism perhaps moreso whereas Communists would be more concerned with the flow of history.

This thread started as connecting 40k races and people to WW2 races and people, how did this devolve into arguing over if a country is capitalist or communist and what that even means? Sometimes this forum confuses me hahaha

Anyway, am I the only one who has connected the Feral Orks to the Zulus in Africa? I mean, when you look at Praetorian fluff, they are always at war with the Feral Orks on their planet. Their uniforms look identical to British African uniforms from that era (which dates escape me at the moment) as well.

 washout77 wrote:
This thread started as connecting 40k races and people to WW2 races and people, how did this devolve into arguing over if a country is capitalist or communist and what that even means? Sometimes this forum confuses me hahaha

Anyway, am I the only one who has connected the Feral Orks to the Zulus in Africa? I mean, when you look at Praetorian fluff, they are always at war with the Feral Orks on their planet. Their uniforms look identical to British African uniforms from that era (which dates escape me at the moment) as well.

I am so glad someone mentioned this, and it was around the 1890's i think. Plus 40k is just loads of subtle references to the real world so nothing is as clear as the story of the praetorian guard.

As soon i read tau as america i spilled my coffee all over the screen followed by falling onto the ground and rofl 'd

 Kasrkin229 wrote:
No America is Capitalist , The Tau are expressly Communist , they use a full caste system which you can't move out of , and they work for the betterment of society , we Americans do it for the betterment of the individual

wait .... you think you dont have a cast system in USA