The pope to resign on February 28

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**punkow**

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/12/world/europe/pope-benedict-xvi-says-he-will-retire.html?ref=global-home&_r=0

The second pope in history to "resign"

**blood reaper**

Good.

That's really all I can say. The guy should really be facing criminal charges for his (and the Churches) dealing with the problem of pedophile priests, and how they covered it up.

**Huffy**

Interesting, I wonder what the reasoning is behind this

**Hordini**

Like I said in the other thread: Surprising, but better he resign now if he knows he can't really handle it anymore due to his age.

**Jayce_The_Ace**

What always puzzles me, is why every Pope they elect always has 'one foot in the grave' already - Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?

**AlmightyWalrus**

Jayce_The_Ace wrote:
What always puzzles me, is why every Pope they elect always has 'one foot in the grave' already - Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?

JP II was pope for 22 years, hardly one foot in the grave.

**Frazzled**

punkow wrote:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/12/world/europe/pope-benedict-xvi-says-he-will-retire.html?ref=global-home&_r=0

The second pope in history to "resign"

Did he eat the Findus beef?

**LuciusAR**

I think it’s rather refreshing to see a Pope resign over his health. It’s odd the way so many Popes hang on till death despite the fact it’s patently obvious that their duties are quite literally killing them all the quicker.

**reds8n**

Dear Brothers,

I have convoked you to this Consistory, not only for the three canonizations, but also to communicate to you a decision of great importance for the life of the Church. After having repeatedly examined my conscience before God, I have come to the certainty that my strengths, due to an advanced age, are no longer suited to an adequate exercise of the Petrine ministry. I am well aware that this ministry, due to its essential spiritual nature, must be carried out not only with words and deeds, but no less with prayer and suffering. However, in today’s world, subject to so many rapid changes and shaken by questions of deep relevance for the life of faith, in order to govern the bark of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary, strength which in the last few months, has deteriorated in me to the extent that I have had to recognize my incapacity to adequately fulfill the ministry entrusted to me. For this reason, and well aware of the seriousness of this act, with full freedom I declare that I renounce the ministry of Bishop of Rome, Successor of Saint Peter, entrusted to me by the Cardinals on 19 April 2005, in such a way, that as from 28 February 2013, at 20:00 hours, the See of Rome, the See of Saint Peter, will be vacant and a Conclave to elect the new Supreme Pontiff will have to be convoked by those whose competence it is.

Dear Brothers, I thank you most sincerely for all the love and work with which you have supported me in my ministry and I ask pardon for all my defects. And now, let us entrust the Holy Church to the care of Our Supreme Pastor, Our Lord Jesus Christ, and implore his holy Mother Mary, so that she may assist the Cardinal Fathers with her maternal solicitude, in electing a new Supreme Pontiff. With regard to myself, I wish to also devotedly serve the Holy Church of God in the future through a life dedicated to prayer.

From the Vatican, 10 February 2013

BENEDICTUS PP XVI

.... does the Papacy come with a good pension scheme ?

**Kid_Kyoto**

Jayce_The_Ace wrote:
What always puzzles me, is why every Pope they elect always has 'one foot in the grave' already - Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?

John Paul was pretty young in pope terms, 50s iirc. But the reason is you first must be a cardinal (which is a higher rank than an Arch Bishop) and then win the majority of votes from the other cardinals, who are also running.

So there's that. I would expect that one reason Benedict is resigning is to have a say in choosing his successor, and to keep out refrmist elements.

Funny though I'd heard popes could not resign, they were chosen by God to carry their mission for life.

**Alfndrate**

reds8n wrote:
.... does the Papacy come with a good pension scheme ?

Idk, I always thought the pension plan was a 1 way trip to Heaven, with no possibility of going to Hell. I mean considering that the Pope has some of the best medical care around, it would seem silly to just give that up.

Though, I wonder what seems to be challenging his faith, which was stated as one of the reasons (besides health) for him stepping down.

And K_K, I don't think Benedict will get much say in his successor, since they're holding another Conclave to elect a new one in March, unless of course he is stepping down and becoming a Cardinal again.

**MeanGreenStompa**

I'm going to guess he's got something. They cited health and I wonder if it's Alzheimer's? If he's losing his mind he wouldn't be able to effectively be the head of the church.

**reds8n**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'm going to guess he's got something.

Like a better offer ?

You'd need to be a miracle worker for them to win anything now so...

**Ouze**

My money is evenly split between "he's got Alzheimer's" as MGS speculated, or there is a report coming out imminently shows he has even greater culpability in covering up child molestation then was previously known; or something in that vein.

in order to govern the bark of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary,

Either he's alluding for the former, or he's just being poetic.

**punkow**

reds8n wrote:

Dear Brothers,

I have convoked you to this Consistory, not only for the three canonizations, but also to communicate to you a decision of great importance for the life of the Church. After having repeatedly examined my conscience before God, I have come to the certainty that my strengths, due to an advanced age, are no longer suited to an adequate exercise of the Petrine ministry. I am well aware that this ministry, due to its essential spiritual nature, must be carried out not only with words and deeds, but no less with prayer and suffering. However, in today’s world, subject to so many rapid changes and shaken by questions of deep relevance for the life of faith, in order to govern the bark of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary, strength which in the last few months, has deteriorated in me to the extent that I have had to recognize my incapacity to adequately fulfill the ministry entrusted to me. For this reason, and well aware of the seriousness of this act, with full freedom I declare that I renounce the ministry of Bishop of Rome, Successor of Saint Peter, entrusted to me by the Cardinals on 19 April 2005, in such a way, that as from 28 February 2013, at 20:00 hours, the See of Rome, the See of Saint Peter, will be vacant and a Conclave to elect the new Supreme Pontiff will have to be convoked by those whose competence it is.

Dear Brothers, I thank you most sincerely for all the love and work with which you have supported me in my ministry and I ask pardon for all my defects. And now, let us entrust the Holy Church to the care of Our Supreme Pastor, Our Lord Jesus Christ, and implore his holy Mother Mary, so that she may assist the Cardinal Fathers with her maternal solicitude, in electing a new Supreme Pontiff. With regard to myself, I wish to also devotedly serve the Holy Church of God in the future through a life dedicated to prayer.

From the Vatican, 10 February 2013

BENEDICTUS PP XVI

.... does the Papacy come with a good pension scheme ?

They say he's going to retire in Castel Sant'Angelo in a monastery

**reds8n**

maybe he just wants to spend more time with the wife and ki.d..s... oh, hang on....

**Alfndrate**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'm going to guess he's got something. They cited health and I wonder if it's Alzheimer's? If he's losing his mind he wouldn't be able to effectively be the head of the church.

This, I mean we can discover it, before it really starts to hit you, I would be surprised if it wasn't this.

**Kid_Kyoto**

Ouze wrote:
My money is evenly split between "he's got Alzheimer's" as MGS speculated, or there is a report coming out imminently shows he has even greater culpability in covering up child molestation then was previously known; or something in that vein.

in order to govern the bark of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary,
Either he's alluding for the former, or he's just being poetic.

Even greater? From what I read he basically ordered a world wide cover up and told churches not to cooperate with investigators.

Seriously he was right in the center.

**Steve steveson**

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Ouze wrote:
My money is evenly split between "he's got Alzheimer's" as MGS speculated, or there is a report coming out imminently shows he has even greater culpability in covering up child molestation then was previously known; or something in that vein.

in order to govern the bark of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary,
Either he's alluding for the former, or he's just being poetic.

Even greater? From what I read he basically ordered a world wide cover up and told churches not to cooperate with investigators.

Seriously he was right in the center.

No, not at all. Rome has been somewhat silent on the matter and lacking in the forthright confrontation of the matter that they probably should have had. Sucessive Irish Cardinals, Arch Bishops and Irish Politicians have tried to cover things up, and Bishops throughout the world have done much the same, however there actions have been much the same as those of the BBC, hospitals and other organisations have with the Jimmy Savile (and others) scandle that is now ongoing. There has, in the past, been a tendancy to ignore children and so undue trust in authority. The Catholic church is far from being the only group to have acted in this way. The problem is that they have failed to truly address the past.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Jayce_The_Ace wrote:
What always puzzles me, is why every Pope they elect always has 'one foot in the grave' already - Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?

They don't. There was a feeling that he was elected because JP was in the post for so long they should elect someone older this time, but someone who was not going to be a reformer. Most likely we will see someone younger and a bit more radical this time. Hopefully Cardinal Peter Turkson as the odds sugest. A black Pope and an African with real power in the west would be a good thing IMO.

**Frazzled**

They need a fire breathing South American Pope.

**Manchu**

Huffy wrote:
Interesting, I wonder what the reasoning is behind this

He has been in increasingly poor health since his 80th birthday.

Jayce_The_Ace wrote:
Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?

God forbid. Long reigns are not necessarily good ones.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Funny though I'd heard popes could not resign, they were chosen by God to carry their mission for life.

You have not been listening. This has happened before. And Ratzinger himself has talked about it for many years.

LuciusAR wrote:
I think it’s rather refreshing to see a Pope resign over his health.

This is also my first reaction. But we'll have to see what the implications are.

Frazzled wrote:
They need a fire breathing South American Pope.

I sincerely hope not. It is generally thought that any pope from Latin America or Africa would be ultra-conservative by First World standards.

**LordofHats**

Benny also has a bit of an image problem from what I can tell. Even setting the issue of health aside, the majority of Catholics don't seem to be conservative (Machu knows lots about this so maybe we'll get an analysis about Ben's current political popularity among the Church).

He gets blamed for covering up child abuse scandals, for being out of touch, for being too old. From my limited observation he's just not the most popular guy but idk.

**Frazzled**

Manchu wrote:
Huffy wrote:
Interesting, I wonder what the reasoning is behind this
He has been in increasingly poor health since his 80th birthday.
Jayce_The_Ace wrote:
Couldn't they give the job to someone a wee bit younger this time?
God forbid. Long reigns are not necessarily good ones.
Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Funny though I'd heard popes could not resign, they were chosen by God to carry their mission for life.
You have not been listening. This has happened before. And Ratzinger himself has talked about it for many years.
LuciusAR wrote:
I think it’s rather refreshing to see a Pope resign over his health.
This is also my first reaction. But we'll have to see what the implications are.
Frazzled wrote:
They need a fire breathing South American Pope.
I sincerely hope not. It is generally thought that any pope from Latin America or Africa would be ultra-conservative by First World standards.

Actually Catholic priests are often known for being quite leftist in Latin American, some outright communist.

**whembly**

Just no one from the US... please.

**kronk**

Alfndrate wrote:
MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'm going to guess he's got something. They cited health and I wonder if it's Alzheimer's? If he's losing his mind he wouldn't be able to effectively be the head of the church.

This, I mean we can discover it, before it really starts to hit you, I would be surprised if it wasn't this.

Sadly, I think MGS is going to be proven correctly. From all accounts, Benedict was the conservative choice, and I was disappointed. I think it's time the church took a hard look at letting women in the clergy, or expanding the roles of nuns.

When I was growing up, I recall when our priest was out sick, and the local convent lent two nuns to administer mass. It was confusing at first, but it worked out just fine. No reason that they can't have more of a role in sermons and so on...

**Frazzled**

Join the Episcopal Church. We allow de wimminz, and our booze is better!

**punkow**

Frazzled wrote:
Manchu wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
They need a fire breathing South American Pope.
I sincerely hope not. It is generally thought that any pope from Latin America or Africa would be ultra-conservative by First World standards.

Actually Catholic priests are often known for being quite leftist in Latin American, some outright communist.

Well, an african Pope would be a disaster... they're incredibly conservative... about Latin America... urhmm, I know priests tend to be left-leaning there but I don't know if you can tell the same for the Ecclesiastic Hierarchy

**kronk**

Frazzled wrote:
Join the Episcopal Church. We allow de wimminz, and our booze is better!

I helped those same nuns from my story gather pears to make pear wine.

Your booze is not better!

They were also here from Italy and made lasagna which they sent home with me on occasion. Home made lasagna from Italian nuns whose only vices are the occasional pear wine and homemade lasagna...

**Frazzled**

kronk wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
Join the Episcopal Church. We allow de wimminz, and our booze is better!

I helped those same nuns from my story gather pears to make pear wine.

Your booze is not better!

They were also here from Italy and made lasagna which they sent home with me on occasion. Home made lasagna from Italian nuns whose only vices are the occasional pear wine and homemade lasagna...

Bring them along too. They will be assimila...er they can be priests! We will add their pear wine and lasagna distinctiveness to our own.
Barbeque, whisky, pear wine, and lasagna, now its starting to be a dinner!

**rubiksnoob**

Why did you get the nice Italian nuns, and the rest of us just get mean old ladies who took cruel pleasure in beating small children with rulers?