Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Yup, the ability to cause fear under certain circumstances doesn't make you immune to fear all time, if that was the case, things like say the scarecrow banner would make you immune to fear as well, or if there is any spell that gives a target unit fear then your whole army would be immune to fear, since they might get it eventually. Just like eventually a unit with flaming attacks might be in combat with a warbeast

 Lord Yayula wrote:
the ability to cause fear under certain circumstances doesn't make you immune to fear all time

This is posted often enough, but why?

I had read it that way repeatedly until I actually read the text instead of what I assumed was there.

How am I mis-reading?

Does the unit cause Fear?
Yes, in Cavalry, Chariots, and Warbeasts.

People keep posting that it says:
Does the unit NOT cause Fear?
Correct, the unit does not cause fear in Infantry, war machines, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, goblins fear elves.
And there is no gerund , it isn't are they causing fear

 kirsanth wrote:

 Lord Yayula wrote:
the ability to cause fear under certain circumstances doesn't make you immune to fear all time

This is posted often enough, but why?

I had read it that way repeatedly until I actually read the text instead of what I assumed was there.

How am I mis-reading?

Does the unit cause Fear?
Yes, in Cavalry, Chariots, and Warbeasts.

People keep posting that it says:
Does the unit NOT cause Fear?
Correct, the unit does not cause fear in Infantry, war machines, etc.

Well if you play it that way, then scarecrow banner also makes you immune to fear, if your army has a fire wizard with flaming sword of rhuin then all your army is immune to fear, because

Does the unit cause Fear?
Yes, in Cavalry, Chariots and Warbeasts once it get flaming sword of rhuin.

Samw would apply to a lore of beasts wizard

Does the wazard causes Fear?
Yes, once he casts Transformation of Kadon

And the list can go on, they all have in common that they need an specific circumstance to cause fear.

The bit about wizards is a lark and as relevant as terrain.

Editing to add:
As for the banner, sure. That is indeed the way the actual rules are written.

Does the unit have the Fear USR in its profile?

HoverBoy wrote:Does the unit have the Fear USR in its profile?

kirsanth wrote:

Camarodragon wrote:
I prefer the FAQ:

Q: Do all forms of Flaming Attacks cause Fear in war beasts,
cavalry and chariots? (p69)
A: Yes, any model that has a Flaming Attack will cause Fear.
This includes unit upgrades, models that only have ranged
flaming attacks and even Wizards with spells that cause
Flaming Attacks.

Sure.
A: Yes, any model that has a Flaming Attack will cause Fear.
Note the full stop.

The idea that the unit does not cause fear if the its opponent is not subject to that fear is wrong.

 kirsanth wrote:

Your wording is confusing you since it does not match the rules.

It does not ask if the target of the Fear is subject to its effects, merely that the unit in question causes Fear - without the assumed stipulation that the fear needs to affect its current target. The rules do not back that assumption anywhere I have read.

Oh, I sense a one-liner accusation contest coming! Wait: "You apparently need to re-read the rules!

With that sillyness out of the way: "Subject to its effect" is irrelevant. You need to look at the source. What can the fear causer do? Cause fear. What can the fear causer(A, B etc) do? Cause fear in A, B etc. At no point does an ability or disadvantage or USR of the target come into play.

Your unit does not cause fear - that is an assumed stipulation not backed up by anything I've read.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 kirsanth wrote:

 Lord Yayula wrote:
the ability to cause fear under certain circumstances doesn't make you immune to fear all time

This is posted often enough, but why?

Because it is a correct interpretation.

How am I mis-reading?

Does the unit cause Fear?
Yes, in Cavalry, Chariots, and Warbeasts.

I don't think your misreading. You're misinterpreting. You claim that cause fear (sometimes) = cause fear (always). That's logically untrue. While I realize the problems that exist between logic, RAW, YMTC and such, you cannot base an interpretation on a logically untrue conclusion. One situation is defined, limited, the other is undefined, unlimited. They're different, not the same.

An example:
1) X cause fear in (A, B). That's our rule. It is structurally the same as X drinks (A, B), say, Coke and water.

You conclude from 1) that X cause fear (always). This is structurally the same as X drinks (everything). The latter however simply does not follow from that single premise. In other words: Just because someone drinks Coke and water, it does not follow he drinks beer and wine.

Just because someone causes fear in warbeasts does not mean he causes fear in infantry.

And if you reply that it doesn't say we have to use logic anywhere you've read, I'll reply that the rules don't specify a gerund.

Units with flaming attacks always cause fear.
Not every unit is subject to that fear.

You are stating flaming attacks work the way the elf/goblin interaction does but that is not the case.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mike der Ritter wrote:
Oh, I sense a one-liner accusation contest coming! Wait: "You apparently need to re-read the rules!

I asked how I was mis-reading.

 Mike der Ritter wrote:
You claim that cause fear (sometimes) = cause fear (always).

No. I am stating the rules do not specify, and since they do not say the unit IS causing or does cause fear in its target, you are the one adding words in your interpretation.


Editing to add:
I you want to be snarky, I would rather be wrong as I play Tomb Kings and this "interpretation" is only bad for me.