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 Beaviz81 wrote:
Ogryn is a human mutation Melissia, it might even been able to breed with a human, same with Ratlings.

Oh Hive Mind I did not need that mental image.

Its homo sapiens sapiens (regular human), homo sapiens superior (Space Marine), homo sapiens minimalis (ratlings) and homo sapiens gigantus (ogryns). All are still humans and maybe able to breed with eachother.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Orgryn-Ratling-porn must be for very specially interested people like Kain.

Ratlings mate with base-stock humans all the time, usually by paying for it. Whether they are capable of producing offspring is unknown.

 Melissia wrote:
This would not be the case in a society such as Cadia, whose recruitment rate and birthrate are synonymous, and whose lifelong training makes your training as a Marine look like an enjoyable vacation.

So you're saying Cadian humans are biologically different from, you know, Earth humans?

Interesting.

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Its homo sapiens sapiens (regular human), homo sapiens superior (Space Marine), homo sapiens minimalis (ratlings) and homo sapiens gigantus (ogryns). All are still humans and maybe able to breed with eachother.

They likely can. The only I mentioned that I don't think can do it is the Space Marines because well they spit acid and their blood is poison.

 Psienesis wrote:

 Seaward wrote:

Psienesis wrote:Until we do. Most SEALs aren't absolutely totally-ripped guys anyway. They tend to be on the shorter side, athletic of course, but you'd never mistake one for a Space Marine. Becoming a SEAL is more about willpower than anything, really, from everything I've been told by former SEALs.

Yeah. I've met a lot of "former SEALs" in bars, too. It's pretty strange that none of them can remember which BUD/S class they were.

You make this too easy.

https://www.sealswcc.com/forums/showthread.php?582-What-weight-to-shoot-for
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2010/01/29/4377165-a-typical-seal-think-007-not-rambo?lite
http://abcnews.go.com/US/navy-seal-team-profile-elite-force/story?id=15438660#.UX_7iko8_2k

Make what too easy? You show up to BUD/S in the best shape of your life, or you don't make it through. That's all there is to it. It doesn't mean bulked out like a power lifter, it means...in the best shape of your life.

Saying, "It's more willpower than anything!" is misleading as gak, dude. I'd love to see some fatasses try to make it through log PT with willpower.

 Seaward wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
This would not be the case in a society such as Cadia, whose recruitment rate and birthrate are synonymous, and whose lifelong training makes your training as a Marine look like an enjoyable vacation.

So you're saying Cadian humans are biologically different from, you know, Earth humans?

Interesting.

Given at least ten thousand years for genetic drift to take place they probably are subtly different. They're already predisposed to be very tall and pale.

 Kain wrote:
Given at least ten thousand years for genetic drift to take place they probably are subtly different. They're already predisposed to be very tall and pale.

I meant her implication that there would no longer be a difference between male and female muscular/skeletal structures.

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Given at least ten thousand years for genetic drift to take place they probably are subtly different. They're already predisposed to be very tall and pale.

I meant her implication that there would no longer be a difference between male and female muscular/skeletal structures.

Is there any real point in how strong you are when the average enemy is likely hopped up on warp power or is an alien who can implode your skull with a harsh tap? The Imperium is playing a numbers game and not using 50% of it's population as more cannon fodder would be incredibly stupid.

 Kain wrote:

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Ogryn is a human mutation Melissia, it might even been able to breed with a human, same with Ratlings.

Oh Hive Mind I did not need that mental image.

Ogryns might have that big' ol .. .. some chix might be into that.... jus' sayin'....

I think Starship Troopers got in some part right cuz' a dude and a chick can pull a trigger just as fast, call in artillery coordinates just as quick ..or mercy forbid get slashed apart ...equally quickly...

RancidHate wrote:

 Kain wrote:

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Ogryn is a human mutation Melissia, it might even been able to breed with a human, same with Ratlings.

Oh Hive Mind I did not need that mental image.

Ogryns might have that big' ol .. .. some chix might be into that.... jus' sayin'....

If they enjoy now having a cloaca...

 Seaward wrote:
So you're saying Cadian humans are biologically different from, you know, Earth humans?

No, I'm pointing out your ignorance in not understanding the impact on culture and upbringing on the human body.

 Kain wrote:
Is there any real point in how strong you are when the average enemy is likely hopped up on warp power or is an alien who can implode your skull with a harsh tap? The Imperium is playing a numbers game and not using 50% of it's population as more cannon fodder would be incredibly stupid.

I don't think anyone's arguing that the Imperium doesn't use female soldiers. They're present in fluff.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Melissia wrote:
No, I'm pointing out your an ignoramus in not understanding the impact on culture and upbringing on the human body.

You're. It's the contraction of "you are." I love irony, though, so I'll let it slide.

And there's a very real difference in muscular distribution between males and females. I'm sorry if that offends you, but it's tough to argue with biology.

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Is there any real point in how strong you are when the average enemy is likely hopped up on warp power or is an alien who can implode your skull with a harsh tap? The Imperium is playing a numbers game and not using 50% of it's population as more cannon fodder would be incredibly stupid.

I don't think anyone's arguing that the Imperium doesn't use female soldiers. They're present in fluff.

You seem to be of the opinion that the Imperium is foolish for more or less doubling it's supply of the Emperor's gloried bullet sponges. I mean, this government considers throwing children onto the battlefield to be a valid tactic when they're running low on adults. Using women on the frontlines and as special forces is perfectly valid considering their situation. They can't afford to discriminate for cannon fodder soldiers.

 Seaward wrote:
it's tough to argue with biology.

You're not using biology to argue in the first place.

 Kain wrote:
You seem to be of the opinion that the Imperium is foolish for more or less doubling it's supply of the Emperor's gloried bullet sponges.

Nah, I'm of the opinion that the people getting butthurt over GW choosing not to increase its production costs by creating female models for a game that sells overwhelmingly to males are foolish.

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
You seem to be of the opinion that the Imperium is foolish for more or less doubling it's supply of the Emperor's gloried bullet sponges.

Nah, I'm of the opinion that the people getting butthurt over GW choosing not to increase its production costs by creating female models for a game that sells overwhelmingly to males are foolish.

Given that the female geek demographic is quite large now (if typically keeping to things like Homestuck and Doctor Who over stuff like 40k and Command and Conquer) not trying to hook some of them in would be a silly thing from a business perspective. Especially since GW's current model is focused on getting new members into the community over retaining older ones, a wise move given that Hasbro whose Transformer line appeals to a very similar demographic, has found that the "old vet" market will at best make up a fifth of their profits while focusing on getting new people (children and women) interested would and did increase their bottom line.

Given that there's not that much difference between the collectible toy market and the miniature gaming market in terms of demographic I think GW is going to largely try and imitate Hasbro. So expect more blatant overtures to try and attract teens and girls even if it means losing a few of the college age and above old guard.

 Kain wrote:
Given that the female geek demographic is quite large now (if typically keeping to things like Homestuck and Doctor Who over stuff like 40k and Command and Conquer) not trying to hook some of them in would be a silly thing from a business perspective. Especially since GW's current model is focused on getting new members into the community over retaining older ones, a wise move given that Hasbro whose Transformer line appeals to a very similar demographic, has found that the "old vet" market will at best make up a fifth of their profits while focusing on getting new people (children and women) interested would and did increase their bottom line.

Given that there's not that much difference between the collectible toy market and the miniature gaming market in terms of demographic I think GW is going to largely try and imitate Hasbro. So expect more blatant overtures to try and attract teens and girls even if it means losing a few of the college age and above old guard.

How many tabletop wargames does Hasbro produce, out of curiosity?

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Given that the female geek demographic is quite large now (if typically keeping to things like Homestuck and Doctor Who over stuff like 40k and Command and Conquer) not trying to hook some of them in would be a silly thing from a business perspective. Especially since GW's current model is focused on getting new members into the community over retaining older ones, a wise move given that Hasbro whose Transformer line appeals to a very similar demographic, has found that the "old vet" market will at best make up a fifth of their profits while focusing on getting new people (children and women) interested would and did increase their bottom line.

Given that there's not that much difference between the collectible toy market and the miniature gaming market in terms of demographic I think GW is going to largely try and imitate Hasbro. So expect more blatant overtures to try and attract teens and girls even if it means losing a few of the college age and above old guard.

How many tabletop wargames does Hasbro produce, out of curiosity?

Hasbro owns WOTC and all that entails.

And as someone who's been part of both the 40k and Transformers fanbase, I'd say that we're largely identical. It's just that they obsess over giant shapeshifting space robots and we obsess over ultraviolent catholic space nazis/blue utilitarianists/space elves/green soccer hooligan/dinosaur locusts/sci-fi mummies/lovecraftian satanists. And instead of overpriced 28mm plastic models we lovingly detail and collect they have variable sized overpriced plastic action figures they also kitbash a lot.

We have much in common, although the Transformers fandom is a hell of a lot bigger.

 Kain wrote:
Hasbro owns WOTC and all that entails.

And as someone who's been part of both the 40k and Transformers fanbase, I'd say that we're largely identical. It's just that they obsess over giant shapeshifting space robots and we obsess over ultraviolent catholic space nazis/blue utilitarianists/space elves/green soccer hooligan/dinosaur locusts/sci-fi mummies/lovecraftian satanists.

I'm not that familiar with WOTC. Do they publish any tabletop wargames?

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Hasbro owns WOTC and all that entails.

And as someone who's been part of both the 40k and Transformers fanbase, I'd say that we're largely identical. It's just that they obsess over giant shapeshifting space robots and we obsess over ultraviolent catholic space nazis/blue utilitarianists/space elves/green soccer hooligan/dinosaur locusts/sci-fi mummies/lovecraftian satanists.

I'm not that familiar with WOTC. Do they publish any tabletop wargames?

There's been several D&D miniature wargames over the years. I actually own a few of the minis out of my nostalgic love of Greyhawk. The current edition is called Warband I believe.

Hasbro's Avalon Hill subsidiary is in many ways a bigger name in wargaming in the US than Games Workshop is, although when Hasbro acquired it it sold off a few of its titles, such as various civil war and historical games as well as Advanced Squad Leader.

I have a few of Hasbro's games from before I ever heard of Games Workshop actually, like Axis and Allies.

Most of them are not as involved as GW's own "paint your own minis" style wargame, mind you.

 Melissia wrote:
Hasbro's Avalon Hill subsidiary is in many ways a bigger name in wargaming in the US than Games Workshop is, although when Hasbro acquired it it sold off a few of its titles, such as various civil war and historical games as well as Advanced Squad Leader.

I have a few of Hasbro's games from before I ever heard of Games Workshop actually, like Axis and Allies.

Most of them are not as involved as GW's own "paint your own minis" style wargame, mind you.

I remember the Axis and Allies video game.

I was...

...Disappointed...

 Seaward wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:

 Seaward wrote:

Psienesis wrote:Until we do. Most SEALs aren't absolutely totally-ripped guys anyway. They tend to be on the shorter side, athletic of course, but you'd never mistake one for a Space Marine. Becoming a SEAL is more about willpower than anything, really, from everything I've been told by former SEALs.

Yeah. I've met a lot of "former SEALs" in bars, too. It's pretty strange that none of them can remember which BUD/S class they were.

You make this too easy.

https://www.sealswcc.com/forums/showthread.php?582-What-weight-to-shoot-for
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2010/01/29/4377165-a-typical-seal-think-007-not-rambo?lite
http://abcnews.go.com/US/navy-seal-team-profile-elite-force/story?id=15438660#.UX_7iko8_2k

Make what too easy? You show up to BUD/S in the best shape of your life, or you don't make it through. That's all there is to it. It doesn't mean bulked out like a power lifter, it means...in the best shape of your life.

Saying, "It's more willpower than anything!" is misleading as gak, dude. I'd love to see some fatasses try to make it through log PT with willpower.

If you're going to start that gak, make sure you read and comprehend my entire OP.

Here, it's quoted up above for you, but let me repeat it for you, with added emphasis, in the event that you're simple:

"Most SEALs aren't absolutely totally-ripped guys anyway. They tend to be on the shorter side, athletic of course, but you'd never mistake one for a Space Marine."

Here, here's a freebie:

Navy.com wrote:Direct action warfare. Special reconnaissance. Counterterrorism. Foreign internal defense. When there’s nowhere else to turn, Navy SEALs are in their element. Achieving the impossible by way of conditioned response, sheer willpower and absolute dedication to their training, their missions and their fellow spec ops team members.

...those are all aspects of willpower and mental fortitude. All the physical fitness in the world won't make a difference if you're not mentally fit enough to push through it.

75-90% of all SEAL applicants fail the BUD/S training.

The ones who succeed are NOT the most physically fit, the strongest, the fastest, or what have you. The ones who succeed are simply those who refuse to give up no matter what.

Indeed, you have Harvard grad students and the like amongst the SEAL teams.

Besides, the SEALs aren't even the most elite force in the US military.

That'd be Delta force.

*puts on fireproof suit*

Come at me.

 Kain wrote:
Besides, the SEALs aren't even the most elite force in the US military.

That'd be Delta force.

*puts on fireproof suit*

Come at me.

They're ACE or something now. The Chuck Norris association got old even before Chuck Norris jokes.

 Seaward wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Besides, the SEALs aren't even the most elite force in the US military.

That'd be Delta force.

*puts on fireproof suit*

Come at me.

They're ACE or something now. The Chuck Norris association got old even before Chuck Norris jokes.

And one step above them is the most lethal operatives America has ever produced...the mighty...indomitable...

....SAD...

Wait, why are you laughing?

 Seaward wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
This would not be the case in a society such as Cadia, whose recruitment rate and birthrate are synonymous, and whose lifelong training makes your training as a Marine look like an enjoyable vacation.

So you're saying Cadian humans are biologically different from, you know, Earth humans?

Interesting.

38,000 years is enough for moderate evolution in humans...