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Although it is common sense to know banning all guns would not stop the few from shooting, but can you not agree that it would certainly reduce the amount of gun related crime in America?

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Although it is common sense to know banning all guns would not stop the few from shooting, but can you not agree that it would certainly reduce the amount of gun related crime in America?

Just walk away man. If you really want to read the same arguments again just use the search button. Seriously.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Although it is common sense to know banning all guns would not stop the few from shooting, but can you not agree that it would certainly reduce the amount of gun related crime in America?

Gun crime? Probably.

Violent crime or just crime? Nah

If a bad guy with a gun will just become a bad guy with a knife, why take the gun away from the good guy?

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Well I guess you would have to call me a Facist Frazzled because in my opinion gun laws should be changed but thats why its called an opinion.

Rather than hearing peoples (preferably from Americans) opinions around gun laws, most responses have been about 'beating this topic to death' or calling this a trolly thread so it seems we cant have a mature conversation so might aswell delete this thread.

How about this.

Would you ever consider changing your views on gun control to match some of those who are opposite of you?

Only if there truly was evidence that owning guns did more good but in my opinion I cannot agree with something that enables people to do bad things but it is always nice to hear others opinion as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Although it is common sense to know banning all guns would not stop the few from shooting, but can you not agree that it would certainly reduce the amount of gun related crime in America?

Gun crime? Probably.

Violent crime or just crime? Nah

If a bad guy with a gun will just become a bad guy with a knife, why take the gun away from the good guy?

But is not taking away the gun a step in the right direction?

 unmercifulconker wrote:

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Well I guess you would have to call me a Facist Frazzled because in my opinion gun laws should be changed but thats why its called an opinion.

Rather than hearing peoples (preferably from Americans) opinions around gun laws, most responses have been about 'beating this topic to death' or calling this a trolly thread so it seems we cant have a mature conversation so might aswell delete this thread.

How about this.

Would you ever consider changing your views on gun control to match some of those who are opposite of you?

Only if there truly was evidence that owning guns did more good but in my opinion I cannot agree with something that enables people to do bad things but it is always nice to hear others opinion as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Although it is common sense to know banning all guns would not stop the few from shooting, but can you not agree that it would certainly reduce the amount of gun related crime in America?

Gun crime? Probably.

Violent crime or just crime? Nah

If a bad guy with a gun will just become a bad guy with a knife, why take the gun away from the good guy?

But is not taking away the gun a step in the right direction?

You can take the venom out of a snake but it still wants to bite.

Not the best analogy, but my point is is that people are committing these crimes for a reason. They don't pick up a gun and gain the mind of a criminal.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
in my opinion I cannot agree with something that enables people to do bad things

Right, unless there is a countervailing good. What you're not getting, what you are coming off as attacking, is that there are many people in the country you are talking about who see the countervailing good in cultural and political terms. You are dismissing their culture because, from your perspective (from a different place, with different values) it might as well not exist. To us, you sound like "you lot should wise up and follow our example if you don't want to live in pandemonium." I can tell you, it doesn't feel like we live in pandemonium actually -- or at least not because of private ownership of firearms.

 Medium of Death wrote:
I get that it's legal to carry guns, but presumably this guy was carrying it in a way to make it incredibly obvious/attract attention to himself?

So if it's legal to carry guns, whats the concealed carry permit I've heard about? Does that mean you can show that you are carrying normally, but you can't hide the weapon upon your person unless you have a permit?

I'm not judging, just genuinely curious.

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:


The conceal carry permit allows you to conceal a firearm on your person. Without this, you are restricted to keeping it outside of clothing / visible to people.

 Frazzled wrote:


Some states have both. It used to be more difficult to have a CHL then an OC, as it was viewed as underhanded. Later the CHL was viewed as more civilized and less confrontational.

Again its context. Most OC you see (legally) is in rural areas.

Cheers gents. So this guy was just going against a social norm and caused a bit of a disturbance because people aren't really used to seeing this thing in the cities?

Do you need to have a proper holster for Open Carry, or can you just hold the gun?

Just holding the gun could be very problematic -- it would likely rise to a criminal charge of brandishing.

I believe (Not 100%) that if you are carrying it in your hand that is considered brandishing, but that might be reserved for some other activity. However if it is holstered and visible, as long as you are legally allowed to own a firearm (No felony convictions, other reasons) it shouldn't be an issue.

Edit: This also applies to vehicles. Because I do not have a CC permit, I can't keep a loaded gun concealed in my car. Although I think the trunk is fine, I keep it unloaded while transporting just to be safe.

 Medium of Death wrote:

Cheers gents. So this guy was just going against a social norm and caused a bit of a disturbance because people aren't really used to seeing this thing in the cities?

Do you need to have a proper holster for Open Carry, or can you just hold the gun?

Proper Holster or sling normally. I don't believe you can free carry (unsupported/'tucked') in any states (in the northeast, at least).

Never can you openly handle a weapon without good cause. That'll get you arrested.

 Frazzled wrote:
1. In the country it used to be damn common to see people wandering around with long guns and pistols.

Sure, but now that we've got the native attacks on the covered wagon situation pretty well under control, we should try addressing the problems of the world as it is, not as it was 150 years ago.

I think people who open carry are trying to get exactly the sort of attention that they so often get. Furthermore, a police officer has every right to stop someone wearing a pistol once they have gotten calls, and hence probably cause, on it. To not do so would be dereliction, frankly.

 Manchu wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
in my opinion I cannot agree with something that enables people to do bad things

Right, unless there is a countervailing good. What you're not getting, what you are coming off as attacking, is that there are many people in the country you are talking about who see the countervailing good in cultural and political terms. You are dismissing their culture because, from your perspective (from a different place, with different values) it might as well not exist. To us, you sound like "you lot should wise up and follow our example if you don't want to live in pandemonium." I can tell you, it doesn't feel like we live in pandemonium actually -- or at least not because of private ownership of firearms.

The USA has a phenomenal number of gun related crime, that sounds like a major cause for concern.

Why exactly is it your concern?

Like Frazzled said, context is critical and even carrying in your hand would be okay in certain situations. For example, you would be unlikely to be charged with brandishing for carrying your shotgun or rifle in your hand to and from your car from a sporting goods or gun store, or carrying a long gun in a field or on the way to a field or wooded area during hunting season, or to deal with a varmint, as long as you're not handling it in an unsafe manner.

If you walk into a grocery store or a gas station with a long gun in your hand, it's probably going to be a different story.

Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

 Ouze wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
1. In the country it used to be damn common to see people wandering around with long guns and pistols.

Sure, but now that we've got the native attacks on the covered wagon situation pretty well under control, we should try addressing the problems of the world as it is, not as it was 150 years ago.

It's not just about hostile native Americans or other people. There are plenty of valid reasons to be openly carrying a firearm, even in your hands, in rural areas.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

You admitted you didn't know much about American culture, and that was very gracious of you. It was not really necessary however, because we already realized that was the case after reading your first post. This post only reinforces it further.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

Please lay out your exact plan for what we should do.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

Perhaps because we don't think it's an issue.

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

Please lay out your exact plan for what we should do.

In my opinion? Ban em all I say

There are countless videos on YouTube of folks being stopped by the cops while open carrying and generally getting owned. The ones who do it to make a point annoy me, but they're well within their rights.

I don't open carry, I carry concealed. In Virginia, I'm not required to tell a police officer I'm carrying unless I'm directly asked, so the few times I've been pulled over for speeding, I haven't mentioned it, at least in the area where I live, which is very liberal, and thus prone to having anti-gun cops who will flip gak and draw down on you.

I'm not sure what our British friend's attempting to do here. Of course I think the guy should be allowed to walk around with a rifle if he so chooses. Not a choice I'd make personally, but the case law's quite well established.

 gunslingerpro wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

Perhaps because we don't think it's an issue.

Which is why I believe it should be others concerns.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

We are doing something about it. We're having a bunch of politicians argue about it. At some point, we may pass some minor legislation that doesn't address the problem in any meaningful way.

As a non-American, it may seem strange to you, but as a whole my country is totally OK with very high levels of gun violence compared to other first world countries. It's the way we are.

I mean, we may say we're not OK with it, but we certainly don't want to do any of the things that it would take to meaningfully address it. We're as a whole very hypocritical that way, just as in we say we don't like partisan bickering but consistently re-elect politicians who we know full well will do exactly that. That also is just the way we are.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Which is why I believe it should be others concerns.

I don't even know what that means.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
so it seems we cant have a mature conversation so might aswell delete this thread.

You started this thread by calling people that don't agree with you "god dammed nuts", I am curious what your idea of a mature conversation is...

 Seaward wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Which is why I believe it should be others concerns.

I don't even know what that means.

I think he's calling the United States a threat to the world.

 unmercifulconker wrote:

 Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Because America seems to be doing nothing about it

Please lay out your exact plan for what we should do.

In my opinion? Ban em all I say

What a fascinating plan. I'm surprised no one else has suggested it before. I wonder if many people will take issue with their expensive personal property being confiscated by the government? What could go wrong?

Ok ok shall we just leave this here, I will admit my initial post does come off as rather offensive and I was going through a rather rant mode to be honest and it would be pointless editing it now.

So, are these "bash the USA gun nuts" threads going to be a weekly thing now?

 Breotan wrote:
So, are these "bash the USA gun nuts" threads going to be a weekly thing now?

It's us damn gun nuts always looking for a fight!

I am sure there are many topics which repeat themselves on threads but thats life.