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I have a group of scarabs that were attacked with a large blast weapon. The shot was scattered and only hit 2 of my scarab bases. I understand that the attack was instant death. But if there is more wounds then there are models withing the template then do the wounds get transferred to the rest of the unit. thanks.

Yes they do.

Yes, but keep in mind the wounds are doubled after allocation so you would still only lose 2 bases.

 Kevin949 wrote:
Yes, but keep in mind the wounds are doubled after allocation so you would still only lose 2 bases.

That depends on the unit composition.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/497144.page

Sorry for not expounding. Death Reaper is correct, in my opinion. If a unit with the Swarm type and identical saves suffers the wounds, then you will lose four bases in your example. If the unit has mixed saves, then they might only suffer two, depending on the physical disposition of the models.

That being said, the thread Death Reaper has linked to appears to be incredibly divisive on this issue, with some strong opinions on both sides. I recommend at least skimming it so that you know the arguments on either side, and then presenting it to your local group to see how they feel about it.

I also recommend keeping a small list of the grey areas in the rules which will affect your army or list composition, and check ahead of time with any TOs you will be playing under. This would be a perfect issue to put on that list, since both sides have reasonable, lucid arguments. (Rigeld and Death Reaper both make good cases for their points, in particular.) I wager that in any lengthy gaming career, you may run into TOs with vastly differing opinions on this, and you can avoid any unpleasantness by finding out ahead of time how they are going to rule it should work.

Hope that helps, and sorry for the brevity of my first response.

They FAQ'd this for previous editions, why not this one?

Pyrian wrote:
They FAQ'd this for previous editions, why not this one?

or better yet, read through their faq's and make the rule book clearer

 Kevin949 wrote:
Yes, but keep in mind the wounds are doubled after allocation so you would still only lose 2 bases.

that also depends on if you think you can allocate two wounds at the same time as well, in both mixed saves and the method prior to it, models are allocated wounds, one at a time, until they are casualties, allocating more wounds to a model then the # it actually has when other eligible models still left is also an issue with the theory that ID+swarm blast works differently then last edition,

easysauce wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
Yes, but keep in mind the wounds are doubled after allocation so you would still only lose 2 bases.

that also depends on if you think you can allocate two wounds at the same time as well, in both mixed saves and the method prior to it, models are allocated wounds, one at a time, until they are casualties, allocating more wounds to a model then the # it actually has when other eligible models still left is also an issue with the theory that ID+swarm blast works differently then last edition,

Except of course that the doubled wound is never allocated because its never in the wound pool.

rigeld2 wrote:

easysauce wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
Yes, but keep in mind the wounds are doubled after allocation so you would still only lose 2 bases.

that also depends on if you think you can allocate two wounds at the same time as well, in both mixed saves and the method prior to it, models are allocated wounds, one at a time, until they are casualties, allocating more wounds to a model then the # it actually has when other eligible models still left is also an issue with the theory that ID+swarm blast works differently then last edition,

Except of course that the doubled wound is never allocated because its never in the wound pool.

It is when the target unit has the same save, as the wounds are doubled before allocation. (But we do not need to rehash the thread I linked so we can probably drop it for now and wait for an FaQ).

But OP read that 14 page thread and come to a consensus with your group about it. If you are at a tournament ask the TO.

It comes down to when the wounds are doubled. If they are doubled in the wound pool then you are doubling them before allocation. The wounds have to be suffered to be doubled. The previous thread came down to that exact argument. What qualifies suffering the wound?

Seconded..
It really comes down to the timing, which is unclear by the rules.

Luckily for me, all non-swarm-players decided to "do the logical thing" and said that we do not lose double the templates.
They came to that conclusion because they found it 'weird' that doing it any other way would allow templates to kill more bases than it covers.

If you look at my posts in that thread I don't believe it is unclear. It's fairly clear if you look at the wording of abilities.

 Gravmyr wrote:
If you look at my posts in that thread I don't believe it is unclear. It's fairly clear if you look at the wording of abilities.

You must not have read the 14 page thread about it.

It does not matter, allocating and resolving wounds is "always" done the same way. The "Same Save" method is to save time, not a hard and fast difference in the rules.

Even the fast dice insert alludes to this right at the beginning of it.

But it really does not matter, a wound is not suffered until it is allocated and unsaved. A wound caused means nothing in this instance.

Right, and when are wounds unsaved in a same save unit? (Before allocation).

OP. Read the attached thread, it has been very well milled over. Come to a decision before games with your opponents and see how they would like to handle it. Or at a tournament ask a TO.

 DeathReaper wrote:
Right, and when are wounds unsaved in a same save unit? (Before allocation).

OP. Read the attached thread, it has been very well milled over. Come to a decision before games with your opponents and see how they would like to handle it. Or at a tournament ask a TO.

Does not matter...a wound is not suffered until is unsaved AND allocated.

Also I've started posting in the other thread.

My thinking is that, assuming the scarab unit is in open ground - essentially the unsaved wounds get doubled.

So:

2 scarabs out of a unit of 5 get his by a S6 blast.

that's 2 instant death wounds by template which = 4 instant death.
4 bases removed.



BUT - if the 2 bases hit were the only ones visable and they were hit by anythgin other than a barrage weapon then the wounds could only be applied to uits in LOS - so only 2 bases woudl be removed.

Let's not have a discussion in two threads at once.