Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello,

The only hobby stores in my area are Hobby Lobby and Michaels. I don't have many options for plastic cement.

What are the differences between the Testors plastic cements: red, black, and glass bottle?

you can always order it from Amazon

Amazon doesn't have a large selection of plastic cement available for prime shipping.

I drive by Hobby Lobby almost every day so I'd rather just get it there.

Great stuff.

Like really great, of all the stuff I picked up at hobby lobby when getting into warhammer this little bottle of glue served me the best.

I prefer the red label stuff in the triangle bottle listed above.

It is all crap. Use super glue.

Red label liquid is suitable for polystyrene, ABS, acylic and a few other plastics (believe it works on PVC to some extent).

The blue label linked to above is a kinder, gentler solvent (I believe Testors might use Amyl Acetate in their version...though don't quote me on that). It isn't known to the state of California to cause cancer - so they can sell it with fewer restrictions...and ventilation isn't as important.

Black I believe is just the Model Master brand of the red label liquid. Same chemicals.

The glass bottle should be the same as the red label with a brush applicator as opposed to a needle applicator.

The stronger chemicals in the black and red label products tend to cloud clear plastics (the vapors from the solvent are enough to melt a bit of the plastic). The blue label with the kinder, gentler chemicals is generally safe with clear plastics like canopies...though if you dump the stuff on, you will have problems all the same.

You generally have a longer working time with red/black. They melt more of the plastic - so if you need to wiggle things a bit, that can be handy as well.

If money is tight, use LocTite. it can be applied very accurately, and it will never ever break.

I was using the Testors plastic cement in the black bottle for over a decade, glued together many armies with it and also many model aircraft. Good stuff, only stopped using it because I finally ran out and decided to try a new brand.

Thank you all for the replies. I'll pick up some of the red tomorrow.

Actually according to their website, the black one (model master) comes with a metal applicator, the red one only comes with a plastic applicator. I'd get the one with the metal applicator.

Red:

Precision plastic needle applicator makes easy work of gluing even small intricate detailed parts.

http://www.testors.com/product/136635/3507AT/_/Liquid_Cement_1_Oz.

Black

It has a precision metal applicator needle for detailed work.

http://www.testors.com/product/136942/8872C/_/Liquid_Cement_For_Plastic

I've been using Black and find it to require a longer curing time -- in terms of when you can stop holding the pieces together with your fingers -- than Plastic Zap. I wish Plastic Zap had a metal applicator because the plastic one it comes with is utterly useless.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Actually according to their website, the black one (model master) comes with a metal applicator, the red one only comes with a plastic applicator. I'd get the one with the metal applicator.

Red:

Precision plastic needle applicator makes easy work of gluing even small intricate detailed parts.

http://www.testors.com/product/136635/3507AT/_/Liquid_Cement_1_Oz.

Black

It has a precision metal applicator needle for detailed work.

http://www.testors.com/product/136942/8872C/_/Liquid_Cement_For_Plastic

There you go...couldn't recall off the top of my head if there was any other difference between the red and the black other than the label...and apparently it is the applicator as well.

Metal applicators are much more precise, so it would be worth the extra dollar or whatever it takes to upgrade to the Black Label product. Of course, you could get a bottle and something like a "Touch and flow" applicator...though I can't recall off the top of my head whether or not Hobby Lobby stocks those (I think they do...). I prefer a separate applicator as it is easier to fumble with when you are putting together a lot of little bits.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
If money is tight, use LocTite. it can be applied very accurately, and it will never ever break.

Super glue will break. It will break if you look at it cross eyed. It will break if it gets too cold. It will shatter if it falls to the flow.

Plastic cements will not break. They generally cost the same or less than a name bran superglue - and you don't have to worry about them setting up before you use a whole bottles worth. They weld the two different parts together by dissolving the ends of the polymer chains and holding them in suspension while the two parts are pressed together. When the solvent evaporates - the polymer chains from the two parts intermingle and you have a joint that is nearly as strong as if it were one solid piece of plastic.

While superglue has its place (resin, metal, temporary plastic to plastic joints) - it is far from the best, or even second best choice of adhesives for binding two pieces of polystyrene together.

 Ma55ter_fett wrote:


Great stuff.

Like really great, of all the stuff I picked up at hobby lobby when getting into warhammer this little bottle of glue served me the best.

Ive found the non-toxic stuff to be terrible, either in the tube or bottle.

What you want is the red & white tube or the red version of the bottle pictured above. Just be warned, its a plastic "welder" and anything you assemble with it will be pretty much permanent once its dried.

Terrible in what way?

 Manchu wrote:
Terrible in what way?

Generally speaking, because of the chemicals used - the non-toxic joints are weaker because they do not penetrate as far. I have also found that some of them are actually brittle because they break down the plasticizers in the plastic itself and can result in a joint that doesn't flex but shears off under force.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:
Of course, you could get a bottle and something like a "Touch and flow" applicator...though I can't recall off the top of my head whether or not Hobby Lobby stocks those (I think they do...). I prefer a separate applicator as it is easier to fumble with when you are putting together a lot of little bits

They do... I've been drooling over one for awhile (well, as much as you can drool over glue). Honestly, when I first saw it I didn't even know what it was, I just liked that it had a metal tip with a Luer lock taper. I work in a fake hospital (for lack of a better explanation) and I could easily replace that with a real needle for a matter of cents, if my bosses wanted me to pay for a needle at all.

Right now, I'm using the Model Masters black label (Testors red label, probably) (does anyone else feel like we're discussing whiskey?), and I really like it over GW's plastic glue.

And, SoloFalcon1138, I use LockTite gel for all my magnets, and I really dislike it for gluing models together because of how CA tends to set up for me. If I move a model wrong, and pop off a CA'd on arm, I have to get out my files and clean off as much of the old glue as I can to get a good bond. With plastic glue, if I move a model and break it, even at the glued joint, it's still a plastic-to-plastic connection.

Would love to know specifically why Solo thinks it's "crap."
Some folks do tend to go with CA based glues for all material types specifically because they *want* to be able to break it apart at a later time without as much damage to the model. If you used plastic cement on metal or resin however... I could see why you'd have that impression.

Plastic cements like the above provide a much more permanent bond on plastics.

I've been using the Testors Model Master cement for over ten years and swear by the stuff when I want to create a great bond between plastic that I'm not worried about wanting to separate later.

The thin metal applicator is probably the best I've ever worked with on a bottle. Wish some CA brand had something like it for other materials. If anyone knows of a brand that does please share!

I use the black bottle with the metal applicator tip. Excellent product. Highly recommended. The flow and placement control with the metal needle is much better than any other product I've used.

 ProImperator wrote:


The thin metal applicator is probably the best I've ever worked with on a bottle. Wish some CA brand had something like it for other materials. If anyone knows of a brand that does please share!

Not specifically a needle applicator (as there are problems with thin tubes and superglue...) but I use one of these with my CA adhesives:

http://www.micromark.com/micro-glue-applicator,8048.html

The little clawed end allows a small bead of superglue to be held between the prongs and when you touch it to a surface it flows out just like solvent cements do from the needles by capillary motion. It is enough for the majority of well fitting joints (magnets in properly sized holes) but some larger joints may require you sticking it back in the bottle again. Granted, if the joint is too large - I often will go ahead and use an epoxy instead for the added strength it provides.

Could you use a touch and flow applicator, if the CA was thin enough?

Matney X wrote:
Could you use a touch and flow applicator, if the CA was thin enough?

You can...but then the glue dries, and it is nearly impossible to clean out completely - so over time, the tube gets clogged.

I have used some cheap disposable syringe tips in the past...but, for $6 or so, I have a tool that I can keep using for years.

The problem with applicators with CA is that when you get a thin film of it in the presence of any moisture (the moisture in the ambient air is sufficient), it cures extremely quickly, so if you put it in a thin needle, it'll cure in the needle and if you put it on an applicator, it'll cure on the applicator.

It's one of the things I don't like about CA and why I tend to find plastic cements easier to use (YMMV though, I've been using plastic cements for decades so I'm pretty accustomed to their behaviour which other people complain about). If I am using CA and need to use it finely, I put a blob on a sheet and use a toothpick to transfer it to the model, but you still have to be careful you don't accidentally glue the toothpick to the model or the toothpick to whatever you put the blob on.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:

Matney X wrote:
Could you use a touch and flow applicator, if the CA was thin enough?

You can...but then the glue dries, and it is nearly impossible to clean out completely - so over time, the tube gets clogged.

I have used some cheap disposable syringe tips in the past...but, for $6 or so, I have a tool that I can keep using for years.

And if it gets all gummed up, can you soak the tip in acetone?

One comment regarding CA and drying in the applicator. BSI brand glues are avaialble at almost any model shop (though not usually in craft stores unfortunately) and you can buy replacement caps and nozzles for them for a few quarters. No matter how carefull you are, small diameter applicators (which I prefer) can get clogged, so having the option to just replace the applicator is really nice.

Also, BSI glues are about as cheap (per oz) as hardware store glues.

As to the plastic glue quesiton, I always go with the a watery solvent applied with a brush. The brush gives the best control and keeps you from over applying, and watery glues bond plastic MUCH faster than thicker glues. The testors works well, but I like"Plastruct Plastic Weld" a bit better which Hobby Lobby might have. IIRC Testors brush on is Acetone based and Plastic Weld is MEK based.

It turns out the hobby lobby near me only carries the non-toxic testors.

They do however carry "flex-i-file Touch-N-flow System" I have found good reviews about the applicator tip. How is the plast-i-weld that is included? Have any of you tried it?
http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/touch-n-flow-system-223982/

I'm not familar with the Touch-n-flow system, but the plast-i-weld product looks to be a water thin plastic solvent which is always my preferred product.

I'd definitely prefer it to any non-toxic glue.

If you are assembling plastic models it makes sense to use plastic cement.

Nearly all plastic models are made of polystyrene but some include ABS and you may want to cement Acrylic parts too. The bottled cement is a solvent that dissolves the surface layer of several plastics including polystyrene, ABS and acrylic. When it evaporates, the two surfaces effectively weld together in a very strong bond. This happens very quickly.

Another good thing about the liquid cement is that it will run into dry joints by capillary action, allowing you to easily bond parts by holding the pieces in position and applying a drop of cement by paint brush.

The other type of cement in the bottle with a spout includes a small amount of styrene to make it thicker. This can be a good type of cement to use for general assembly. Personally I used both types depending on circumstances.

Superglue is good for bonding metal or other non-soluble joins (metal to resin, etc) in a hurry, especially if you use accelerator. Greater strength can be had by using epoxy cement, although it takes time to prepare and cure.

Matney X wrote:

 Sean_OBrien wrote:

Matney X wrote:
Could you use a touch and flow applicator, if the CA was thin enough?

You can...but then the glue dries, and it is nearly impossible to clean out completely - so over time, the tube gets clogged.

I have used some cheap disposable syringe tips in the past...but, for $6 or so, I have a tool that I can keep using for years.

And if it gets all gummed up, can you soak the tip in acetone?

Yes.

Smitham wrote:
It turns out the hobby lobby near me only carries the non-toxic testors.

They do however carry "flex-i-file Touch-N-flow System" I have found good reviews about the applicator tip. How is the plast-i-weld that is included? Have any of you tried it?
http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/touch-n-flow-system-223982/

Based on the suitable plastics listed on their website - it will be an MEK based solvent, so one of the better ones IMO (some people fear Methyl Ethyl Death...but it works extremely well, and as long as you don't drink it you are fine with the exposures that exist for hobbyists). The best thing about that though are the applicators, as they allow for pin point control. The capillary applicator even more so than the bottle style that is included (or comes as part of the Testor's Black sets).