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I've got a question: is the multi-tracker built into the Riptide essentially pointless? As an MC it can already shoot two weapons a turn and I can't see a way to give it a third.

It can shoot an emplaced weapon as well as its two guns, I suppose..

I deem it worthless. lol.

Anyone here read Mike Brandt's blog?

He has been running something alone the lines of:
Ethereal
Ethereal

X amount of Kroot

X amount of Pathfinders

3x Riptide - Velocity Tracker, Fusion Blaster, Heavy Burst Cannon

3x Skyray

Apparently he is having quite a bit of success and I imagine he is taking a BUNCH of Kroot since he plays at 1850 and the other various parts of that list dont add up to much.

LValx wrote:
I deem it worthless. lol.

Anyone here read Mike Brandt's blog?

He has been running something alone the lines of:
Ethereal
Ethereal
X amount of Kroot
X amount of Pathfinders
3x Riptide - Velocity Tracker, Fusion Blaster, Heavy Burst Cannon
3x Skyray
Apparently he is having quite a bit of success and I imagine he is taking a BUNCH of Kroot since he plays at 1850 and the other various parts of that list dont add up to much.

I could see that being pretty effective in a meta with few heavy tanks. Against a Dakka Banner DA list though it'd get hammered. Most lists focused on air support or massed infantry would probably get gutted in short order though.

Edit: Looks like he can fit in about 80 Kroot with Sniper Rounds and 30 Pathfinders with 3x Grav Inhibitor Drones, plus 2 Ion Rifles for kicks. At 2000pts.

Meh, GTG with Kroot and those bolters arent nearly effective. I think vs such a list he would just play defensively and use superior amounts of troops to win.

Obviously i'm speaking for him, but I'd imagine that would be how he'd handle that.

AV13 would be tough but he does have 24 Seeker missiles to shoot and he can rend with the Riptides. VS. the most common AV13 vehicle in the game (Anni Barge) this would be effective enough.

I like the list and it comes to show that even a well-respected player like MBrandt thinks that massed Kroot can be done and may in some ways be superior to taking FW.

I would think that 20 snipers for 140 points that can infiltrate and get some first turn shots is a worthwhile investment indeed.

The thing is, Kroot are super cheap, and even if you spam them in large amounts, it still leave points for you to spend on stuff like 3 riptides and etc. You can effecively have a horde army, plus a fair amount of shooting to boot.

120 kroot is barely 720 points. Its 840 if you make the entire lot snipers. Gives you a lot of troops for objectives, plus leaves a lot of points for taking shooty stuff. And 120 kroot isn't that bad at fighting either. They can win through sheer numbers. lol

 lambsandlions wrote:
I really feel that tau is not strong enough to make a change to the meta directly, the way that necrons, IG and CSM can. But Tau has some very good tools to combat a meta. If flyer spam is big in your group then tau can counter it. If sv2's are common tau can counter it. We We do not have raw power but we have almost unmatched adaptability. So we are able to react and change which is good and bad. This means our fine tuned lists will have a clear advantage while our general lists will be a little underpowered. This also means that we can sweep the top decks but may not have the tools to deal with something different. For example we can destroy small elite units and deathstars but doing so leaves us with little volume of fire to take out horde armies. So depending on how similar strategies are we might be very competitive.

On a non-tournament scene level I think our book is fine, it was okay before the update (I know I won most games unless fighting necrons and IG) and our book only made us stronger. so I am pretty happy.

As for actual tactics, I think our HQ choices is really the thing that will open us up and depending on what HQ you pick will determine what tactics you are going to be deploying.

You say you have problems dealing with multiple types of troops and all i can think is take three weapons on your suits. Problem solved lol

 Miri wrote:

 Lotus wrote:

There are 3 enemy squads.
Commander joins Crisis Team 1.
Crisis Team 1 shoots at enemy squad 1. drones are BS5 thanks to the commander. All Suits can fire at whatever they want in reality thanks to target locks, but end result is Enemy team 1 is still alive with ~6-7 markerlight tokens on it.
Crisis Team 2 shoots at Enemy Squad 2. All Crisis Suits in Team 2 use the target lock to shoot at Enemy Squad 1, and expend tokens to boost their BS to 5. Markerlight drones inherit their BS from the Suit with the DC, which is now 5. All members of unit are BS5 now. Enemy team 1 suffers BS5 from crisis team, and enemy Team 2 gets ~5 markerlight tokens placed on it.
Repeat again with Crisis Team 3.
Use remaining markerlight tokens by the rest of your army. You now have army-wide BS5 ignores cover. All markerlight drones can also JSJ and can move and fire.

Devious..

I Never thought of this but thats awesomely harsh shenannigans! And i Absolutely love it lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ooooh!!! Infiltrate your stealth squad with the deepstrike helper and drop your 2-3 crisis squads with commander down and wreck face? Worse come to worst, they dont all come in and you deploy farther back maybe outside of doubletap or melta range so you can JSJ away to saftey easier.

Does it really work this way? I thought drones inherit unmodified BS only. Cos the BS 5 from marketlight is only for shooting at a particular target, not for shooting at everything.

So, they can get BS5 if commander is drone controller, but if its a crisis suit, then its only BS 3. Not sure if +2 BS from using marketlights translates to drones. They will of course benefit if they are shooting the target with the markerlights, but in this case, you are saying that their BS gets upped to 5, and they can then shoot another target which is unmarked. Not sure if it works that way.

Wait you mean someone is NOT using the Ion Accelerator upgrade for 5pts?

What...the...

I dont see any reason to ever take that lame gauss gun. Its range puts the Riptide in range of fast units charging at him (still unlikely but WAY more likely than 72" does) and its considerably less powerful. Better against a hordy army yes since its more shots, but thats what the Pi plate is for + some markerlights so you never scatter/scatter a couple inches.

Also, question, the BRB states that ICs cannot join a unit composed of a single MC. Are people getting around this by buying a couple drones for the Riptide? If so, which drones do you suggest (as i think the Shielded Missile Drones are overpriced but getting anything else would nark your toughness down)

EDIT: Oh i finally got my Dex btw lol

valace2 wrote:
When you have two heldrakes coming in to cook your firewarriors or crisis suits you will want more than just a few Str 7 interceptor shots.

The missiles on the Broadsides are still only Str7.

Pretty simple to beat actually.

S7 has a 5+ to glance/pen, so you only need 9 hits to glance a Helldrake to death. (two from 6 hits, a further hull point from 3.)

When you're shooting 12 S7AP4 Twin linked shots, you hit 6 times, re roll and end up hitting 9 times.

Isn't it a little coinkeydink that that's perfectly acceptable to glance a helldrake to death?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Wait you mean someone is NOT using the Ion Accelerator upgrade for 5pts?

What...the...

I dont see any reason to ever take that lame gauss gun. Its range puts the Riptide in range of fast units charging at him (still unlikely but WAY more likely than 72" does) and its considerably less powerful. Better against a hordy army yes since its more shots, but thats what the Pi plate is for + some markerlights so you never scatter/scatter a couple inches.

Also, question, the BRB states that ICs cannot join a unit composed of a single MC. Are people getting around this by buying a couple drones for the Riptide? If so, which drones do you suggest (as i think the Shielded Missile Drones are overpriced but getting anything else would nark your toughness down)

EDIT: Oh i finally got my Dex btw lol

Pie.

We aren't talking about 3.14159 hits, we're talking about a party pie.

Pie Plate

Pi Plate is not Pie Plate.

I will destroy you.

Anyway, I doubt anyone takes the Riptide with the burst cannon. That's silly. All its other weapons are geared towards anti medium armour and 2+ armour.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Wait you mean someone is NOT using the Ion Accelerator upgrade for 5pts?

What...the...

I dont see any reason to ever take that lame gauss gun. Its range puts the Riptide in range of fast units charging at him (still unlikely but WAY more likely than 72" does) and its considerably less powerful. Better against a hordy army yes since its more shots, but thats what the Pi plate is for + some markerlights so you never scatter/scatter a couple inches.

Also, question, the BRB states that ICs cannot join a unit composed of a single MC. Are people getting around this by buying a couple drones for the Riptide? If so, which drones do you suggest (as i think the Shielded Missile Drones are overpriced but getting anything else would nark your toughness down)

EDIT: Oh i finally got my Dex btw lol

The rules state that an IC can't join a unit that is always (emphasis mine) one model. Since the Riptide has the option of being more than one model it can be joined by an IC, whether or not the Riptide actually buys the drones.

Ahhhh missed that one word. Thank you.

Good, cuz i dont think any drones would be a good idea. Previously mentioned why.

Puscifer wrote:
I've been testing this Farsight Bomb in a number of games to great effect. Not one single unit has stood up to one round of shooting from this squad:

HQ (850pts)

Commander Farsight.

XV8 Crisis Bodyguard Team

Crisis Bodyguard x1.
Command and Control Node, Drone controller, 2x Gun drone, Multi-spectrum Sensor Suite, Flamer Twin linked.
Crisis Bodyguard x6
Burst Cannon, Fusion Blaster, Plasma Rifle, 2x Shield drone.

It's expensive, but it is that effective that you don't need another Crisis unit.

I used this unit to take out a number of units including an Ork Blob, my own Deathwing army in three turns and with Markerlight support a ten man Paladin squad just to name a few.

I've narrowed down my Farsight Bomb to this:

Farsight.
6 x Crisis with Fusion, Plasma and Burst.
1x Crisis with Twin Flamer, Control Node, Sensor Suite, Target Kock, Neuroweb Jammer and Repulsor Field.
7x Shield Drone.
Shadowsun.

Comes in at 910 points.

Very expensive but incredibly destructive. On the turn they come down markerlight the target. If it's a transport destroy thst first with a Railhead or Suicide Crisis Suits first. Then get the Bomb to erase the unit you want dead.

It hasn't failed yet and considering what else I have in my army, it confuses players into shooting the right unit. Do they go after the bomb or the Riptides or the Railhead?

The only unit they can't take out are flyers.

Puscifer wrote:

Puscifer wrote:
I've been testing this Farsight Bomb in a number of games to great effect. Not one single unit has stood up to one round of shooting from this squad:

HQ (850pts)

Commander Farsight.

XV8 Crisis Bodyguard Team

Crisis Bodyguard x1.
Command and Control Node, Drone controller, 2x Gun drone, Multi-spectrum Sensor Suite, Flamer Twin linked.
Crisis Bodyguard x6
Burst Cannon, Fusion Blaster, Plasma Rifle, 2x Shield drone.

It's expensive, but it is that effective that you don't need another Crisis unit.

I used this unit to take out a number of units including an Ork Blob, my own Deathwing army in three turns and with Markerlight support a ten man Paladin squad just to name a few.

I've narrowed down my Farsight Bomb to this:

Farsight.
6 x Crisis with Fusion, Plasma and Burst.
1x Crisis with Twin Flamer, Control Node, Sensor Suite, Target Kock, Neuroweb Jammer and Repulsor Field.
7x Shield Drone.
Shadowsun.

Comes in at 910 points.

Very expensive but incredibly destructive. On the turn they come down markerlight the target. If it's a transport destroy thst first with a Railhead or Suicide Crisis Suits first. Then get the Bomb to erase the unit you want dead.

It hasn't failed yet and considering what else I have in my army, it confuses players into shooting the right unit. Do they go after the bomb or the Riptides or the Railhead?

The only unit they can't take out are flyers.

+1 for having an NSJ.

Puscifer wrote:

I've narrowed down my Farsight Bomb to this:

Farsight.
6 x Crisis with Fusion, Plasma and Burst.
1x Crisis with Twin Flamer, Control Node, Sensor Suite, Target Kock, Neuroweb Jammer and Repulsor Field.
7x Shield Drone.
Shadowsun.

Comes in at 910 points.

Very expensive but incredibly destructive. On the turn they come down markerlight the target. If it's a transport destroy thst first with a Railhead or Suicide Crisis Suits first. Then get the Bomb to erase the unit you want dead.

It hasn't failed yet and considering what else I have in my army, it confuses players into shooting the right unit. Do they go after the bomb or the Riptides or the Railhead?

The only unit they can't take out are flyers.

I too have been using Farsight bomb but slightly differently

Farsight
Crisis Suit w/ Command and Control Node, Multi-spectrum Sensor Suite, Neuroweb Jammer, Vector Thrusters
2x Crisis Suit w/ 2 Plasma Rifles (as my interpretation of the rules. Switch to Fusion for same points if FAQed away) Advanced Target System
4x Crisis Suit w/ Plasma Rifle, Fusion Blaster, Target Lock
Shadowsun w/ 2 Shield Drones

It has the potential to destroy 5 tanks and a 10 man marine squad on the turn it arrives. I usually point it at 3 targets or so and watch them vaporise. With twin linking and ignores cover without the use of markerlights, very few full squads can live once this squad has it's sights set one you. Worried about S8 Ap3 blasts? Find some cover with your thrust move for a 2+++ with Shadowsun, and some 3++ drones to stick in front just for good measure. Also has Hit and Run at I5 with Farsight (who is a beast in combat anyway).

Yeah I think the 2 point Neuroweb Jammer is an undersung piece of wargear (with the book being so new that's acceptable). Dropping in or infiltrating with shadowsun/farsight bomb, yada yada yada with the ability to slag one unit with fusion and then on the enemy turn cripple their long range support tanks/infantry, or a blob squad with the 'gets hot' rule is pretty sweet.

 McNinja wrote:
I would think that 20 snipers for 140 points that can infiltrate and get some first turn shots is a worthwhile investment indeed.

I think sniper round Kroot are awesome for Tau. The trends of the new 6th ed. books is that there all kinds of cheap unit buffing wargear (banners, locus, psykers in general and the like) and characters who provide buffs simply for being around. Precision shots will help (not the ultimate answer mind you) to mitigate these things. Supposedly Eldar are next and you can bank on exarchs/warlocks/farseers being unit or armywide buffing models.

And because you can use cheap kroot to try and snipe that herald/psyker/unit champ/special character etc. you don't necessarily have to waste your better firepower on wiping the whole unit to neuter the threat.

Plus infiltrate and outflank (taking at least 1 hound for acute senses) can mean that you can have an easier time lining up the shot on what you need to. Not to mention grabbing objectives.

Monstrous creatures are a thing especially vs. Daemons and Tyranids. Rumors point to Eldar getting a new large Wraith construct, but even if they don't you're likel to see more wraithlords/avatars after the new book drops.

You can combo a Skyray's networked markerlights nicely with sniper Kroot to help drop FMCs.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Yeah I think the 2 point Neuroweb Jammer is an undersung piece of wargear (with the book being so new that's acceptable). Dropping in or infiltrating with shadowsun/farsight bomb, yada yada yada with the ability to slag one unit with fusion and then on the enemy turn cripple their long range support tanks/infantry, or a blob squad with the 'gets hot' rule is pretty sweet.

NSJ is amazing for two points when combined with all the stuff the squad has.

It's hilarious on Ork Lootas.

 Scipio Africanus wrote:

Anyway, I doubt anyone takes the Riptide with the burst cannon. That's silly. All its other weapons are geared towards anti medium armour and 2+ armour.

I take the burst cannon on one of my two riptides, with the TW FB. I use it as my anti air unit with the skyfire and interceptor upgrades. If you nova charge the burst cannon on the turn before you'll be throwing 12 S6, rending shots at whatever tries to DS near you; as well as maybe the FB too if they DS close enough (this works as the nova charge effect lasts until your next movement phase). Be careful though, the gets hot rule with 12 shots can be a little risky, even with a 2+ save. This is the only riptide i upgrade with the shielded missile drones, as there are no more slots left for the FNP upgrade, as well as providing some firepower next turn if you choose to use the interceptor rule.

That and the heavy burst cannon looks really nice model wise.

I take the Burst Cannon. I like to know what i'm getting out of a weapon. Templates often disappoint me and most of my opponents will just maximize coherency so that I can only hit ~5 models.

Overcharged Burst gives 12 shots and rending is actually quite good vs MCs and can pen av12 flyers. Since I give the Skyfire upgrade I prefer it.

Mike Brandt prefers Burst as well. So there are folks out there who use it.

LValx wrote:
I take the Burst Cannon. I like to know what i'm getting out of a weapon. Templates often disappoint me and most of my opponents will just maximize coherency so that I can only hit ~5 models.

Overcharged Burst gives 12 shots and rending is actually quite good vs MCs and can pen av12 flyers. Since I give the Skyfire upgrade I prefer it.

Mike Brandt prefers Burst as well. So there are folks out there who use it.

Of course, you are getting 12 shots out of a weapon with "gets hot". So there's that.

 DakkaHammer wrote:

Of course, you are getting 12 shots out of a weapon with "gets hot". So there's that.

But that's part of the fun!

Seriously though, that's where the rest of the army comes in helpful, the new codex is designed to have units supporting each other. Use markerlights to increase BS to 6 or higher (if you have the tokens to spare) and reroll those rolls of a one.

 DakkaHammer wrote:

LValx wrote:
I take the Burst Cannon. I like to know what i'm getting out of a weapon. Templates often disappoint me and most of my opponents will just maximize coherency so that I can only hit ~5 models.

Overcharged Burst gives 12 shots and rending is actually quite good vs MCs and can pen av12 flyers. Since I give the Skyfire upgrade I prefer it.

Mike Brandt prefers Burst as well. So there are folks out there who use it.

Of course, you are getting 12 shots out of a weapon with "gets hot". So there's that.

Who cares? 12 Shots means 2 average gets hot and then a 2+ save. Rolling the 1's for Gets Hot and then failing your armor save is fairly unlikely. I'm okay with the risk.

 Akaraut wrote:

 DakkaHammer wrote:

Of course, you are getting 12 shots out of a weapon with "gets hot". So there's that.

But that's part of the fun!

Seriously though, that's where the rest of the army comes in helpful, the new codex is designed to have units supporting each other. Use markerlights to increase BS to 6 or higher (if you have the tokens to spare) and reroll those rolls of a one.

Alternatively, if you're using Shadowsun allow the Riptide to reroll 1s and you don't need as many markerlights. Either way, it's a 1/36 risk that can be changed to a 1/216 risk fairly easily. And you might have FNP. The bigger risk is getting the Nova-charge in the first place. Once you have that, there's little to worry about.

Puscifer wrote:

Puscifer wrote:
I've been testing this Farsight Bomb in a number of games to great effect. Not one single unit has stood up to one round of shooting from this squad:

HQ (850pts)

Commander Farsight.

XV8 Crisis Bodyguard Team

Crisis Bodyguard x1.
Command and Control Node, Drone controller, 2x Gun drone, Multi-spectrum Sensor Suite, Flamer Twin linked.
Crisis Bodyguard x6
Burst Cannon, Fusion Blaster, Plasma Rifle, 2x Shield drone.

It's expensive, but it is that effective that you don't need another Crisis unit.

I used this unit to take out a number of units including an Ork Blob, my own Deathwing army in three turns and with Markerlight support a ten man Paladin squad just to name a few.

I've narrowed down my Farsight Bomb to this:

Farsight.
6 x Crisis with Fusion, Plasma and Burst.
1x Crisis with Twin Flamer, Control Node, Sensor Suite, Target Kock, Neuroweb Jammer and Repulsor Field.
7x Shield Drone.
Shadowsun.

Comes in at 910 points.

Very expensive but incredibly destructive. On the turn they come down markerlight the target. If it's a transport destroy thst first with a Railhead or Suicide Crisis Suits first. Then get the Bomb to erase the unit you want dead.

It hasn't failed yet and considering what else I have in my army, it confuses players into shooting the right unit. Do they go after the bomb or the Riptides or the Railhead?

The only unit they can't take out are flyers.

Farsight,
6x Crisis w Fusion, Plasma, Target Lock
1x Crisis w NSJ, MSSS, CNC node, Neurochip, Vectored Retro-Thrusters, Drone Controller
Shadowsun + 2 Shield Drones
14 Gun Drones

That's 14S6AP2, 8S8AP1 and 28S5AP5 attacks, with re-rolls and ignore cover. You need target locks, because the sheer amount of overkill this unit delivers is amazing (12 terminators dead from average rolls, without markerlights; or 2 exploded AV14 vehicles)
Give this unit VRT. You get to use VRT on the highest initiative in the unit, ie Farsight's I5 or a Drone's I4. The last thing you want is for this unit to be tied in combat. That being said:
Use the Neurochip to give you counter-attack if its possible you might not wipe out an enemy unit: if that happens, you actually make a mean assault unit with 38 S5 and 28S3 attacks, and Farsight can do pretty well against most things that can't ID him.
On overwatch, you're still getting ~3 plasma, 3 pulse and 1 fusion hit, enough to take out 2 MEQ/TEQ on the charge. Put drones forward to eat annoying fire: with T4 and 4+ save they're reasonably resilient and will eat a large amount of lascannon shots.

Its a ridonkulous unit, and if you put it down on the board very few things will be able to deal with it (save perhaps interceptor riptides ) but it does take 50% of your army.

Going to run my first new tau allied into my ork force this saturday. I am doing the riptide + buffing commander tactic, as this is mainly a backfield gunner platform with bikernobz and blobs of boyz surging forward to do the real fighting.

However i think i over-equipped lol. This is my ally detatchment (the game is 1999pts)

Commander:
TL Plasma, Burst Cannon, Counterfire (He wont ever be firing except overwatch, so this was my thoughts for this gear)
Signature Upgrades: Neoruweb, CnC Node, Multispectrum Sensor Suit, Puretide Engram Neurochip
167 total for him.

Riptide:
Ion Accelerator, SMS
Stim Injector and Counterfire
225pts

Troops: 6 Fire Warriors (mandatory choice, just gonna camp backfield objectives)

FA: 4 Pathfinders (Had a slot, and its only 44 pts. Even if i only get a turn out of it, thats a turn of nice riptide shooting and wasted shots on his end for taking them out).

Total: 490

Cant help but feel like i went overboard on the commander lol I know you dont have to take all 4 slots, should i drop some of the weapons to shave points?

And FYI the ork side of the army is a mess of boyz, bikernobs, and a few lootas.

Just thought I'd point out to the people saying fire warriors having defensive greandes is a nerf- it's really not. Sure, getting them 1pt cheaper and having the option of buying greandes would be better. But as for defensive grenades taking away an opponent's charge bonuses and making it more likely your FW won't break- any smart opponent will declare a secondary charge target that they can't reach to take away their charge bonus anyway, if they want to stay in combat.

Plus kroot are just so much better than FW anyway it doesn't really matter.

I am just wondering, if you charge with units with defensive granades, can they pop a granade to get a cover save against the overwatch since they are within 8" of the unit?

Trasvi wrote:

Farsight,
6x Crisis w Fusion, Plasma, Target Lock
1x Crisis w NSJ, MSSS, CNC node, Neurochip, Vectored Retro-Thrusters, Drone Controller
Shadowsun + 2 Shield Drones
14 Gun Drones

That's 14S6AP2, 8S8AP1 and 28S5AP5 attacks, with re-rolls and ignore cover. You need target locks, because the sheer amount of overkill this unit delivers is amazing (12 terminators dead from average rolls, without markerlights; or 2 exploded AV14 vehicles)
Give this unit VRT. You get to use VRT on the highest initiative in the unit, ie Farsight's I5 or a Drone's I4. The last thing you want is for this unit to be tied in combat. That being said:
Use the Neurochip to give you counter-attack if its possible you might not wipe out an enemy unit: if that happens, you actually make a mean assault unit with 38 S5 and 28S3 attacks, and Farsight can do pretty well against most things that can't ID him.
On overwatch, you're still getting ~3 plasma, 3 pulse and 1 fusion hit, enough to take out 2 MEQ/TEQ on the charge. Put drones forward to eat annoying fire: with T4 and 4+ save they're reasonably resilient and will eat a large amount of lascannon shots.

Its a ridonkulous unit, and if you put it down on the board very few things will be able to deal with it (save perhaps interceptor riptides ) but it does take 50% of your army.

Best make sure you kill any and all vindicators/monoliths/any competent low AP large blast deploying vehicle when you land or you will be crying.