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If a Tyranid brood is for some reason or another without leadership, as in synapse or hive mind contact, will the lesser tyranids spawn or morph into one? Much like a colony of bees or ants ( I believe) will have a drone become a queen. If so, where is it referenced? I could have sworn I had read that they would somewhere in the fluff, but I just can't seem to recall where. Then again, maybe I am just getting all the genre's mixed up. Fun discussion anyways, hopefully.

If tyranid looses contact with the hive mind (AKA no synapse in range) it goes berserk with blinding fury and kills everything it can reach until it dies of exertion or succumbs to its wounds.

I thought they went into survival mode, not rampage. I think the ones that rampage are the MCs, but the gaunts I thought went into lurk/hide/survive until a synapse came about.

Read some of the BL stuff; In DoW II they destroy a unit of zoanthropes while their guard gaunts were charging them. After the last one went down the gaunts turned on eachother. Think of them like savage orks; They don't care what they kill as long as they can reach it.


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Maybe in the new 'dex they changed it up in the fluff and with the whole "Instinctive behavior" rule (haven't gotten the nid dex since 4th) and changed it but the general consensus has been that they go berserk in most of the novels I have read, including the older codices.

Thatguyhsagun wrote:
Read some of the BL stuff; In DoW II they destroy a unit of zoanthropes while their guard gaunts were charging them. After the last one went down the gaunts turned on eachother. Think of them like savage orks; They don't care what they kill as long as they can reach it.

it also depends on the subspecies of Tyranid. The Gaunts might well do this, but bioforms developed for different things might revert to, say, more natural predatory instincts, or even in the case of one or two kinds of 'Nid, burrow underground and begin hibernation until the link is restored. Genestealers, for example, are semi-autonomous from the Hive-Mind, and would simply retreat to a place of safety and survive at all costs.

 Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

Thatguyhsagun wrote:
Read some of the BL stuff; In DoW II they destroy a unit of zoanthropes while their guard gaunts were charging them. After the last one went down the gaunts turned on eachother. Think of them like savage orks; They don't care what they kill as long as they can reach it.

it also depends on the subspecies of Tyranid. The Gaunts might well do this, but bioforms developed for different things might revert to, say, more natural predatory instincts, or even in the case of one or two kinds of 'Nid, burrow underground and begin hibernation until the link is restored. Genestealers, for example, are semi-autonomous from the Hive-Mind, and would simply retreat to a place of safety and survive at all costs.

I believe lictors have adapted to survive without direct connections as well. Being able to run and assassinate enemy leaders from miles ahead of the main line.

It varies a little from source to source, but mostly you can trust swarm to loose its lack of self-preservation instinct, warp-like enhanced resilience and co-operation and co-ordination of their units soon followed by self-fighting. While it's universally true for most basic organism, I wouldn't be so quick to judge more advanced tyranid species. Among them, varying degrees of intellect, self-preservation and learning is often observed. For example, I remember that in ultramarines novel, more advanced organisms tried to bury underground and hibernate after a zoanthrope was killed by that crazed captain. In same novel, you can see lictors being droped behind enemy lines with healthy amount of support troops to harass civil population. There lictors seemed to be self-controling and on top of that, directing the swarm with disease.

In audio drama Helion Rain you can see how tyranids (genestealers) knew of space marines arrival and didin't engaged them until they had trapped them. That kind of behavior aren't seen from under direct hive mind influence. It doesn't micromanage an individual organism, it seems that hive mind allows more advanced organism or ones with more mentally tasking jobs to act with varying degrees of autonomy.

I do not know about tyranids going berzerk. It's rather opposite, they loose their bezerker like behavior and return to their more animalistic nature where are a place for self-preservation. I believe that inner infighting ensues only because of extreme concentration of predatory-minded animals in one area.

I thought it greatly depended on the creature. For example, a gaunt is only expected to live in terms or minutes or at most hours and doesn't have a digestive system or other biological functions because that is not what it was bred for. It was to be driven to kill by the hive mind then die.

No hive mind likely means a quick death for most of the lower form organism. Larger or more intelligent forms such as genestealers, lictors, or even trygons seem to be created to operate quick sufficiently without hive mind support both biologically and psychically.

It varies enormously. The Forge World Anphellion Project campaign book features what starts out as some captive Termagants and Hormagaunts eventually multiplying into a full-blown infestation complete with Bio-titans. It certainly lends some credence to the idea that Rippers are a Tyranid base-larva, and can be manipulated to grow into many different things.

Certain Tyranids are designed to act well ahead of the swarm. A Lictor knows exactly what it is doing and doesn't need Synaptic control. Genestealers take this even further.

It seems that instructions can even be built into organisms that would otherwise require supervision; Hive Fleet Jormungandr was able to deploy thousands of Raveners and Trygons to a planet over several months and each time one landed it simply burrowed underground and stayed dormant until called for (totally at odds with their predator-instinct).


I would expect yet another reaction from a Tyranid swarm in combat that suddenly loses its Synaptic network; it's such a confusing and brutal event that the alien equivalent of panic probably takes over most creatures, giving wildly different reactions. This can account for the lurk, berserk and flee variety.

From what i understand is that each tyranid creature has its own survival instincts. Hormogaunts kill the nearest thing. I read a novel how non synapse termagaunts ran and hid. So it depends

 Lord General Cheese wrote:
From what i understand is that each tyranid creature has its own survival instincts. Hormogaunts kill the nearest thing. I read a novel how non synapse termagaunts ran and hid. So it depends

This is my understanding as well.

I'll also add that I believe certain, named bioforms can operate "intelligently" even without the link. "Old One Eye" comes to mind.

So in the Anphellion (sp) project, how did they progress from the lesser Nids to the greater? Did they sense a lack of a "leader" and spawn one from a gaunt? I don't have that Imperial Armour volume, need to I guess.

 mjl7atlas wrote:
So in the Anphellion (sp) project, how did they progress from the lesser Nids to the greater? Did they sense a lack of a "leader" and spawn one from a gaunt? I don't have that Imperial Armour volume, need to I guess.

I was always under the impression that certain bioforms are "capable" of operating independently, and some aren't. Thus, if a bunch of gaunts are unlinked, they'll simply revert to killing until they die. However, if a Lictor is unlinked, the Lictor could survive and even, potentially, think abstractly.

Maybe I didn't word my question clearly. Will a ripper, gaunt, or other lesser nid morph into a higher form to provide the swarm with a synapse/leader. Like my worker bee into a queen bee analogy in my opening question. Thank you all the thoughts so far.

 mjl7atlas wrote:
Maybe I didn't word my question clearly. Will a ripper, gaunt, or other lesser nid morph into a higher form to provide the swarm with a synapse/leader. Like my worker bee into a queen bee analogy in my opening question. Thank you all the thoughts so far.

I don't believe so. To my knowledge, lesser forms cannot spontaneously morph into a greater form... an certainly not without the influence of the hive mind.

How does that explain the anphelion projects' tyranids that demonstrate rapid evolution inside their own genus?

It would seem to make sense that they can rebuild upon reaching critical mass. As enough tyranids amass, the collective "hive mind" of the creatures could drive them to evolve to exploit the planets resources and maybe even become Spaceborne.

It would also make sense if you take into consideration the octarious war and the doom of malantai. Both battles in which the tyranid hive ships expended their dying moments sending spores down to a planet/craftworld they wouldn't be around to consume.

The problem with this theory is it relies heavily on the origin of the tyranid species, which will never be concisely spelled out for us.

OOE is an example of the hive doing exactly this. A Carnifex is not normally a synapse creature, but in this case it morphed itself into a pseudo-synapse node.

I believe that if enough tyranids are in an area and given enough time, a pseudo hive mind will originate. Weather it would ever be able to form another hive, even if it consumed a whole world, well thats up to debate. It probably would not be much stronger than base animal instinct until creatures began to moph to accommodate more complex synthases of ideas between creatures. Normally a Tyrant or a collection of other synapse creatures would do this, but im betting that the survival instinct of tyranids would extend to this.


To correct a common misunderstanding, Hormigaunts do not go crazy whenever out of synapse. They are simply a more aggressive species of gaunt than Termigaunts, who will prefer to hide over fight. Hormigaunts will seek biomass and once it has sated itself, burrow and lay eggs (Yes, Hormies lay eggs, there is even a picture in one of the codexes). There are reported attacks years and decades after a tyranid invasion, so obviously everything isnt just suiciding itself into the nearest thing or attacking each other. Those are creations of Dawn of War or single mentions that then get repeated and stated as canon.

Ty for that Zephoid, if you don't mind what does OOE stand for?

Old One-Eye.

Where is the picture of the hormigaunt laying eggs as I am intrigued by that notion. I had thought they were sterile requiring a queen of sorts to birth them.


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 Psienesis wrote:
Old One-Eye.

Duh! I should have known that. I was thinking of a battle or planet name.

 Teej wrote:
How does that explain the anphelion projects' tyranids that demonstrate rapid evolution inside their own genus?

It would seem to make sense that they can rebuild upon reaching critical mass. As enough tyranids amass, the collective "hive mind" of the creatures could drive them to evolve to exploit the planets resources and maybe even become Spaceborne.

It would also make sense if you take into consideration the octarious war and the doom of malantai. Both battles in which the tyranid hive ships expended their dying moments sending spores down to a planet/craftworld they wouldn't be around to consume.

The problem with this theory is it relies heavily on the origin of the tyranid species, which will never be concisely spelled out for us.

Perhaps Tyranids instinctively create Reclamation Pools and Brood Nests? The mere presence of a number of 'gaunts could be enough to start a bit of local Tyrannoforming, and if this fledgling nest is allowed to prosper then it eventually starts to spawn higher forms? In that respect, Tyranids could be very similar to the way an Ork ecosystem develops...

It would certainly go some way to explain how even following the defeat of a swarm, smaller creatures are able to survive in the wild for some time (the latest Codex confirms for instance that Termagants do not starve to death in a few days, and can last a surprisingly long time.

Actually by the codex that its kinda 50/50 of the ones that need synapse have "Lurk" meaning they have a survival instinct, and then you have the hormas, and Carnifexes with "feed" which means they will go ahead and feed, but not neccesary without a survival instinct.

I can get on board with the Tyrannoforming concept. Makes sense.

Thatguyhsagun wrote:
If tyranid looses contact with the hive mind (AKA no synapse in range) it goes berserk with blinding fury and kills everything it can reach until it dies of exertion or succumbs to its wounds.

Only some specific kinds do that.

Termigants for example actually go feral, they begin breeding.


There have been cases of residual tyranids managing to take over a planet and rebuild a Tyranid fleet. Likely due to some sort of genetic protocol that goes into effect if Nids ever become cut off. To allow the species to continue to devour.

Genestealers are actually independent of the hive mind completely.

 Grey Templar wrote:


Only some specific kinds do that.

Termigants for example actually go feral, they begin breeding.


There have been cases of residual tyranids managing to take over a planet and rebuild a Tyranid fleet. Likely due to some sort of genetic protocol that goes into effect if Nids ever become cut off. To allow the species to continue to devour.

Genestealers are actually independent of the hive mind completely.

This is quite interesting, do you have a reference or book that has incidence of them rebuilding a fleet?

 Teej wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:


Only some specific kinds do that.

Termigants for example actually go feral, they begin breeding.


There have been cases of residual tyranids managing to take over a planet and rebuild a Tyranid fleet. Likely due to some sort of genetic protocol that goes into effect if Nids ever become cut off. To allow the species to continue to devour.

Genestealers are actually independent of the hive mind completely.

This is quite interesting, do you have a reference or book that has incidence of them rebuilding a fleet?

That's in the new Codex, under the Ghorala Swarm. In short, a tendril of Leviathan is lured into a massive Ork empire. The Ork fleet devastates the Hive Fleet with a minefield and then good Orky tactics, to the point where only one Hive Ship is left alive, limping towards the nearest world (Ghorala). It almost makes it, but dies in orbit. As it dies, it launches the last of its Mycetic Spores. The Tyranids on the ground are out-numbered, denied the normal massive Synapse web that the Hive Fleet provides and are completely on the back foot. They go on to run an effective guerilla campaign to build up a store of biomass that can be used to create new creatures to suit their needs, assassinate the Ork Warlord controlling the planet and keeping the Orks there united and then shortly afterwards they go on to conquer the planet, wipe out the Orks there and use the biomass to grow a completely new fleet. That fleet is now slowly chewing its way through the rest of that Ork empire.

 mjl7atlas wrote:
Where is the picture of the hormigaunt laying eggs as I am intrigued by that notion. I had thought they were sterile requiring a queen of sorts to birth them.


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 Psienesis wrote:
Old One-Eye.

Duh! I should have known that. I was thinking of a battle or planet name.

Hormigaunts lay fast hatching eggs. This works because once the first wave has layed its eggs and died in a assault. the eggs would hatch and the process would repeat.
Some one said that the guants don't have digestive tracks...well I don't think that's true. Rippers have them, why not gaunts?

Xyptc wrote:


That's in the new Codex, under the Ghorala Swarm. In short, a tendril of Leviathan is lured into a massive Ork empire. The Ork fleet devastates the Hive Fleet with a minefield and then good Orky tactics, to the point where only one Hive Ship is left alive, limping towards the nearest world (Ghorala). It almost makes it, but dies in orbit. As it dies, it launches the last of its Mycetic Spores. The Tyranids on the ground are out-numbered, denied the normal massive Synapse web that the Hive Fleet provides and are completely on the back foot. They go on to run an effective guerilla campaign to build up a store of biomass that can be used to create new creatures to suit their needs, assassinate the Ork Warlord controlling the planet and keeping the Orks there united and then shortly afterwards they go on to conquer the planet, wipe out the Orks there and use the biomass to grow a completely new fleet. That fleet is now slowly chewing its way through the rest of that Ork empire.

Wow, I can't believe I've overlooked that for so long. Very cool, thank you.

Let's just hope maybe they expand on that process a little better in the next dex. If the hive ships can rebuilt, from lesser breeder nids, that lends some credibility that the base form of nids may develop into more advanced bugs. Or breed them via some spawning nest or some mechanism.

Kinda thought they'd just go feral, not mindless but still feral.

 kinratha wrote:

 mjl7atlas wrote:
Where is the picture of the hormigaunt laying eggs as I am intrigued by that notion. I had thought they were sterile requiring a queen of sorts to birth them.


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 Psienesis wrote:
Old One-Eye.

Duh! I should have known that. I was thinking of a battle or planet name.

Hormigaunts lay fast hatching eggs. This works because once the first wave has layed its eggs and died in a assault. the eggs would hatch and the process would repeat.
Some one said that the guants don't have digestive tracks...well I don't think that's true. Rippers have them, why not gaunts?

Because it is the task of Rippers to devour the biomass of a planet and then dive into the closest Reclamation Pool to be broken down into liquid and passed to the fleet. That's all they do. A Gaunt's job is to kill things, and then get eaten by Rippers, who then take the biomass of the Gaunt to the pool, and then return to the Hive Fleet via Capillary Tower.