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Potential future update:

"Hey guys, we've got some unfortunate news. Battlefoam has informed us that they won't be able to make the July wave 1 date. We know how much you all want a quality foam case to carry around your mouth watering minis in as soon as you get them so we've decided to delay wave 1 2 months to give Battlefoam time to get the cases. We want to please you, the fans, and know that you wouldn't want to want another 6 months till wave 2 to get the case so we're willing to change this based on your feedback."

In the meantime, wave 1 is actually on track to be 3-4 months late past the July date but they don't mention that because there is *someone* else to assign blame to for 60+ days instead of taking responsibilty for the super dimensional fubar.

"In happier news, backers who are attending Gencon will be able to pick up our next two convention exclusive figures! Limited to 500 of each, with a sale price of $25, and beyond that we're even slipping some of wave one by air freight (at no small expense) over to the warehouse, so those who only got a few models during the campaign can pick up some more to start on while the rest makes a slow ocean voyage to the states! How exciting! Can you feel your mouth watering! Ignore the jazz hands behind the curtain!"

Do any of you really think PB will sell another set of minis for gencon?

Kevin does love to surprise folks...how about this.

Palladium has 100 or so RRT boxes flown in and then bundles them with Gen Con exclusive mini's.

I can see that happening. Palladium is going to plow on, ignore the backers and make as big of a splash as possible at the con.

In all fairness, if there's a lot of bags owed to backers, it could be a 'big deal' to get them produced as Battlefoam does have limited production capacity. Part of their deal with BF might be to give them adequate lead time so they can produce the trays without slowing down other work too much.

 Cypher-xv wrote:
Do any of you really think PB Won't sell another set of minis for gencon?

Fixed that for you Cypher.

 PallyDrone wrote:
Kevin does love to surprise folks...how about this.

Palladium has 100 or so RRT boxes flown in and then bundles them with Gen Con exclusive mini's.

I can see that happening. Palladium is going to plow on, ignore the backers and make as big of a splash as possible at the con.

I expect them to have a Gencon exclusive mini especially if they're not able to sell wave 1 due to their own (and Nina Division's) incompetence. They simply don't care what the fallout may be from the people whose money they already have.

I think a better question is whether or not they try to pull the same "omg, we had so little time, we only have 200/500/whatever of the con exclusives!" again.

Because, y'know, that convention that happens every year at the same time of the year really sneaks up on people.

Basically, whether or not they try to leverage artificial scarcity again.

rigeld2 wrote:
So why the rush to get the foam done?
The foam is useless without minis.

Battlefoam were (to my mind quite rightly) knocked for failing to get bags out on time for previous KS projects (even when those projects had hit major delays)

They were so late for Sedition Wars CMON decided to not offer 3rd party bags (and other stuff) any more which I'm no doubt cost them in terms of sales

So I think they've now decided that they'll make darn sure that they get bags for KS projects finished on time so this doesn't happen again

Oh oh oh oh Warboss!

I just had an idea!

Depending on how characters are designed, if it's possible to design a character that reflects the difference between a VF-1A and a VF-1J, you could totally use one in a skirmish game! Like, take the difference between the two, which from the RDF overview in the KS, basically appears to be a higher Gunnery value and Leadership 2, and make a 'generic character' that just adds those to the mech he/she is in!

So while there might not be a "VF-1J support card", you could use a Character to give it the relevant stats. You could even simply add the requisite increase to an existing character (Rick, Roy or Max, for example) to represent the end result in a skirmish with a high enough points value.

The only down side is that to fly Vermillion with all 3, you'd probably need to be playing over 100 points, and would be paying more for a 3A and 1J squadron than you would just by taking a core squad card of VTs, but I'm doing a little outside the box thinking here!

And that is yet another reason why using the points in a skirmish game is the sensible way to do things!

*mic drop*

Do they have generic characters? It isn't a bad idea but I don't see any benefit to that as opposed to simply making a VF-1J support card instead.

There's supposed to be the ability to make up ones own character. As long as one can spend points to assign a bonus to gunnery and leadership, I don't see why one couldn't just make up "Warboss: VT Pilot: +1 Gunnery, Leadership 2, 10 points" or something and run with it.

I agree it's less than ideal, but we're working with less than ideal material to begin with.

Or they could just make a VF-1J Special card for 25 points, say. Less than you pay for a 1S with lesser results, and I can't see a VT squad with 7As and 2Js be any more overpowered than 7As, 1J and 1S.

I dunno.. if I was naming it after my username, I'd give it +2 gunnery due to the special WWAAAGH! rule.

I was thinking about the KS this weekend when working on an entry in my blog and I came to the conclusion that I just don't seem to have the same interests as Palladium in regards to Robotech. I don't care that the RPG authors studied naval organization and squadron structure to come up with the "crunch" in the RPG books that has given us 4x veritechs in a squadron. I care about the anime source that the game is trying to emulate and the only recognizable squadron where we have a concrete number is 3... vermillion... and it is currently completely impossible to play.

I want figs with a variety of poses including some action ones like



but with a few more traditional ones. I don't however want kits with twice as many parts whose only choice is to assemble them as



or




If the project is suffering massive delays, I want something to tide me over as a pledger who was supposed to have his stuff 6 months ago according to their own post KS estimate... but instead I have to wait likely another 6 months to get anything. On top of that, I suspect if Palladium gets their way, I'll be potentially missing out on yet another set of con exclusives. My guess is though that Ninja Division, with the slow but steady separation from Robotech and Palladium to new projects/money/suckers, will not want to spend their time on con minis this time around. In any case, the publishing of the rules (art free if that is what they're worried about) as a thanks for waiting gesture (as opposed to the middle finger kind exclusive minis that we don't get are) would be the wise course of action. I had such high hopes for Robotech (both the minis, rules, and the community) but frankly I don't see any of the three taking off at this moment.

They are making a product they want, not a product the target audience wants. It is just that simple.

And I totally agree with you warboss, 100% of that post is what I wanted.

Thanks... and if they had come out with the project ON THEIR OWN DIME instead of crowdfunding it, I'd have no problem with it. I wouldn't have bought much (maybe just the starter and nothing else) at retail after reviews came out on various blogs and I certainly would NOT have preordered it. If they want to burger king the whole thing and just do it "their way", then they should have paid for it themselves if it wasn't just a really expensive preorder as opposed to crowdfunding an idea.

Also, to facilitate the discussion on the KS comments (I don't want to aggravate myself by logging in there and potentially interacting with the Duncan guy)... here is a 5 minute mashup of various images to hopefully get the scale right for the discussion. It's not perfect but I highly doubt the combo of images are off by more than 5-10% total between them all.




Three times as many parts as a terminator for LESS variety since each terminator has individual body parts that are sculpted differently and all we've been shown on robotech is that one sprue for each model.

Any chance you could add a Dreadnought on there?

Err, assuming one of those two folks on the right aren't one.

They've come up a lot in the recent KS comments debating.

No sign of Duncan lately, but WRRD is back around doing his apologist tour. Him and that NMI guy from the PB forums, can't stand folks who think "look, I know you've been misled or lied to for the last year, but there are reasons behind the scenes, I just can't tell you what those are, y'know, NDAs and other reasons, but believe! Believe, have faith, be patient and be quiet, that'd be swell." routine was old before it started.

Edit: heh, it just hit me. Dwarven Forge's second campaign has a delivery date of November.

There is a non-zero chance DF will run, complete, and deliver on 2 projects before PB delivers on one.

:-P

With some work you can go from the stock pose





to these:



But it does take a bit of converting and more work then I'd want for more than a few models. Converting large numbers I'd pass on particularly since the RTT models are about half the height of these Nichimo kits.

OMG! Seams! SEAMS! SEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMS!

Sorry, bit of a Pavlovian response after so many months in the KS comments.

 Forar wrote:
Any chance you could add a Dreadnought on there?

Err, assuming one of those two folks on the right aren't one.

:-P

No, one is a regular space marine and the other is a terminator. The terminator is probably the best analog for the UEDF mecha in general due to its size and identical 40mm basing whereas the dread is noticeably larger in pretty much every dimension and goes on a 60mm base. I found a better pic with all the spees marineez in a row. From L to R is a space marine, terminator, centurion, and dreadnought.

Ah, awesome, thank you.

I only mention it because the number of parts and whatnot of the Dreadnoughts has come up a lot, despite the RRT destroids being, at a glance, significantly smaller (but we wouldn't want to compare them to the smaller, fewer pieces using GW figures, that doesn't match the defender's argument!)

Hell, even a Dreadnaught is only a dozen pieces or so. Not much more than that for sure. And it's much larger.

Oh, if we're comparing sizes, these may also be helpful.

http://postimg.org/gallery/7355u4h6/5f24d42a/

rigeld2 wrote:
Hell, even a Dreadnaught is only a dozen pieces or so. Not much more than that for sure. And it's much larger.

Depends on the dread. The starter set dread was only a half dozen but had no pose options without cutting (which I did with two of them). The final product though was VERY good for a starter set dread and looked on par with the full version (which cost alot more but had more options and parts). The 40k starter sets and plastic sprues are VERY well designed even if the final product looks like crap (Taurox transport/Storm Raven/Storm Talon/Cernturions, I'm looking at you!).

Starter set





Note the lack of seams anywhere on the front face.

The terminators were 5 pieces without any seams across the front and offered almost as much posability as the destroids get (just missing the twisting at the waist).



I'm not saying that I want 5 piece destroids like chicken nuggets or one pose to rule them all but there has to be a middle ground between 30 pieces with goofy poses and multiple seams across the front and what I've pictured above.

See, this is a reasonable stance.

And I completely agree.

But to hear PB and some of their 'faithful' tell it, this is THE ONE TRUE WAY, and all who would oppose them MUST BURN!'

Remember when I mentioned the PB forums reminding me of a cult, like, a year ago?

That feeling hasn't changed. Blind zealous fervor, still seriously disconcerting.

The PB forums have been weirdly quiet.

 Swabby wrote:
The PB forums have been weirdly quiet.

Quiet, or silenced?

I tend to not bother posting there, even for something as banal as answering a question about advance copies of the rulebook. The tiniest things that get slapped down, it's just not worth bothering with. Which also doesn't bode well for the online community post release. I fully expect these same people to be in charge on the official forums (assuming PB don't just keep it in the middle of that bloated and outdated Forum), slapping down anything slightly critical, and praising the powers that be.

Yeah, not a place I'd want to hang out.

You'd have more luck speaking your mind in North Korea or in some Taliban ruled hellhole.

Let's not exaggerate (even on April Fools) about that as those two are evil incarnate. Palladium may be run by incompetent buffoons with overinflated egos but they're not mass murderers. In the end, we're talking about people who make deeply flawed books and are (failing to) make toy soldiers... nothing more.

 Swabby wrote:
The PB forums have been weirdly quiet.

Maybe Hale-bopp and the time of transcendence passed again? Reports of rotting kool-aid drinkers are bound to stop popping up in a few days

PallyDrone wrote:You'd have more luck speaking your mind in North Korea or in some Taliban ruled hellhole.

warboss wrote:Let's not exaggerate (even on April Fools) about that as those two are evil incarnate. Palladium may be run by incompetent buffoons with overinflated egos but they're not mass murderers. In the end, we're talking about people who make deeply flawed books and are (failing to) make toy soldiers... nothing more.

I'm currently in a Taliban "rule" hellhole. The populace and fledgling military here are far more optimistic that they're going to throw off the Taliban and take back their country than I am that PB and ND will deliver a worthwhile product.

Warboss, I never really compared sizes, so seeing your pictures above really made me sad. I was under the delusional self impression that a destroid was going to be half again as tall as a terminator. So 20+ parts for a pretty much mono-pose POS has actually made me depressed. I wish they could have been honest about their gak attitude and approach to model making during the campaign. Now the PTSD voices think I should ask for a refund in person with both PB and ND and all this gakky little pissants who think they're making a great product...