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I disrespectfully disagree with your statements, but out of respect for our dear blood drinker, I'll leave the matter be.

However, if you'd like to go a round or twelve by PM, I will gladly continue the discussion there.

vitae_drinker wrote:
Hey, guys if I want to read other people's opinions on politics I'll read facebook. Keep politics there, please.

This is a place for little plastic soldiers and related, thanks.

I agree completely and I apologize for bringing that off topic discussion over from the KS comments into the equally inappropriate area of this forum. Sorry, Forar, but I have no interest in discussing it further here via PM as frankly from reading the comments everyone involved STARTED the "discussion" with their heels firmly dug in place much like with all internet political discussions.

No apologies necessary, just thought I'd offer in case you really felt the need to unload after being subjected to the 'comments'.

Speaking of which, it's always nice when some random guy I'm not sure we've ever seen comment before drops in with "OMG GUYS YOU'RE BEING SO MEAN TO PALLADIUM!"

Dude, unless you've been lurking for the last year and just never spoke up, you have *no idea*.

Also, we're what, 41 days from Gencon? It's adorable how they're clearly hoping and praying for a miracle to happen and some boxes to land in their laps. Less than 6 weeks (more like around 5 when you figure they need time to load stuff into the van/truck/whatever during their usual pre-GC prep time) and they still can't say one way or another.

At this rate we might find out whether or not they're actually selling at Gencon around... Gencon.

I can see them actually waiting until after Gencon to announce that they don't have anything for...Gencon!

Well what happens if nobody reminds them that GenCon exists and they end up attending a lawn and garden expo instead?

I suspect Palladium will move mountains to make sure they have something to sell at gencon, even if only in limited quantities. I have no faith in them putting forth that same effort towards getting our prepaid products out judging from the fact that they're planning on using their existing employee pool of a half dozen plus maybe one or two ND folks plus whatever volunteers they can scrounge up to ship out OVER 5,000 packages instead of planning ahead and hiring extra temp workers to do it right. I'm sure the ND guys will have something more pressing to do after a few days and the volunteers individually won't last more than a weekend leaving only the normal palladium staff. That is the type of fundatmental management failure they're infamous for and continue to do.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Krinsath wrote:
Well what happens if nobody reminds them that GenCon exists and they end up attending a lawn and garden expo instead?

If a lawn and garden expo decided to give them status as "guest of honor", they'd go. That seems to be the deciding factor. I don't think it is any surprise to most folks up to date with this thread to be told that sucking up to Palladium works much more effectively than common sense and actual usefulness. That's how they decided to simply "not know" about Adepticon despite ND going to the biggest minis-focused game con year after year and instead go to no_name_local_animecon as guests of honor.

 Krinsath wrote:
Well what happens if nobody reminds them that GenCon exists and they end up attending a lawn and garden expo instead?

Is it bad that I wouldn't be surprised if this happened?

 warboss wrote:
I suspect Palladium will move mountains to make sure they have something to sell at gencon, even if only in limited quantities. I have no faith in them putting forth that same effort towards getting our prepaid products out judging from the fact that they're planning on using their existing employee pool of a half dozen plus maybe one or two ND folks plus whatever volunteers they can scrounge up to ship out OVER 5,000 packages instead of planning ahead and hiring extra temp workers to do it right. I'm sure the ND guys will have something more pressing to do after a few days and the volunteers individually won't last more than a weekend leaving only the normal palladium staff. That is the type of fundatmental management failure they're infamous for and continue to do.

Well... to be fair to Palladium, it's hard to announce an opening for a temporary job in November, no, December, no, February, no, June, no July (always July), no August.

And yeah, the lack of faith in effort you mentioned, and the management failures, are while I'm still working at getting off this merry-go-round. Hell, (from a purely selfish perspective) I'm hoping it gets delayed through September. Gotta wait for that cheque to clear.

Has anyone reminded Palladium the Gen Con is coming up? Since they managed to forgot Adepticon (despite it being the biggest miniatures convention) it'd be a good idea that somebody email them about the next major convention. Otherwise, in their old age it's likely that it'll slip their minds.

I'm overall ok with the gashapo detail and level of crispness but.. wow.. that tail on the gerwalk valkyrie is ugly as hell. Why the hell wasn't that made as a separate piece instead of moulded onto the body? I realize they couldn't do much as is due to undercuts but was there really no space on the sprue to make that a separate piece?




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Morgan Vening wrote:

Well... to be fair to Palladium, it's hard to announce an opening for a temporary job in November, no, December, no, February, no, June, no July (always July), no August.

And yeah, the lack of faith in effort you mentioned, and the management failures, are while I'm still working at getting off this merry-go-round. Hell, (from a purely selfish perspective) I'm hoping it gets delayed through September. Gotta wait for that cheque to clear.

They don't have to go into the details. Simply announcing that they're bring in paid workers to get the job done quickly and correctly and not just relying on promises of free aid from people who swing by the office would be nice and responsible.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 paulson games wrote:
Has anyone reminded Palladium the Gen Con is coming up? Since they managed to forgot Adepticon (despite it being the biggest miniatures convention) it'd be a good idea that somebody email them about the next major convention. Otherwise, in their old age it's likely that it'll slip their minds.

I think we're safe with that one. They've got the deathclock ticking, dontchyaknow?

http://countingdownto.com/countdown/palladium-s-gencon-robotech-mutually-assured-destruction-pact-countdown-clock

41 days and counting till the dealer's room doors open up to the public!

vitae_drinker wrote:

 Krinsath wrote:
Well what happens if nobody reminds them that GenCon exists and they end up attending a lawn and garden expo instead?

Is it bad that I wouldn't be surprised if this happened?

You should expect it really...where else would they find good fertilizer vendors for the primary material needed for RTT updates?

I haven't bothered with this mess for a few months...today I stuck my nose back in and what do I see....

Holy crap...this crap looks like total crap!

Embarrassing.

I'm not a big model or mini guy, but does this Spartan look like it was molded out of play-doh or I don't know...cheese?

They really do look like vending machine or Happy Meal toys. Heck Happy Meal toys look better.

Sad.

Are those missile racks or candy button dispensers?



Here's some cheap vending machine toys to contrast and compare. Warbots via a site called gumball.com

Ummmm.....

Nothing that some green stuff, black primer and masterful painting can't fix?

They are only intended to be the "canvas" for your art?

Best to leave the missile bay doors closed...
The cand.., er, missile dispen..., er, launchers really needed to be recessed a bit.

Why they no separately cast tail for gerwalk??
Ah, they would have had to split it down the middle, never mind, I see it now.

(Man, why did those gumball robots have to look so similarly bad? Not fair!)

These are very close-up pictures, makes it look far worse than it really is...

I can only warp my mind so far, may it be over soon.

You have to give those gumball robots credit where credit is due... they have better mould lines than Mantic products and are more to scale with each other than McVey offerings which would be their PVC competition in the tabletop market.

I really loathe the section of outright apologists in the comments who waffle between "these things are amazing! omg my mind it is blown!" and "Look, you just need a dremel, a stocked modeling kit, a few hundred hours of expertise, etc, etc to make them look good".

Man, if your answer is "oh, just be an expert modeller and snag a couple hundred bucks in tools and gear" to make these things look good, you're beyond help.

Sure, having those tools and experience will help, and that's to be expected, but if it's the baseline, it's going to drive away potential players who lack that kind of experience, and add an extra barrier to entry to those who wish to proceed anyway.

It's frustrating that some people just don't understand that not everyone has two decades of GW building/painting and tens of thousands of points across X armies to draw upon. As someone who has only built dozens of figures (mostly pewter, maybe two dozen or less in plastic) and painted maybe half of those, every time people go on about how inconsequential it is for THEM to attend to mold lines and flash and modifying, I can't help but think "Yeah, and I'm gak outta luck, guess I'd better hope my amateur hands don't feth things up too badly".

Ugh.Palladium's mishandling of this project still garners more of my ire, but some of these smug donkey caves occasionally give them a run for their money.

NOTE: Again, nothing against those of you who DO have piles of experience and thousands of dollars invested in your work stations. It'd just be nice if some of these outspoken folks recognized that there are, in fact, new or newer players out there who lack one, the other or both.

Forar: You do realize I was trying my best to channel my inner "apologist" no matter how contrary to my nature that is.
My mistake for reminding you of those who make excuses (but your rant was cathartic all the same).

I keep reading how "negative" dakka-ites are and there just is no pleasing us.

I find it a very good exercise to see how hard it is to support the views of those groups/companies that cause our "challenges".

My job is Quality Engineering so seeing places with obvious system issues and poor customer feedback mechanisms is like folding a map wrong in front of me (poor thing to compare to in this day and age).

There are so many positive steps that could even be taken at this point but like my other problem with GW, Palladium is rather resistant to suggestions.

Oh well, will continue to throw my money at Fantasy Flight...

Nah, it's all good Tal, I know you didn't mean any harm. When I said "in the comments", I literally meant the KS comments. I should've been clearer on that.

It's just something that comes up every so often in the comments. Legit concerns/considerations about a model or aspect will be tabled, only to have guys go off on how quick and easy it is for them, they'll do up 50 battlepods a night without any trouble, it'll be like a weekend to do up a Battlecry to nigh-golden demon (or whatever that contest is called) levels, etc , etc.

I just think it's extremely short sighted of them to give everything a pass because they personally don't have any trouble with it. It ignores the vast swathes of the player base (and potential player base) who lack those skills and that gear, and is often stated to minimize concerns in the least empathic way possible.

But we're cool here. My close friends that played Warhammer and got me into Malifaux were very complimentary of my beginners efforts at building and painting, I know solid folks like that are out there. But the KS comments? There's like a half dozen reasonable dudes and a couple that are in dire need of being put in a time out to think about what they've said.

Not completely related to this, but it seems like HG is asking for 500k to produce a new robotech anime episode/film

Yeah, and some people are already commenting on how poorly the miniatures campaign has been run (it's not me).

And, obviously, that's just a taste of things to come if PB ever gets around to the second series.

Hell, ANY kickstarter at all, at this point. Crowdfunding may not be dead to them, but I can only imagine it'll be a much harder uphill battle, even if they manage rely on some serious nostalgia-goggles again.

Sining wrote:
Not completely related to this, but it seems like HG is asking for 500k to produce a new robotech anime episode/film

Its a shame there isn't 30ish years of Macross sequels that could have been brought over to the states.

$20 for the early bird digital only copy of ONE single episode? Pass. If HG wants a half million dollars, all they need to do is get their heads out of their rears and make up with the macross folks. It is by far the most popular of the three and I personally have no interest in overpaying to fund another episode where every likeness is changed to avoid being confused with macross like meathead scarred white hair different voice Rick Hunter in the Shadow Chronicles. Also, take a look at the most expensive pledges. You can pay $2,000-$10,000 to get your likeness in various degrees in the show!!... except that "Harmony Gold reserves the right of refusal at its sole discretion". Yes, that's right, you can pay thousands of dollars and simply be screwed over by Frank Agrama personally at his sole discretion! I mean.. what are the chances that a company with such a stellar rep like HG would do something shady?

Here is a link in case anyone is interested in it:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1381502542/robotech-academy

I wish HG would just go bankrupt. Maybe then we'll get macross back to the west again. I hope non of you guys give them your money. I'm already banned from the RT FB page for giving my 2¢.

OK I kinda have to ask here becuase I'm confused. why is an English producer team (Harmony Gold) trying to produce a sequel for 'Robotech'? Shouldn't fans of the series already moved on to other anime projects?

Robotech, or better known as 'Macross' in Japan is a hugh hit and continue to be so today. With the most recent 'Macross Frontier' series airing 20~ish epsiodes and 2 movies. Why is then HG so desprete in using Kickstarter just to release a 'pilot' epsiode. I kinda thought Robotech was a japanese anime as well.

Does the american audience even know about the subsequent Robotech Series? Macross 7? Macorss Zero?

As a fan of Robotech, the novels, and a few other media, I'm aware that there are, like, a hundred and eighty spin offs, prequels, sequels, alternate time lines, movies, stand alone stories and other random stuff.

Couldn't tell you how to differentiate DYRL from Plus from Zero from whatever that bullgak was with the mecha powered with music from II from whatever, but I know they're out there.

Yes, some of that was trolling. Don't anyone fall for it too hard.

wufai wrote:
OK I kinda have to ask here becuase I'm confused. why is an English producer team (Harmony Gold) trying to produce a sequel for 'Robotech'? Shouldn't fans of the series already moved on to other anime projects?

Robotech, or better known as 'Macross' in Japan is a hugh hit and continue to be so today. With the most recent 'Macross Frontier' series airing 20~ish epsiodes and 2 movies. Why is then HG so desprete in using Kickstarter just to release a 'pilot' epsiode. I kinda thought Robotech was a japanese anime as well.

Does the american audience even know about the subsequent Robotech Series? Macross 7? Macorss Zero?

Robotech was a frankenstein's monster type melding of THREE different japanese anime series of which Macross was only the first. Some of the plot advancements in the various Macross series you mentioned happen during the "robotech" story arc as it continues for almost 20 years after the end of Macross. The series you listed like Macross 7 are NOT robotech series but most US roboanime fans do indeed know about them which is why Harmony Gold has the poor reputation that it has because it has prevented them from being easily available in the US.

Holy Crap! I just got caught up with this whole piece of fail that is 'Robotech'... Growing up in Asia I always thought 'Robotech' was just the american name for Macross. Damn and I backed this project thinking it was Macross.

I always wondered why the project is sticking to only the robots from the first anime series when Macross Frontier was the biggest hit in years.

Maybe I'm preching to the wrong group, I never saw Robotech, just the orginal Macross series. But if there are those who do not know about Macross but loves the airplane/gerwalk/Robot portion of Robotech please check out Macross Frontier, at least just give ep7 a try. I hope you guys find there is a larger bigger world of Macross then just what America's Robotech has to offer.

I watch all the macross stuff.

When I was 8yrs old I loved RT. As I got older and learned what rt really was, I unlike some moved on. Frontier is great! I can't wait to get my bootleg of the new series. Macross in its original form will always be superior to the gak HG puts out. I wish HG would stop forcefeeding imitation anime to us. Fire the Yune bros and hire a real anime studio to make a new anime show with giant robots that has nothing to do with RT.

wufai wrote:
Holy Crap! I just got caught up with this whole piece of fail that is 'Robotech'... Growing up in Asia I always thought 'Robotech' was just the american name for Macross. Damn and I backed this project thinking it was Macross.

I always wondered why the project is sticking to only the robots from the first anime series when Macross Frontier was the biggest hit in years.

While I'd disagree strongly with calling robotech a "whole piece of fail", macross is by far for alot of fans (but not all) the best part and you did back a macross project because the kickstarter was *ONLY* for macross stuff. The other eras were to be covered by future kickstarters but with this one taking likely 2-3 years to fully deliver that might be in doubt.

I am unsure if it was Gatchaman (Battle of the Planets here) or Robotech was the first Japanese anime I laid eyes on.

Robotech was the first stomping robots show I saw and blew my mind even more that they changed.

Soooo... many years and games of Battletech later, they still get my money. Never really got into heavy gear... not sure why.

My point: I am waiting for Robotech and thinking I need to make myself not care about the other eras because they will be similarly messed up by Palladium.

Any good stomping robot tabletop? Any kickstarter that may have a hope worth supporting? Would love to see a variation of Gundam or even Bubblegum Crisis.

Heck, a wild west game of "Trigun" would make me happy to no end.

See my point? I really do not want to meeting you kind folks again to gripe about the next Robotech release.