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Hey guys, getting this list...what to do you think?

HQ - pedro kantor - 175pts

Troops - one tactical squad with ML or HB, meltagun and sgt equipped with combi plasma - 185pts
one tactical squad with ML or HB, flamer and sgt equipped with power sword - 185 pts

Heavy Support - two vindicators with siege shield and storm bolters - 270 pts

Elite - Assault Terminators with dedicated transport land raider - 460 pts

Fast Attack - Stormtalon gunship with skyhammers 125 pts

Fortification - Aegis defence line with quad gun 100pts

Total - 1500 pts

The idea with this is depending on the situation the game is the tactical squads deploy on the board, one behind aegis defence line, manning the quad gun and one someplace else, maybe even both behind the defence lines. The vindicators....I'll either run right next to each other or either sides of the board in cover or with the landraider covering its poor side armour. The landraider either deploys straightaway with the vindis or comes on as reserve to pwn with gunship escorting the landraider, blowing stuff up and clearing objectives, killing stuff...

Pedro an no Stern guard is not a good idea. Tac squads are unnecessary in a Pedro list drop them both for sniper scouts. Spend the spare points on stern guard. Solo Landraiders are a bad idea. I hope that isn't a normal Landraider but s Crusader? Likewise the Storm talon needs other flyers or it just dies to a quad gun every single time. Vindicators in pairs is the only thing I like in your list.

 FlingitNow wrote:
Pedro an no Stern guard is not a good idea. Tac squads are unnecessary in a Pedro list drop them both for sniper scouts. Spend the spare points on stern guard. Solo Landraiders are a bad idea. I hope that isn't a normal Landraider but s Crusader? Likewise the Storm talon needs other flyers or it just dies to a quad gun every single time. Vindicators in pairs is the only thing I like in your list.

True, but sniper scouts are useless to be honest, not much good. Nope, normal landraider. You're right about the flyers, but I need air support and I'm hoping I can take the other quad gun out quickly of they have one. If they take my flyer, I'll still have the quad gun in the aegis defence line. Thanks for the advice.

5 Sniper scouts camping on an objective are very good and cheap giving more points for Sternguard. Tac squads are woeful a necessary evil in most SM builds the reason to take Pedro is that he means you don't have to pay the tactical tax.

The Lascannon Landraider is terrible. Its contents require it being in the enemies face but its weapons are designed to sit back and shoot. It is not worth 250 points as pure fire support (your far better off with 2 preds) nor is it worth 250 just as a transport (you're better off just getting more Terminators). Hence the Crusader and Redeemer are the good options because they are designed to fight in close support of the assault death that they carry...

I also don't see what can kill a Quadgun turn 1 in your list? So that Storm talon is auto dead if your opponent has what is probably the most common unit in the game... drop it or get a 2nd. Same goes for the Landraider (which needs to change variant anyway). Pedro should probably be dropped from this list as you are not using him at all.

 FlingitNow wrote:
5 Sniper scouts camping on an objective are very good and cheap giving more points for Sternguard. Tac squads are woeful a necessary evil in most SM builds the reason to take Pedro is that he means you don't have to pay the tactical tax.

The Lascannon Landraider is terrible. Its contents require it being in the enemies face but its weapons are designed to sit back and shoot. It is not worth 250 points as pure fire support (your far better off with 2 preds) nor is it worth 250 just as a transport (you're better off just getting more Terminators). Hence the Crusader and Redeemer are the good options because they are designed to fight in close support of the assault death that they carry...

I also don't see what can kill a Quadgun turn 1 in your list? So that Storm talon is auto dead if your opponent has what is probably the most common unit in the game... drop it or get a 2nd. Same goes for the Landraider (which needs to change variant anyway). Pedro should probably be dropped from this list as you are not using him at all.

Tactical tax? Standard LR's are a bit underestimated in 6th I can see, it gives me my direct anti-armour kills. But I can see where you're coming from. If I took to preds I'd loose a vindi, and I love vindis but on the most part you're right...my budget on the other hand isn't so ill have to play with what I've got...I've got more stuff but I haven't put it down on this list, this is just a 1500pt list

Tactical tax refers to taking tactical squads in your list is a tax on your points because they are so bad. Basically like tax takes from your paycheck without giving you much benefit likewise points spent on tactical marines are taking points from your total without giving you any killing power...

 FlingitNow wrote:
Tactical tax refers to taking tactical squads in your list is a tax on your points because they are so bad. Basically like tax takes from your paycheck without giving you much benefit likewise points spent on tactical marines are taking points from your total without giving you any killing power...

Ah right, understood. Tactical squads are more durable though. Killing power is done by two pie plates put down

Yeah the Vindicators are good. Sniper scouts are just as survivable as tac marines if not more so and much cheaper. Sternguard are just as survivable as tac marines but actually kill stuff.

Pedro is expensive, I'm not sure you are getting your value out of him. I might recommend running a chaplain with the terminators instead. That said, he does get the job done.

Your tac squads have no mobility. At least one of them needs to get to an objective, so a rhino would be nice. In an ideal world, both would be meched up and a scout squad would be left home to man the gun and keep the homefires burning. I'm not a fan of wargear on sarges. If you are taking a combi weapon, I'd match the squad special. While not the best troop in the world, tactical marines can get the job done, don't sell them short.

I like the classic LR. 5 termies in a LR is 450, not 460. While the LRC needs the MM, the phobos can do fine with the godhammers, no need to buy the extra gun. I assume that's what the extra 10 points was for.

I'm not sure you need the extra stormbolters and siege shields on the vindis. By having the LR and Pedro in a 1,500 point list you are already tight on points, I think these could be spent better elsewhere (like in the troops section)

The talon and ADL are fine.

 Nevelon wrote:
Pedro is expensive, I'm not sure you are getting your value out of him. I might recommend running a chaplain with the terminators instead. That said, he does get the job done.

Your tac squads have no mobility. At least one of them needs to get to an objective, so a rhino would be nice. In an ideal world, both would be meched up and a scout squad would be left home to man the gun and keep the homefires burning. I'm not a fan of wargear on sarges. If you are taking a combi weapon, I'd match the squad special. While not the best troop in the world, tactical marines can get the job done, don't sell them short.

I like the classic LR. 5 termies in a LR is 450, not 460. While the LRC needs the MM, the phobos can do fine with the godhammers, no need to buy the extra gun. I assume that's what the extra 10 points was for.

I'm not sure you need the extra stormbolters and siege shields on the vindis. By having the LR and Pedro in a 1,500 point list you are already tight on points, I think these could be spent better elsewhere (like in the troops section)

The talon and ADL are fine.

Thanks nevlon! Some very good suggestions there. If its 1750pts or whatever usually comes after 1500pts, I'll definitely include a 5 man scout squad with snipers to man the gun and probably rhinos, the extra 10 points was for a storm bolter on the LR, but I mainly put it on for looks and ended up adding it in. The extra stormbolters are useful I think, because of the weapons destroyed result, its a 50/50 chance plus its still armed of the main gun goes and the siege shields are useful, for parking the damned thing in awkward positions....in craters, giving it a cover save etc or some other place. Should I include another tac squad or defo scouts? And I'm planning on arming Stormtalon with skyhammers....any good?


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Plus if pts list goes up. I'll include stern guard with pedro, maybe for now take a techmarine or MofF.

The times I've fielded the talon, it has been with sky hammers, and they have done well by me. Sometimes I wished for the punch of the LCs, but I'm not sure they are worth the points.

While the whistles and bells are nice to have, I think you need ~110-135 points of stuff in your list, so am looking for things to trim. (That's for a rhino and a scout squad) Rather then have some extra stombolters tacked on "just in case" I'd rather have a tac squad rush up the table, hop out, and double-tap bolters into some filthy xenos. And the cheap scouts can sit camping your home objective while the tacs are freed up to do just that.

Now they might be able to advance on foot behind the LR. It's a huge chunk of LOS blocking AV14. So you might be OK without transports. At 1,500 I like 3 troop picks, you are running with two, and on foot in the open at that. Rhinos not only give you mobility, but do take some effort to crack open to get to the chewy bits.

It might be my bias showing through, but unless I'm doing something wacky, the core of my army is always a ML/F and a MM/M tactical squad in rhinos. They work for me.

But everyone has different play styles, so what works for me might not suit you. At the end of day it's your army. Try it out, proxy if you need to, and adjust the way you feel it needs. While the internet is full of general advice, every table and local meta is different. What terrain you have in your collection and the mood of your scatter die are going to have more of an impact on your list then the last few tweaks you make spending points.

 Nevelon wrote:
The times I've fielded the talon, it has been with sky hammers, and they have done well by me. Sometimes I wished for the punch of the LCs, but I'm not sure they are worth the points.

While the whistles and bells are nice to have, I think you need ~110-135 points of stuff in your list, so am looking for things to trim. (That's for a rhino and a scout squad) Rather then have some extra stombolters tacked on "just in case" I'd rather have a tac squad rush up the table, hop out, and double-tap bolters into some filthy xenos. And the cheap scouts can sit camping your home objective while the tacs are freed up to do just that.

Now they might be able to advance on foot behind the LR. It's a huge chunk of LOS blocking AV14. So you might be OK without transports. At 1,500 I like 3 troop picks, you are running with two, and on foot in the open at that. Rhinos not only give you mobility, but do take some effort to crack open to get to the chewy bits.

It might be my bias showing through, but unless I'm doing something wacky, the core of my army is always a ML/F and a MM/M tactical squad in rhinos. They work for me.


But everyone has different play styles, so what works for me might not suit you. At the end of day it's your army. Try it out, proxy if you need to, and adjust the way you feel it needs. While the internet is full of general advice, every table and local meta is different. What terrain you have in your collection and the mood of your scatter die are going to have more of an impact on your list then the last few tweaks you make spending points.

So you're saying another tactical squad, rhino and scout squad would cut the job? Seems like a good idea, thanks for the advice very clear now! I'll give this list a try and see how it goes for a few games. The dice gods might be in my favour for a while! Thanks anyway much appreciated!

You already have the two tacs, so just need to add the rhino and scouts. 3 troops total (two tactical, one scout) not three tac squads plus the scouts.