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You can read the post, or simply download the updated version of the rules (v1.07)

The time has come! The Alpha Release of Aetherverse, 2nd Edition, is now officially released to the public. Aetherverse is a free tabletop wargame, designed to be used with almost all 25-30mm scale miniatures, regardless of manufacturer (a demo of the Army Design System is posted at the TiSpork Site). For more about the game, I'l just quote from the website:

What is Aetherverse?

Aetherverse is a tabletop sci-fi wargame that I first published in 2004. The concept of the game was to create a sort of “universal” rules system that players could use to create and play with armies sourced from any of the many miniatures manufacturers on the market. While this had been done before in a generic sense, I designed the system to build armies that had real character rather than just being a collection of numbers.

What’s the game like?

Designed to be fairly fast-paced (the 2nd edition cuts the required die rolls down by at least 25%), the game is a mid-scale tabletop wargame (20-50 models in an army is sort of the “core” target). The system uses a “weighted random” activation system which keeps both players active during the course of a game turn (rather than a clumsy system in which one player does everything while the other sits and watches) and allows for true tactical movement such as feints and outflanking maneuvers.

Why a Second Edition?

It’s been a long time since the original was published, and it sort of abruptly vanished. The company that handled printing and distribution went out of business, and I went through a number of years where I simply could not spend any time on the game or the company I’d started to publish it. I felt that now is a good time to get to work on revising the game, though: the advent of Kickstarter has made it a really great time for miniatures collectors, so there are a lot of people out there making excellent minis that may not necessarily have a rules system to go with them.

This release consists of the core rules: everything that one needs to create a standard army consisting of infantry of various types along with for any other model that would be supported by similar rules. Every month, we’ll be adding a new section of the rules: rules for solo models, for vehicles of various types, rules for psi-powers (magic), etc. The complete release schedule is as follows:
--1 May 2013: Core Rules
--5 June 2013: Personalities and Commanders
--3 July 2013: Vehicles
--7 August 2013: Aircraft and Artillery
--4 September 2013: Magic and Mutation
--2 October 2013: Cover and Terrain Overhaul

This version of Aetherverse is and always will be free. Eventually we’ll look into doing a Kickstarter to create a printed book and a “pretty” digital version containing full-color art and additional background material, but the text of the rules themselves will remain a free game, released under a Creative Commons license as noted in the rulebook file.

As always, feedback is welcome, through comments on this post (or the one in the Misc Games forum), through the TiSpork forums, or through any of our social media contact methods.

Finally, and this is very important: word of the game travels best through word of mouth. If you like it, or just the idea of it, please share word of this release with your gaming groups, on your own social media, or on gaming sites that you might frequent (even occasionally on Dakka!)

I thank all of you for your support now and in the future!

 Magc8Ball wrote:
Aetherverse is a tabletop sci-fi wargame that I first published in 2004.

Wow... has it really been that long?


Good to see you back

 insaniak wrote:

 Magc8Ball wrote:
Aetherverse is a tabletop sci-fi wargame that I first published in 2004.

Wow... has it really been that long?

Indeed it has. Lots of starts, stops, and restarts, but we're finally in a good place to get this going again.

The current release is the result of a few months' work, and I've actually set myself a schedule for the remainder of it, so that I have deadlines in place. That was part of the problem with earlier attempts: I just sort of trailed off with things. That won't happen here!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
ALSO:

Because I apparently suck at this, I built the armies in the first released version using a "mental copy" of the old weapon costs. These were changed in the 2nd Edition, but I blanked on that.

The 1.01 version with fixed army list costs has now been updated.

I hate having a day 1 fix. Makes me feel like GW.

I figured that since it is one of the "selling" points (as much as a free game can be "sold"), I should post more about the activation system. This is crossposted from the TiSpork website:

One of the things that sets Aetherverse apart from a number of the larger games available is its turn sequence. Rather than the boring, traditional “I Go, You Go” system where one player does everything while the other player sits and watches them roll dice, Aetherverse uses an activation system in which both players are active throughout the turn. I have uploaded page 11 from the rulebook, which summarizes the turn sequence, allowing potential players to see how Aetherverse differs from other games. I have also posted the sequence below.

Aetherverse Turn Sequence

1. Collect activation tokens / Shuffle activation deck (be sure to remove markers for dead units). See the end for a more detailed description of the activation system.

2. Draw activation marker.

3. Activate a Unit: The player indicated by the marker chooses one of their units that has not yet been activated and performs up to two actions. No action may be performed twice, except “Move”. Actions may be performed in any order, except that units with models in base-to base contact (“Melee contact”) with enemy models may only move (either moving models closer to enemies or a “withdrawal move”, see the movement section for details) or perform melee strikes.

The possible actions:

-Move (Default move distance is 6”)
-Shoot
-Charge
-Melee (requires models in base contact with an enemy, may only be performed once per activation)
-Take Cover (prevents further actions but makes the unit harder to hit with shooting)
-Pass

4. Repeat steps 2 and 3 until there are no remaining markers

5. Perform “End of Turn Cleanup”

-Remove markers for any dead units
-Resolve “until end of turn” effects
-Check for victory conditions being met and/or game end

Unit Activation:

Aetherverse uses a weighted random initiative system that can be performed with a few different methods. Regardless of which method you choose, you’ll be starting each turn by doing one of the following.

1. Count out a number of glass beads/colored dice for each player equal to the number of their units. Each player must have a distinct color from the others. Place the markers in an opaque cup or a hat, then draw when required.

2. Count out a number of playing cards for each player’s units; each player is assigned a suit (or a color if they
have more than 13 units). Shuffle these together and deal one out when activation is required.

Can you upload this to a different site? I'm in Afghanistan, and it says the website you are using is a "Violations of your service", saying that this site had nudity and risque content. I am interested in this, I just can't view it.

 Firehead158 wrote:
Can you upload this to a different site? I'm in Afghanistan, and it says the website you are using is a "Violations of your service", saying that this site had nudity and risque content. I am interested in this, I just can't view it.

Erm... yeah, let me see what I can do!

What I just uploaded was directly quoted in the post (the turn sequence) so the PDF of that isn't needed. As to the whole rulebook, I'll see if I can grab a different host.

And then I'll figure out where the content warning is coming from. Can you tell if it's the military firewall blocking the site, or something else?

EDIT: Alright, I've uploaded v1.01 of the rules to RapidShare. Let me know if that works for you!

Edited: wasn't working, but is now working. Thanks a lot! I'll get to reading

 Firehead158 wrote:
Edited: wasn't working, but is now working. Thanks a lot! I'll get to reading

I'm glad to help! Feel free to ask questions here, especially if you can't get to the main game site from overseas.

I've just skimmed this so far (wrapping up the semester right now... trying to worry about getting decent grades rather than spend all my time hobbying ) but how does the buy-your-stats system balance? It seems like it would be really open to abuse, based on my experience with playing RPGs with several min-max'ers.

Like any system where the player has control over their forces to this degree, there are always going to be abuses present, it is just about limiting the damage on my end. I have some safeguards to try and keep balance in place.

First, instead of having highly flexible unit sizes, I decided to change to a more rigid system similar to Warmachine where a unit's size is based on its Tech Level stat. This limits spam possibilities, especially once I put vehicles back in the game (since the number of elite and support units you can field are based on the number of basic units, this prevents a high-TEK army from just throwing out a bunch of cheap Basic units to unlock more powerful support options).

Second, there is a cost minimum for units. Someone can't just field 300 5 point models.

Finally, this is a living rulebook. The most important thing that makes the game different than others is that I care about it, and that I'm not using it to sell models. I'm not going to make something overpowered to push plastic, and if I need to Nerf an ability, I have no problems doing so, especially since I'm not invalidating someone's collection by doing so: if they feel their army was screwed by a change, they can just design a new army using the same models. By definition, I cannot possibly make a model useless.

I hope those answers help!

Edited a bit for clarity; the original post was made on a tablet.

Had a bit of a hiccup with my webhost this morning (maybe last night, too) but this has been resolved. If you tried to get to the site and couldn't, please try again!

Version 1.02 of the Alpha Release is now available! Once again it's a few days early, but I don't think anyone minds. Download the newest update directly!

This update brings Leaders and Personalities into the game. Leaders are single models capable of boosting the stats of friendly units or even granting special powers to those units. Leaders can also bring along a command unit which is capable of increasing the range at which they can command their troops. These squads range from primitive drum beating or flag waving up to satellite transmission systems or even psychic messages. Personalities are similarly single-model units, though they tend more towards the "heroic deeds" end of the spectrum.

This continues the monthly release plan for Aetherverse 2nd Edition, where I'll add in a new segment of the rules until the game is entirely complete and ready for a full publishing run.

Feedback on the game is always welcome here or at the Titanium Spork Gaming website.

As scheduled, version 1.03 (the Vehicles Update) is now live. Download Link.

This update brings rules for fielding vehicles of all types into the game: everything from lumbering beasts loaded with troops to armored personnel carriers to massive 4-legged walkers to nimble hovering tanks bristling with firepower. The rules for fielding these machines (and creatures!) as well as the means by which you can create them are included in this latest update.

With the Vehicle Rules complete, this leaves only two more major updates of the rules remaining. Next month will see the Aircraft and Artillery release, and finally in September we will release the Magic and Mutation update. Once these two updates are complete, Aetherverse 2nd Edition will be finished and we will begin the process of looking forward to an official publication of a true rulebook.

As usual, thanks for your continued support, and please spread the word! We had some great feedback (both at TiSpork and here) to help make a quality vehicle release, and more people talking about the game will help us make it even better going forward.

More information about the game can be found at the Aetherverse Page on the site.

Glad to see progress still moving along. Have you ever thought of posting some intro videos on youtube? Just to explain the rules and maybe show a few rounds of play so people can get a better idea about the game?

I have to get around to downloading the rules myself, but I'm thrilled to see you keeping up with it.

Videos are definitely on the to-do list. I was planning to do a battle report last month, but a family vacation took more time and energy than I had expected. I should be able to get some more demo/example things up this month, including videos.

Thanks!

Are there any lists of suggested stat lines for generic fantasy/sci-fi archetypes? Humans, elves, orcs, dwarves, zombies, skeletons, gene-modded humans wearing "mighty armor" or even "strategic juggernaut armor", bug-like aliens, ogres, minotaurs, goat-men, etc?

 bbb wrote:
Are there any lists of suggested stat lines for generic fantasy/sci-fi archetypes? Humans, elves, orcs, dwarves, zombies, skeletons, gene-modded humans wearing "mighty armor" or even "strategic juggernaut armor", bug-like aliens, ogres, minotaurs, goat-men, etc?

The rulebook has a number of example army lists in it, some of which are based on fairly standard tropes. In addition, a couple of users in the TiSpork forums have done some work creating statlines for some of the things that you are talking about. As the last two updates get into place, I'll be adding to the example army lists in the book as well, since more than a few lists from the first edition rely on traits that won't be plugged into the game until that point. For instance, the 1E book had an all-organic alien race in it, but I need to rebalance the army characteristic that allowed it to actually function, so they'll be waiting until the last update. Similarly, there's a really cool Victorian British Empire In Space list from the 1E book that's waiting on artillery to be put in with the next update.

See the original post at the TiSpork site.

Release 1.04 of Aetherverse 2nd Edition, the Aircraft and Artillery update, is now available for free download (PDF file, updated 29 July 2013). This is the release originally planned for 7 August, but we bumped it ahead by one week to allow for more time to work on the Magic/Superscience update (as well as possibly working in a balance update in the middle of August).

This update adds rules for both Artillery (support fire called in from off the tabletop) and Aircraft (as well as Helicopters, a new vehicle type for Aetherverse). These new features provide even more ways to represent any sort of army that one can imagine. One interesting note about the Artillery rules is that there is no requirement to have a model for those units, as their attacks come from well away from the center of action (or even from space). This doesn’t mean that they’re impossible to stop, as they can be fired upon by aircraft and other artillery, and because each type of artillery has to be called in by models on the tabletop. Kill those models, and you stop the artillery. The interplay among artillery-summoning models, counterbattery fire, and aircraft zooming across the table will add new and exciting moments of drama in your battles.

Another exciting part of the 1.04 update is that it is the first update to include Army Lists designed specifically for use with miniatures produced by a third-party manufacturer! Anvil Industry has graciously allowed us to feature their miniatures in the rules, and the first two such army lists are included in this update. We hope to bring other miniature producers on board as we move forward with the book and later updates.

Version 1.05 of Aetherverse 2nd Edition is now available for download. This update does not add anything particularly new, but rather makes a number of changes to the rules based on playtester feedback that should positively affect gameplay. The specific changes to the rules are listed in the 1.05 change log.

In addition, I have uploaded the first draft of the Magic and Mutation Update! These are still subject to pretty heavy change, of course, but there is quite a bit of new stuff in these draft rules. The Magic and Mutation update is scheduled for full release on the first Wednesday of September.

As always, feedback on these releases is welcome here or at the TiSpork site!

A friend of mine and I played a game of another sci-fi rules set and were quite disappointed. It think it's time I gave Aetherverse another look. Thanks for the update!

 frozenwastes wrote:
A friend of mine and I played a game of another sci-fi rules set and were quite disappointed. It think it's time I gave Aetherverse another look. Thanks for the update!

There've been quite a lot of new rules added to the game in the last couple of months, so there's more "game" there. Thanks for giving it a go, and please share what feedback (positive or not) you have when you do!

Some questions:

1) The turn sequence. I don't remember if it's the same as 1st edition or not. Is it? Or has it been modified. I really like it and it reminds me a lot of Bolt Action but with more flexibility in that you can build your own "orders" by combing two different actions in different combinations.

2) Difficult terrain: "This is considered to apply to the entire move action and occurs once the unit begins to enter the terrain." Why does it say "apply to the entire move action"? If I have 6" of movement and difficult terrain starts 2" away, will I make it 2" into the terrain or 1" Do I have my base move to 3" and just move that, or do I just start halving when I'm actually in the rough terrain? (6-2 = 4. 4/2 = 2, so 2 inches in).

3) Do you get both critical wounds and overkill if you roll a 10 and it also doubles or triples the target number? The extra overkill wound and another die to roll?

4) Pinning tests-- hits or wounds? Wounds lost to lack of LOS don't count, but then pinning mentions hits, not wounds. If it's hits, you may want a note in the section about determining amount of hits that you'll need to remember this number or something.

5) In order to do melee combat with a unit, someone must be in base to base contact, but every miniature can attack an enemy within two inches (four inches if they have the right stats). Do I have this right?

6) Units with different stats among the members of the unit. Are these possible? Say, for examples, I wanted to represent a 3rd edition Black Templars army where some marines are in power armour and are fully trained while others are not yet fully trained and have the worse carapace armour?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also: "Matter/Antimatter: ... If two personalities whose six primary stats are identical and are the same size ever come into base-to-base contact in a melee and one is killed, a dimension storm occurs. All models within 3” of the killed personality immediately suffer a hit with DAM equal to the dead personality’s PRE" (p 19).

No thank you. You should label setting specific rules in specific call out boxes or side bars. I'm not interested in playing Aetherverse in the fictional universe described therein, but in using the rules to represent what I want. Setting specific rules should probably be labeled as optional or otherwise separated from the main rules text.

This is the first instance of setting specific rules I've noticed. Are there any others?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well, there's also the Aetherstorm scenario. I guess that's setting specific, but not as blatant as an explosion happening when someone dies just because the person they are fighting is similar. Other than being mentioned in the roll-off table for scenario, Aetherstorm is pretty segregated.

 frozenwastes wrote:
Some questions:

Answers inline. There's also a thread down in Misc. Games for more questions, but I'll do these here.

1) The turn sequence. I don't remember if it's the same as 1st edition or not. Is it? Or has it been modified. I really like it and it reminds me a lot of Bolt Action but with more flexibility in that you can build your own "orders" by combing two different actions in different combinations.

It's been modified since 1st edition: it used to be similar but now there's more freedom of action, and treating everything in the game the same (there used to be discrete phases for melee, for instance) it let me streamline things a LOT.

2) Difficult terrain: "This is considered to apply to the entire move action and occurs once the unit begins to enter the terrain." Why does it say "apply to the entire move action"? If I have 6" of movement and difficult terrain starts 2" away, will I make it 2" into the terrain or 1" Do I have my base move to 3" and just move that, or do I just start halving when I'm actually in the rough terrain? (6-2 = 4. 4/2 = 2, so 2 inches in).

The latter: halve your remaining movement when you get to the terrain. This will probably get reworded with the October update, when I'm planning to do a complete overhaul of the terrain and cover system.

3) Do you get both critical wounds and overkill if you roll a 10 and it also doubles or triples the target number? The extra overkill wound and another die to roll?

It does. This is one of the ways in which extremely-high-TEK (and very low model count armies) are balanced with low-TEK (and extremely high model count) armies.

4) Pinning tests-- hits or wounds? Wounds lost to lack of LOS don't count, but then pinning mentions hits, not wounds. If it's hits, you may want a note in the section about determining amount of hits that you'll need to remember this number or something.

Pinning tests' TNs were just changed from wounds to hits in this most recent update. I probably still need to fix wordings that refer to the old way.

5) In order to do melee combat with a unit, someone must be in base to base contact, but every miniature can attack an enemy within two inches (four inches if they have the right stats). Do I have this right?

This is correct!

6) Units with different stats among the members of the unit. Are these possible? Say, for examples, I wanted to represent a 3rd edition Black Templars army where some marines are in power armour and are fully trained while others are not yet fully trained and have the worse carapace armour?

This isn't possible currently in the rules. It's one of the few limiting factors in the rules, but it was that or add in a ton of extra rules crunch regarding models in a unit that are different. In the end I wanted to keep units nice and coherent in their stats/armor.

Also: "Matter/Antimatter: ... If two personalities whose six primary stats are identical and are the same size ever come into base-to-base contact in a melee and one is killed, a dimension storm occurs. All models within 3” of the killed personality immediately suffer a hit with DAM equal to the dead personality’s PRE" (p 19).

No thank you. You should label setting specific rules in specific call out boxes or side bars. I'm not interested in playing Aetherverse in the fictional universe described therein, but in using the rules to represent what I want. Setting specific rules should probably be labeled as optional or otherwise separated from the main rules text.

This is the first instance of setting specific rules I've noticed. Are there any others?

You're welcome to ignore that rule if you want.

Well, there's also the Aetherstorm scenario. I guess that's setting specific, but not as blatant as an explosion happening when someone dies just because the person they are fighting is similar. Other than being mentioned in the roll-off table for scenario, Aetherstorm is pretty segregated.

To my knowledge there's not anything else in the rules that is particularly setting-specific (though the scenario is a fairly generic sci-fi/fantasy "heroes gathered together randomly and must FIGHT!" trope rather than specific to the setting in any way other than name). I'll consider the suggestion to mark those, at least.

There's indeed very little setting specific stuff. When I hit the personality rules it just really jumped out at me as there is nothing before that (as far as the rules go) which made me think the game was about representing a specific setting. I sort of got the sense that it was universal rather than setting specific and then suddenly people are exploding because they murder their extra-dimensional twin.

As for representing different stats in each unit, I think it's a fine as is, but as far as optional rules or house rules, I'm going to look at some other rules here and there. It's easy on the attacker's side because you just handle it like different weapons being fired. When it comes to different armour and defenses, that's when it gets tricky. I'm going to avoid the issue entirely in my test game later this week.

 frozenwastes wrote:
There's indeed very little setting specific stuff. When I hit the personality rules it just really jumped out at me as there is nothing before that (as far as the rules go) which made me think the game was about representing a specific setting. I sort of got the sense that it was universal rather than setting specific and then suddenly people are exploding because they murder their extra-dimensional twin.

The "setting" is primarily there to justify the universality of the rules, that's all.

As for representing different stats in each unit ... when it comes to different armour and defenses, that's when it gets tricky.

Yeah, and that's specifically why it's not in the game. It really is because I don't quite feel up to the challenge of trying to write that part without leaving it open to weird shenanigans like those that 40K has been subjected to over the years with mixed units.

 Magc8Ball wrote:

The "setting" is primarily there to justify the universality of the rules, that's all.

That's what I figured. And it's what made me find the exploding twin thing so out of place. Even a line that says "If you are playing in the Aetherverse setting..." would help.

Yeah, and that's specifically why it's not in the game. It really is because I don't quite feel up to the challenge of trying to write that part without leaving it open to weird shenanigans like those that 40K has been subjected to over the years with mixed units.

Warmachine has been spoiling me in that individual models shoot individual models so it is a non issue. But if you start getting up to 80 models a side and different CON and ARM within a squad suddenly becomes common, it can really bog things down. And then add in things like different sizes in the same squad and you might have LOS issues as well.

I'm already thinking of some ideas that might be a good way to go to handle this, but they always seem to hit the same issue: where do excess wounds go after all the people with one type of defenses are dead and the others are not?

EDIT: I also wanted to add that I actually own a titanium spork. Specifically this one: http://www.mec.ca/product/4017-231/snow-peak-titanium-spork/?f=10&q=titanium%2Bspork

I've started making my first army list and realized what is missing from the rules.

A discussion of average stats and different ways of representing things. What are the stats of an average human trooper? That sort of thing. The example army lists all have very fancy names for things and while I'm beginning to see how different things might be represented, it's not obvious.

Page 40 has a graphical representation of a three of the stats (Strength, Tech, and Presence, though the TEK image should probably be amended to say it covers 0-9 rather than 1-10). I will probably add a more text-based description of averages and such at a later date, but it should be possible to extrapolate from that pic.

In 1E the "human average" was actually in the building rules (the points cost for each stat was just "one point per" up to 4, and then became "add the value of the next level"); when I changed the building rules in 2E to remove the arbitrary "it gets more expensive here" point at 4, I didn't think to add in a descriptor for it. Thanks for reminding me about it.

For reference,
-Modern, average, decently-trained human soldiers will have 3's in their physical stats (STR, DEX, CON). Those with exceptional training in one of those disciplines would hit 4. 5+ in those stats would imply "enhancement" beyond what is currently possible through normal training techniques.

-The world's current military technology level (at least in modern nations) is around 4. The US, especially in regards to the Air Force, would be considered on the borderline of 5, while those relying on older tech or that have poor maintenance might even fall into 3.

-Morale is largely a matter of taste for the army, and is more likely to be affected by army characteristics than anything else, but a starting point for (say) an average solider would be 3-4. This varies wildly based on the specific circumstances of an army's training and conditions.

-Presence is again a matter of taste; most individuals aren't really all that scary, nor do they carry a particularly large force of will. Even en masse, a modern military unit isn't directly "scary" in the sense of wanting to run away just from their appearance. I usually baseline this around 2 or so, but armies/units that focus more on melee will of course be higher.

Tech Level (TEK) can probably be summed up as follows using references to known examples:

0: No capability of using tools. These are either feral creatures or an organic race capable of "growing" their weaponry rather than building it. 40K's Tyranids fit here, as does Starcraft's Zerg.

1: Stone age tech. Clubs, spears, slings.

2: Metal age: From the Greek Phalanx to the advent of the crossbow, this covers most classical, medieval, and renaissance era armies. Gunpowder is *possible* here, but probably in units that have had their TEK boosted within an otherwise TEK 2 army (such as support units with cannons or an elite unit with very early arquebuses).

40K's Orks go here (with a healthy dose of the Technology Magic school featured in 1.06).

3: Gunpowder Age: The basic trooper is equipped with some sort of gunpowder-based weapon, and more advanced units within the army will be capable of creating significant firepower. This can cover the range from the Napoleonic War through WW2, and though the differences between the armies in this era are significant I believe that they can be represented through army construction and through other stats (a Napoleonic infantry unit will have a Heavy 1 weapon, while a WW2 infantryman will carry an Assault 2 weapon). A TEK 3 army can field a TEK 4 vehicle, allowing fliers to first appear here.

Warmachine would also fit in TEK 3 (with significant additions of magic, of course, as well as the Construct unit trait that is appearing in 1.06).

4: Modern military.

5: Beginnings of SciFi, though more Sci than Fi. Things that are currently being developed for deployment in 20-30 years would certainly qualify here. Computer technology could certainly be seen as fitting into TEK 5. The more backwards Warhammer 40K armies (the Imperial Guard, even some Space Marine chapters) would be well-represented by TEK 5 as would the movie version of the Starship Troopers marines. The Imperial Army of Star Wars would probably fit here, though many of their units will be bumped to TEK 6 with stat bonuses.

6: Definitely well into the realm of sci-fi, and not something we'll see within a couple of hundred years (give or take the fact that humans always seem to underestimate how fast tech moves forward). Some aspects of Star Trek might fit here, as would Starcraft's Terrans and pretty much the rest of 40K's Space Marines.

7: Extremely advanced, but still recognizably human (or at least mortal). 40K's Eldar would fit here (though they'll rely heavily on their PRE more than their TEK) as would the more advanced levels of Starfleet.

8: Bordering on trans-human technology. Beings at this level may be functionally immortal. Starcraft's Protoss fit here, as would 40K's Necrons (though the higher-functioning lords would certainly reach 9 or even 10).

9 and 10 are... very difficult to describe. Babylon 5's Vorlons live here; it would very likely also include the Marvel Movie version of Asgardians.

Awesome post. Very useful info.

I ended up testing the game out with a friend. He wanted to get his Grey Knights dusted off and actually get them on the table. I figured them repelling a daemonic attack would be appropriate and figured out stats for both armies. It was very wierd making two elite forces when I wasn't quite sure where normal should be. I ended up giving the daemons too high of a STR and the Grey Knights probably should have been 1 higher in many of their stats.

The game worked. Daemonic Summoning when you place within 6" of another Chaos model not scattering is super, super strong. I still lost, but it was shocking how easily I could precision place my units.

My opponent asked me to send him a link to the rules and we're going to stat up new stuff now that we better understand how the rules work (and given the info in your post above) and it should see play again within a couple weeks.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just wanted to add that based of your post, I definitely made some stat choice errors. I also picked the stats and then picked some traits which added to them, which ended up pushing them much higher than where they should have been. The daemons ended up with a PRE of 9 for example. Oops.

PRE 9 demons is not exactly a "bad" choice, especially if you're going to run some of them as casters. It might be too high for representing 40K daemons straight from the codex... but the nice thing about AV is that you can tweak things to fit the background materials far better because the stats have a much wider functional range.