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Who wins in these pairings and why?

Angron-Horus?
Angron-Johnson?
Johnson-Horus?
Curze- Corax?
Perturabo-Ferrus?
Fulgrim-Sanguinus?
Fulgrim-Lorgar?
Khan-Russ?
Mortarion-Dorn?
Vulkan-Guilliman
Magnus-Mortation?

These fights are all pre-heresy/ No Deamon powers. No need for traitors vs loyalist since this is before the heresy. What matchups I missed would be epic?

My winners are ....

Where is russ?
Edit: nvm found him

Angron-Horus? -Horus
Angron-Johnson?-Johnson
Johnson-Horus?- Johnson
Curze- Corax? -Corax
Perturabo-Ferrus?-Ferrus
Fulgrim-Sanguinus?-Sanguinus
Fulgrim-Lorgar?-Fulgrim
Khan-Russ?-Russ
Mortarion-Dorn?-Mortarion
Vulkan-Guilliman-Vulkan
Magnus-Mortation? -Magnus

IMO in the battles vs Angron, I felt those are the only two who could beat Angron in a hand to hand battle. The hardest one of all to pick for me was the Mortarion/Dorn fight, Fulgrim/Sanguinus was a toughy, but had to give it to the Angel.

Personal opinion?

Angron-Horus? Angron
Angron-Johnson? Angron
Johnson-Horus? Horus
Curze- Corax? Curze
Perturabo-Ferrus? Ferrus
Fulgrim-Sanguinus? Sanguinus
Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim
Khan-Russ? Khan
Mortarion-Dorn? Dorn
Vulkan-Guilliman? Gulliman
Magnus-Mortation? Mortarion

Angron-Horus? Horus (Close)
Angron-Johnson? Angron (Just Barely)
Johnson-Horus? Horus (Just Barely)
Curze- Corax? Curze (Almost Even)
Perturabo-Ferrus? Perturabo (Almost Even)
Fulgrim-Sanguinus? Sanguinus (Basically Even)
Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim (Squash Match)
Khan-Russ? Russ (Russ Cleanly)
Mortarion-Dorn? Mortarion (Mortarion Easily)
Vulkan-Guilliman? Vulkan (Close)
Magnus-Mortation? Magnus (Close but less Close than the others)

And for fun in a battle royale between every one of them I say it comes down to Russ vs Sanguinus, with Sanguinus being the victor

Why would you say the Fulgrim/Lorgar match up would be a squash match?

Dorn gets stomped easily? hadn't thought it would have been that easy.

Is Lorgar the weakest of the Primarchs?

Who would win in the battle Royale? Sanguinus?

Fulgrim is super skilled with a blade and Lorgar was more a preacher than a warrior, obviously he was a primarch so naturally badass but I think Fulgrim would have trounced him.

As for Dorn I just see Mortarion being a beast who was unorthodox and dangerous, so I see Dorn expecting a more tactical duel whereas Mortarion will surprise him with brutaleness

As for the battle royale, Sanguinius because I've always viewed him as the most powerful of the Primarchs, with Horus only besting him due to Sanguinius being tired and Horus being amped up on Chaos juice

I don't think you guys are giving Lorgar enough credit. He fought An'ggrath by himself in martial combat and won. Sanguinius, considered one of the best warriors among the Primarchs, got his legs broken by Ka'Bandha, who doesn't have anything on An'ggrath. If I recall correctly, he also kicked the crap out of Daemon Fulgrim. This all happened in Aurelian, which I understand hasn't been read by a lot of people due to its limited nature. However, I think its events are worth noting as far as measuring Lorgar's battle capabilities.

To expand on my earlier hasty answer:

Angron-Horus? Angron
Angron-Johnson? Angron

I've said before and will continue to believe that Angron's relentless fury is actually a very well thought out strategy. (If you attack your opponent hard enough and fast enough and with enough aggression, then you force them to fight back using the same strategy, which you will be theoretically be better at because you're more experienced with it. The beauty of this tactic is that you can always go harder, so if you ever (ever) lose, then you can always chalk it up to not having attacked hard enough or fast enough, and if you live, you get even more aggressive the next time.) I think Angron is actually one of the smartest primarchs, since this battle tactic is actually a fairly sensible way to go about attacking other people with superhuman intelligence, since it's pretty hard to counter.

Johnson-Horus? Horus

I've read several of the Horus Heresy novels, and they have all failed to instill any awe in the Lion in me. I think both of them are stand up, chivalric fighters, but Horus is better. (And even if he isn't, I think the Mournival is willing to cheat to ensure his victory, while Johnson's inner circle isn't.)

Curze- Corax? Curze

Both of them use stealth to their advantage, and seem about equally skilled at it, but Curze is willing to go way, way farther than Corax to win a fight.

Perturabo-Ferrus? Ferrus

I think the only real fight where we see Ferrus Manus, he's more or less getting suckerpunched. This is really a fight between the progenitors of the two window-dressing legions, that both kind of get the short end of the stick from a hobbyist's perspective. I say Ferrus because I think he's a scotche better.

Fulgrim-Sanguinus? Sanguinus

This is based purely on a story perpective, and is actually dependent on whether or not there are witnesses. From a story perspective, what would fit with the stories of these two would be if Sanguinus wins if there are witnesses, but Fulgrim wins if they are alone. Sanguinus always being lauded as the golden boy and Fulgrim's consistent failure to achieve his goals of perfection are both served best by these outcomes.

Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim

If the scenario were one of oratory or inspiration, Lorgar would probably win. But in a fistfight? Fulgrim handles Lorgar with ease. His curse is that he's, like, second best at everything. Lorgar is, in my opinion, not even in the top ten when it comes to Primarchs in a brawl.

Khan-Russ? Khan

Too close to call. Vikings versus mongols? I side with mongols, but that's only out of personal preference rather than any informed opinion.

Mortarion-Dorn? Dorn

If it's a scenario where Mortarion attacks Dorn, Dorn wins, and I think Dorn is smart enough to lure Mortarion into just such a situation.

Vulkan-Guilliman? Gulliman

I like Vulkan, he's my personal favorite Primarch, but Gulliman is the Space Marine poster child. I think one or two of the Primarchs might have been able to beat him in a dust up, (his perfection is the structure of his legion, not his own personal prowess) but Vulkan wasn't among the number. My money says Gulliman wins by a narrow margin.

Magnus-Mortation? Mortarion

Pre Heresy, Magnus didn't have all the psychic tomfoolery that attracts his legions of fans to him. He was just a dabbler, and Mortarion could probably put him down.

All of those, of course, are my heavily biased personal opinion.

 Jimsolo wrote:

Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim

If the scenario were one of oratory or inspiration, Lorgar would probably win. But in a fistfight? Fulgrim handles Lorgar with ease. His curse is that he's, like, second best at everything. Lorgar is, in my opinion, not even in the top ten when it comes to Primarchs in a brawl.

Fulgrim handles him with ease? Not even in the top ten? Lorgar almost killed Fulgrim in Aurelian; a daemon-possessed Fulgrim, no less. He would have killed him if Horus hadn't stopped him. Not to mention, I'll reiterate, he defeated An'ggrath the Unbound in a one on one fight. You know, the lord of all Bloodthirsters? The Bloodthirster that's so bad, the Inquisition and Grey Knights only speak of him in whispers? The guy whose names invokes dread in even the greatest the Imperium has to offer? The daemon who roflstomped entire worlds on his own? Lorgar defeated him in a one on one, martial fight that he had almost no preparation for. I'm no Word Bearers fanboy, but these actions speak for themselves. If Lorgar is capable of beating Khorne's most powerful servant in a one-on-one fight, I'd say he has a good chance of going toe-to-toe with any of the Primarchs.

*something about the Primarchs being largely evenly matched and it depending predominantly on circumstance*

 Just Dave wrote:
*something about the Primarchs being largely evenly matched and it depending predominantly on circumstance*

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Darth Bob wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:

Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim

If the scenario were one of oratory or inspiration, Lorgar would probably win. But in a fistfight? Fulgrim handles Lorgar with ease. His curse is that he's, like, second best at everything. Lorgar is, in my opinion, not even in the top ten when it comes to Primarchs in a brawl.

Fulgrim handles him with ease? Not even in the top ten? Lorgar almost killed Fulgrim in Aurelian; a daemon-possessed Fulgrim, no less. He would have killed him if Horus hadn't stopped him.

He sucker jumped on deamon possesed Fulgrim, much like Perturabo did in AE , Fulrim is no.1 swordsman of all primarchs (according to Perurabo), give him a sword he'll slice and dice every one of them....Without a sword I say he's a bit weak, but with his blade....My money is on him, always....



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Angron-Horus? Horus
Angron-Johnson? Angron
Johnson-Horus? Horus
Curze- Corax? Curze
Perturabo-Ferrus? Ferrus
Fulgrim-Sanguinus? Fulgrim
Fulgrim-Lorgar? Fulgrim
Khan-Russ? Tie
Mortarion-Dorn? Dorn
Vulkan-Guilliman Vulkan
Magnus-Mortation? Morty