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Hi guys this is my current list for my farsight enclave list its not 2k yet but i am having alot of trouble filling in the last points all advice on changes also be helpful all help will be taken under consideration.

HQ
Farsight

4 x Body Guard
2 plasma rifles each
1 flamer each

2 x Body Guard
2 fusion blasters each
1 target lock each

1 x Body Guard
TL flamer
commander and control node
multi-spectrum sensor suit
xv8-02 irdium armour
puretide chip
nearoweb jammer
repulsion impact shield
vector retro thrusters
12 x Gun drones

Shadowsun

HQ section

Troops

6 Fire worriers

6 Fire worriers

6 Fire worriers

6 Fire worriers

Troops total

Elites

XV104 Riptide
Iron Accelerator
Feel No Pain

XV104 Riptide
Iron Accelerator
Feel No Pain

3x Xv8
2 x flamers each

Elites total

Fast Attack

6 x pathfinders

6 x pathfinders

Fast Attack total

Grand Total

One of my main concerns is the 3 flamers suits i am not sure if i should change them to having 3 missile pods 1 Tl one normal one but i feel as i have enough anti tank.

Thanks for looking and i hope you give me some enjoyable feed back.

Please do not post point values in your army list--thanks
--Ryan

XV8's with flamers, just seems weak. Basically you are making them assault bait.

Remove all flamers from every model (and the flamer crisis are just useless), give a bodyguard Drone Controller, and every single suit except the one with all the toys should have Target Lock as well. I recomment 1 dual blaster, 3 dual plasma, 2 dual missile pods. Use kroots + hound instead of FWs, they are cheaper, more positionally flexible and you won't shoot with your troops anyway. I personally don't think Riptides are useful here, you already have plenty of VP2 weapons and they force you to take ML sources as well (and pathfinders are horrible), whereas if you only use the bodyguard unit, broadsides and skyrays you are not dependant on MLs at all (which is good, since they will be the primary target of any army you face). What you most definitely will need are 3 broadsides with full missiles (and drones) and EWO, and a couple of skyrays for AA. If your meta is not flyer-intensive, you could use a single skyray and 3+3 broadsides. I would also consider Eldar allies for psychic protection.

I see what you mean with flamers but i was thinking of moving the impact shield to the flamers and thrusters i always though they was weak but in the last 3 battles they raked up around 30-40 kills deepstrike burn elder guardians is so good but i think i may get some missile sides / skyray i was thinking i could get a eldred if he is cheaper and change the 2 riptidess to the heavey bursts guide them both they will kill any flyers easy and help with hordes and other things even space marines with the rending and more reliable then the blast even without sky fire so i may just change them to bursttides for this purpose on the other hand if i can free up some points i could take 3 missile sides also 2 skyrays so i need to free up some points.

kyle foster wrote:
I see what you mean with flamers but i was thinking of moving the impact shield to the flamers and thrusters i always though they was weak but in the last 3 battles they raked up around 30-40 kills deepstrike burn elder guardians is so good but i think i may get some missile sides / skyray i was thinking i could get a eldred if he is cheaper and change the 2 riptidess to the heavey bursts guide them both they will kill any flyers easy and help with hordes and other things even space marines with the rending and more reliable then the blast even without sky fire so i may just change them to bursttides for this purpose on the other hand if i can free up some points i could take 3 missile sides also 2 skyrays so i need to free up some points.

The impact shield is another waste of points. With this list, if you get locked in CC without wanting to, it's because you made a mistake. The flamers may do some damage to light troops before exploding, but they are a wase of pointss since Taus can saturate so much the same job can be done by units that aren't useless vs everything else (think about how many elder guardians can be killed by Broadsides in a game... an average of 18 per turn). Heavy burst Riptides are awful, the only decent configuration is with ion cannon. But as i said, while they may be good in regular Tau lists, they are wasted with a Farsight list. I would remove both Riptides, honestly. I would use a list like this:

Commander Farsight
Commander Shadowsun

Crisis bodyguard team
Crisis bodyguard, C&C node, MSSS, PENchip, retro-thrusters, drone controller
Crisis bodyguard, 2 fusion blasters, target lock, neuroweb system jammer
Crisis bodyguard, 2 plasma rifles, target lock, onager gauntlet
Crisis bodyguard, 2 plasma rifles, target lock
Crisis bodyguard, 2 plasma rifles, target lock
Crisis bodyguard, 2 missile pods, target lock
Crisis bodyguard, 2 missile pods, target lock
14 gun drones

10 kroots, hound
10 kroots, hound

skyray, blacksun filter, disruption pod
skyray, blacksun filter, disruption pod
broadsides team
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, early warning override, bonded
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, early warning override, bonded
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, early warning override, bonded
6 missile drones


Eldrad Ulthran

3 guardian jetbikes


Aegis defence line, comms relay

I like your suggestion what would the aim of the aegis be just for the broadsides? i really like riptides so i want atleast one i think there are really good for there points but so are broadsides. would dropping some taget locks on plasma be good as farsight wont very often be fireing at a target on his own freeing up some points for riptieds more broadsides.

kyle foster wrote:
I like your suggestion what would the aim of the aegis be just for the broadsides? i really like riptides so i want atleast one i think there are really good for there points but so are broadsides. would dropping some taget locks on plasma be good as farsight wont very often be fireing at a target on his own freeing up some points for riptieds more broadsides.

The ADL is to give cover to Broadsides and Skyrays, but most importantly for the comms relay: you will start with your troops (all kroots and jetbikes) in Reserve, and you want them to STAY in Reserve at least until turn 3, by then you should have removed things that can hurt them. Remember that with comms relay you can re-roll successful Reserve rolls as well. For 70 points, it's TOTALLY worth it, the longer your troops are not a target, the more time you have to kill everything that can threaten them and use them to grab objectives. Games are won with objectives (most scenarios, at least), you should try to keep your troops alive because a smart opponent will target them and prevent you from winning. No having them on the table is the best way to protect them...

Riptides are good (sort of...), but not in this particular list: you already have plenty of AP2 weapons, you don' need them, broadsides on the other hand provide saturation that is needed versus a lot of armies. Furthermore, Riptides lose a lot of effectiveness with few or no markerlights, and in this list everything else does not need them: this is why in this particular list Riptides should not be considered a viable option (btw, i think Riptides are overrated in general, there are strongest choices in the codex). If you really want to use them, go for a regular Tau list, in a Farsight Enclave list they are a waste of points.

No, target locks MUST stay. One of the greatest strength of this list is that the Bodyguards unit can fire at multiple targets, with a variety of weapons tailored to deal with different targets. The primary target for plasmas should be heavily armored units, the primary target for drones should be light infantry (though with their saturation, even MEQs suffer), you need target locks to split fire efficiently.

ah i forgot you need them all with target locks if you want the drones to target there own units, if i was to make a list that was not a farsight bomb what would a good competitive list be ?i would like to use 2 riptides as i think the beat ironheads outright and leave me to take some more broadsides i have not bought farsight yet but have nearly every other model if i was to take a none farsight list what would you go for? as farsight list seems not to have the units in i really enjoy and still be competitive can you give me a bases of a list as you seem to understand what your talking about and have a better current understanding of what want.

Depends on the playstyle you want, static or aggressive? what is your local meta? what models do you own? what units you absolutely want in the list? All these questions need some answers before any advice we give has meaning...

I like a very mobile army currently I own almost every model I really want riptides in the list aggressive mobile play I love. I play mainly vs space marines and elder and nids currently we have not found a club to learn a meta as I only just gt back ino the hobby. I just Playwith mates atm

Riptides are not really aggressive play, since they suck in CC they will stay far, far away, shoot and hide... but if you like them, there's not much to argue about their usefulness. The main problem is that they are Elite, and thus limit your choices for really aggressive units (crisis). Also, with SMs you mean basic SM or some particular chapter? Because vanillas are quite different than BA with 3-4 stormravens... do your enemies have a lot of flyers? Anyway, i would suggest some low AP weapons for SMs (if you have Riptides, they are enough) and then saturate like hell... but this means static units like Broadsides, maybe even FWs with Ethereal. I have to go now, when i come back i will try to give you some more advice.
BTW, there is probably no list as aggressive as a Farsight Enclave list, if you like that style i would definitely suggest that (though you won't use Riptides with it...)

What about a static gun line list?


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Is static viable I so I might try it as I never played it as it looked not as fun

You should remove individual point costs and combined them per suit or unit.

Your lack of troops scare me, perhaps killing off the regular crisis suits for more scoring units would be good

other then that the only weakness i can see would be against AIR.

you could trim some fat and add in some anti air missile sides or a ADL.

normal space marines

Teschio wrote:
The ADL is to give cover to Broadsides and Skyrays,

Are ya sure?

On its stand, there's not 25% Cover for a Skyray ... And a Dispod pretty much does that already.

kyle foster wrote:
I like a very mobile army currently I own almost every model I really want riptides in the list aggressive mobile play I love. I play mainly vs space marines and elder and nids currently we have not found a club to learn a meta as I only just gt back ino the hobby. I just Playwith mates atm

Ok, if your enemies are those, you can try something with a lot of saturation in it. Something along the lines of:

commander, C&C node, MSSS, puretide neurochip, drone controller, retro-thrusters, 2 marker drones [goes with the Crisis]
commander, 2 missile pods, target lock, drone controller, 2 marker drones [goes with marker drones]
crisis bodyguard, fusion blaster, TL fusion blaster, neuroweb system jammer
crisis bodyguard, fusion blaster, TL fusion blaster

Crisis team
crisis, 2 missile pods, target lock
crisis, 2 missile pods, target lock
crisis, 2 missile pods, target lock
6 marker drones
Riptide, ion accelerator, TL fusion blaster, EWO, velocity tracker
Riptide, ion accelerator, TL fusion blaster, EWO, velocity tracker

10 kroots, hound
10 kroots, hound
10 kroots, hound

drone squadron, 4 marker drones

Broadsides team
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
6 missile drones
Broadsides team
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
broadside, HYMPs, SMSs, bonded, EWO
6 missile drones

Aegis defence line, comms relay



The ADL is taken as a cover for Broadsides, and for the comms relay: you want to keep your kroots out as long as possible, until you have eliminated every threat to them, so you will stat with them in Reserve and reroll successfull reserve rolls. It's also very useful to ensure you two Bodyguards (which are separated units, and will both Deep-strike) will arrive on turn 2, and take care of heavily armored vehicles. I didn't include any AA since the armies you talked about don't have lots of flyers, and you have 8 twin-linked drones to take care of them anyway (just one hit means the Broadsides will tear them apart, and Broadsides can do some real damage to flyers even without MLs). The second Commader is taken mainly as additional ML support, because i feel one ML source may not be enough (pathfinders are just a First Blood awaiting to happen). You can keep that unit in Reserve as well if you feel you don't need it right away and fear to lose all your MLs fast (which with JSJ should not be so easy, anyway, and they have a long range as well). BS5 marker drones are quite good for Riptides: you can use 2 ML counters to remove cover and all the rest to boost your BS, so your large blast will not scatter most of the times: a perfect hit with a S8 AP2, Ignore Cover Large Blast can eliminate almost every unit.
As you can see, the list saturates A LOT. Apart from the double Riptide, you will hit on average with 37 S7 missiles a turn, and 18 S5 ones. Enough to annihilate hordes like nids, and seriously hurt SMs as well (they may have 3+ AS, but it's still 14 dead marines a turn if they eat all the missiles). On the Riptide's Velocity Trackers: if you want you can remove them, i usually use them to create a no-fly zone around them in combination with EWO, if you enemies don't use a lot of flyers you can invest those 40 points somewhere else (i recommend a couple more marker drones, and a couple of extra kroots since you have nothing else worth taking with those points). Please bear in mind this list is not optimized to be a TAC list, but it should work well versus the armies you will face frequently.


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Brothererekose wrote:

Teschio wrote:
The ADL is to give cover to Broadsides and Skyrays,

Are ya sure?

On its stand, there's not 25% Cover for a Skyray ... And a Dispod pretty much does that already.

Skyrays have those little "feet" (sorry, i don't know the english word for that) that can be used to deploy it without a stand (it makes sense as well, skymmers can land fast, and since you won't move it all game it's perfectly natural it is on the ground). if you use it like that, there is enough cover (unless the enemy is very tall, like a flyer, or a Riptide, or is in a building/ruin higher floors)
Dpods would do the same, if the skyray moved. But since it's not a Fast vehicle, moving it means it will use only one weapon with BS4, the others with BS1. For this reason, i never move them (unless they risk getting assaulted next turn, and sometimes not even then), and instead deploy them in some terrain that gives cover (or behind ADL). Hammerheads can move every turn since they have only one weapon, skyrays can't. So they need cover from something else, since they won't get it from Jink.

Please do not post point values in your army list--thanks
--Ryan

i like this list is this 2k ? i think your aloud to still post totels are you not? considering the new flyers coming with the elder wpould it be wise to take 2 skyrays instead of one teem of broad sides then drop VT on riptides ? and that should free up points for more marker lights/ kroot?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
also what commander are the body guards going with?

kyle foster wrote:
i like this list is this 2k ? i think your aloud to still post totels are you not? considering the new flyers coming with the elder wpould it be wise to take 2 skyrays instead of one teem of broad sides then drop VT on riptides ? and that should free up points for more marker lights/ kroot?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
also what commander are the body guards going with?

The list is 2k. The double skyray is a good choice, but before making that choice wait and see what the new eldar flyer is like. There is not a single decent flyer in all the codexes released in this edition with the (notable) exception of Heldrakes. Plus, remember that the Broadsides, being twin-linked, can seriously hurt a flyer even hitting on a 6 (and one ML counter allows you to hit on a 5+, enough to kill almost anything). Unless the new edar aircraft is so good you will see 3 of them all the time, and unless it has AV12 (highly unlikely), the list will be fine versus it.

The answer to what Commander the Bodyguards go with is: none! Bodyguards do not have the Independent Character rule, so can't join units. They are units, to which you can join characters, Commander included. But you are definitely not forced to do that, you can deploy them on their own (and you could not have Commander + bodyguard + Crisis or drones even if you wanted to). This is a common misconception: although they can be purchased only if you take Commanders, this is the only restriction for them: they are not forced to join the commander in any way, they are separate, completely independent units. I got them only because i assumed this is to be a single FOC list, and i couldn't use any more Elites slot for Crisis. Those 2 bodyguards (which are SEPARATE units of a single model each) will deep-strike and hunt heavy vehicles. They are kamikaze tank killers, that force your opponent to use frepower to eliminate them.

ah so for example if i used farsight with 7 guards they dont have to be with him? and if i took a commander i can take a squad of 2 ont here own 2 ? is this a loop hole considering they all get sworn protector

kyle foster wrote:
ah so for example if i used farsight with 7 guards they dont have to be with him? and if i took a commander i can take a squad of 2 ont here own 2 ? is this a loop hole considering they all get sworn protector

No, Farsight doesn't have to be with the Bodyguards. And as a matter of fact, in a Farisght Enclave he will not be most of the games, because you Infiltrate the squad with Shadowsun, and so can't join Farsight to it as well, since he doesn't have the Infiltrate special rule.

For every Commander (including unique ones, Farsight and Shadowsun) you can take a Bodyguard unit, that can have one or 2 models (and up to 7 if you have Farsight) as separate units. These units will be totally independent from the commander that allowed you to purchase them, you can have them joined by a different character (even from an allied race if SM or Eldar, and they DO benefit from the Sworn Protector rule) or deploy them on their own. You can join the Commander to them (he is an Independant Character, he can join almost every unit), but you are not forced to. And this is not a loophole, it's just how Independent Characters work (btw, lots of codexes have something like that, for example Space Marines Command Squads). So yes, in a Farsight Enclave you can have 7 Bodyguards thanks to Farsight, and then have another unit of 1 or 2 models because Shadowsun is a Commander as well. It's just not useful in a Farsight Enclave list, but it could be done.

oww i see thnx for the help how good are gunl;ines?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
by gunlines i mean a gunline force

kyle foster wrote:
oww i see thnx for the help how good are gunl;ines?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
by gunlines i mean a gunline force

Very good versus some armies, not so great versus others. The second list i posted is quite gunlinish, having 6 Broadsides and 3 dual-MP crisis with Commander, but it's not a gunline list in the sense of 48-FWs-with-Ethereal-gunline. And keep in mind that as i said it's tailored to the enemies you will face, it lacks some good AA that is needed versus other armies.

so if my mate starts using 3 air i should take the two skyrays?

kyle foster wrote:
so if my mate starts using 3 air i should take the two skyrays?

Depends on what flyers they are. If they have AV10 or 11, you are fine with your 2 Broadsides units (and the missile crisis, that are even more effective than Broadsides because you can have Tank Hunter). If they are AV12 vehicles, you should consider the double-skyray instead of one Broadsides unit.

sounds good man are skyrays any good for tanking hunting? marker lights + seekers really messes up skimmer

This is a common misconception about skyrays: that they should fire missiles only using ML counters. They do not. Unless i am against a lot of flyers, i use 12 missiles on turn one. And if i face a lot of hard flyers, i don't fire missiles until the flyers enter the field, at which point i use 6 missiles each on a flyer the first turn after it enters. I use ML counters from the skyrays to boost their BS, not to fire missiles: what good is a BS5 missile with Ignore Cover, when i can fire all 6 with BS5 (or, if two MLs hit and i need it, with BS 4 but Ignore Cover for all)?
Since they are your only vehicles, they should get rid of the missiles as soon as possibile, so the enemy has to make a hard choice between using a lot of anti-tank weapons to kill things that don't have offensive weapons anymore (and have cover save, since you will deploy them under cover and not move them all game, and have AV13 on the front), or let them live allowing them to use their nice Skyfire Markerlight all game, which means that every anti-tank weapon he purchased is wasted. That's the real power of Skyrays, being able to launch all 6 missiles at once.

yh the more we talk about skyrays the better there starting to sound even better i may take them even if my mate only gets 1-2 flyers as they just so good even when they got no missles there stil a nice markerlight unit with sms throwing out that many shots into tanks sounds so good round one that destroys nearly all threatening tanks or transports and then they can guide in riptides and other units all game its smazing

also do you need line of sight for markerlights then? as it sounds like you don't by what you said.

You do. Deploying in cover does not mean out of line of sight as well.

They are nice ML source, but you don't really need them in an army that has already quite some ML capability (and you only need them for Riptides, everything else is twin-linked). I would suggest to get a couple of them only if there are a lot of flyers (and AV12 ones too), versus lighter flyers the Broadsides are more than enough, even if they hit on a 6. And remember you have twin-linked marker drones as well, if you join a Commander with C&CN to some Crisis, just one hit on a flyer is enough to take it down with Broadsides missiles, even an AV12 flyer. They can deal alot of damae on turn 1, but i still think that Broadsides are better if you don't face tons of flyers (i do, so i need two of those, but your meta lacks a lot of flyers, and even in the case the new Eldar aricraft is decent - every flyer in 6th edition suck except the Heldrake - i am prettu sure it won't have AV12). For now i suggest you stick with Broadsides, if you feel the need for more AA you can get Skyrays instead, but i doubt you will have to.

ive currently only got 1 riptide would it be better to drop 1 riptide for another squad of xv8s or is the othjer riptide worth the buy?