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Cortez667 wrote: It seems that the inclusion of FW both turned players on AND off from this event.
Apparently those people can't hang with supposedly OP units if they aren't in an "Official" codex. *mimics crying gesture*
I've played against some of those players that profess consternation (notably Blackmoor) at the inclusion of Forge World Units in GTs, and if this ruling keeps them away, its my opinion that the event will be better off without them.
Playing these players (in my experience) is like playing 40k with a crash-test dummy; no emotion, no enjoyment; by-and-large gamers who you would avoid anyway. It should be noted: there players who are OKAY with FW that are really fun players. But the most vocal opponents of the inclusion of said units here on Dakka have a seriously critical reputation of being very DB players in person.
If the hype is even 1/2 accurate, this will be an enormously enjoyable weekend. Its really their loss. Great venue (from what I saw when I was down in Austin last weekend), great TOs (from what the majority opinion on the Internet is);..... Feth them for trying to throw their Political-Gamer weight around and try to affect what the rest of us want at our events.
These events will happen with or without them. Let them sit at home, I say.
Those are some pretty awesome sweeping generalizations. I had no idea that so many of the guys I enjoy playing with across the country usually competing for overall and best sport were actually DB players. I'll be sure to let them know we've been wrong for so long! Thank you sir!
Best Painted (2015 Adepticon 40k Champs)
They Shall Know Fear - Adepticon 40k TT Champion (2012 & 2013) & 40k TT Best Sport (2014), 40k TT Best Tactician (2015 & 2016)
Cortez667 wrote: It seems that the inclusion of FW both turned players on AND off from this event.
Apparently those people can't hang with supposedly OP units if they aren't in an "Official" codex. *mimics crying gesture*
I've played against some of those players that profess consternation (notably Blackmoor) at the inclusion of Forge World Units in GTs, and if this ruling keeps them away, its my opinion that the event will be better off without them.
Playing these players (in my experience) is like playing 40k with a crash-test dummy; no emotion, no enjoyment; by-and-large gamers who you would avoid anyway. It should be noted: there players who are OKAY with FW that are really fun players. But the most vocal opponents of the inclusion of said units here on Dakka have a seriously critical reputation of being very DB players in person.
If the hype is even 1/2 accurate, this will be an enormously enjoyable weekend. Its really their loss. Great venue (from what I saw when I was down in Austin last weekend), great TOs (from what the majority opinion on the Internet is);..... Feth them for trying to throw their Political-Gamer weight around and try to affect what the rest of us want at our events.
These events will happen with or without them. Let them sit at home, I say.
Way to troll. Wear your king troll badge with pride ...
"We didn't underestimate them but they were a lot better than we thought."
Sir Bobby Robson
Cortez667 wrote: It seems that the inclusion of FW both turned players on AND off from this event.
Apparently those people can't hang with supposedly OP units if they aren't in an "Official" codex. *mimics crying gesture*
I've played against some of those players that profess consternation (notably Blackmoor) at the inclusion of Forge World Units in GTs, and if this ruling keeps them away, its my opinion that the event will be better off without them.
Playing these players (in my experience) is like playing 40k with a crash-test dummy; no emotion, no enjoyment; by-and-large gamers who you would avoid anyway. It should be noted: there players who are OKAY with FW that are really fun players. But the most vocal opponents of the inclusion of said units here on Dakka have a seriously critical reputation of being very DB players in person.
If the hype is even 1/2 accurate, this will be an enormously enjoyable weekend. Its really their loss. Great venue (from what I saw when I was down in Austin last weekend), great TOs (from what the majority opinion on the Internet is);..... Feth them for trying to throw their Political-Gamer weight around and try to affect what the rest of us want at our events.
These events will happen with or without them. Let them sit at home, I say.
Oh look, it's the all-tournament-players-must-be-jerks-because-they-play-in-tournaments fallacy again. Yawn.
Shouldn't you be skulking under a bridge somewhere?
I really wish I could go to this con again I have always had a blast in the past. Hopefully they are streaming some of the games again so folks can watch that are stuck in the "real world" for the weekend. Have fun all.
Here is an interview of Thomas Reedy aka Goatboy from the Bell of Lost Souls crew. The Hinkel's sit down with Goatboy and discuss painting, current meta and other gaming topics! Check it out!
I'm here. Alan pajamapants has been running table 1 with a bunch of sabre platforms for a while.
Everyone I've talked to hated the missions/scoring. Some missions have 10 objectives and each is wrth x points towards total bp. Versus winning a primary or secondary for a set # of points. Kill point missions give 1 vp each kp up to 10, while most objectives are worth 3 each, scouring is worth whatever they roll up but the 4 is always centralized. Relic is worth 7, and emperors will is 5 for your own and 10 for the opponents. So, if you kill all of your opponent's stuff but end up only able to hold 6 pts of objectives you get 6. If you play an army like nids and give up 10 kp but hold 4 objectives you're up 12/10 even when kp was the primary.
It rewards armies with lots of fast scoring units or armies who can kill lots of fast scoring units. Most balanced 2-4 scoring unit armies are having trouble getting big points, even when they're handily winning their matches.
Traceoftoxin wrote: I'm here. Alan pajamapants has been running table 1 with a bunch of sabre platforms for a while.
Everyone I've talked to hated the missions/scoring. Some missions have 10 objectives and each is wrth x points towards total bp. Versus winning a primary or secondary for a set # of points. Kill point missions give 1 vp each kp up to 10, while most objectives are worth 3 each, scouring is worth whatever they roll up but the 4 is always centralized. Relic is worth 7, and emperors will is 5 for your own and 10 for the opponents. So, if you kill all of your opponent's stuff but end up only able to hold 6 pts of objectives you get 6. If you play an army like nids and give up 10 kp but hold 4 objectives you're up 12/10 even when kp was the primary.
It rewards armies with lots of fast scoring units or armies who can kill lots of fast scoring units. Most balanced 2-4 scoring unit armies are having trouble getting big points, even when they're handily winning their matches.
It's cool though, there clearly isn't a problem with including FW or even the need to discuss it, especially when the same player ran the table at BAO this year with a very similar list until the last round...
Las Vegas Open Head Judge
I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings or pride, but your credentials matter. Even on the internet.
"If you do not have the knowledge, you do not have the right to the opinion." -Plato
Cortez667 wrote: Just moved to Texas, and I'm going. I've heard a lot of good things about it, and I'm excited to be attending.
FW was fine at KamikazeeCon in LA last year, and it was fine at BAO this year. I've been on the receiving end of Sabres and those IG super artilleries behind a ADL; the first time around, it hurt. A lot. But then I had experience fighting those units and now I know how to counter them. They are good units, sure; but so were TWC/Long Fangs in their day, and so were Nob Bikers back when they had their moment in the sun.
Point is, most people figured out how to beat those units, and we adjusted our army lists to include appropriate counters. I've seen simple stuff like SM Attack bikes ruin sabres and other FW "Super Units". Everyone just needs to spend some brain power to figure out what units your chosen codex has that can beat them.
Every codex has a unit to beat Sabres. Every codex has something to beat (insert any unit from any FW book here). Go to your FLGS. Buy them. Paint them. Bring them.
Its that simple.
I exalted this post with the Yellow Triangle of Friendship (TM).
Veriamp wrote:I have emerged from my lurking to say one thing. When Mat taught the Necrons to feel, he taught me to love.
Truthfully, they are the cause of a lot of arguments in 40k ever since the rules came out from FW.
The tournament was a lot of fun, though. Great crowd and great tourny overall.
I agree with traceoftoxin though, many of the mission benefited armies that had a lot of bodies and the ability to get more troops.
Lucarikx
It was a pleasure to play against you, if you're the blood angels player I believe I played in round 1.
I enjoyed the people I played again, but drawing the (nearly) identical necron list in 3 games was almost as obnoxious as playing long fang+razorback/rhino spam was in 5th.
I have no problem with the inclusion of FW, in fact, the only thing this tourney made me desire is a return to comp.
Overall the tournament was run fairly well with us only falling 5 min behind in the last round day 1 and I think 15 min day 2 (of the GT). I disliked the missions which seemed like a good step towards discouraging armies designed just to shoot people off the board, but ended up feeling extremely clunky and imbalanced points-wise.
I loved the swag bag last year, especially the 5 objective markers, only getting a single marker this year was a major disappointment. I know prices were relatively the same, maybe they had less sponsors or the major decrease in attendees affected their ability to get more.
On that note, the team event looked to be half the size this year (I think it was about 40 teams last year and about 20 this year), and the GT 2/3 of the size, with what appeared to be almost a 30% drop rate going into day 2 (Although I could be wrong, I estimated ~100 players day 1 and ~70 day 2). I'd like to see the actual numbers.
From what spikes bits posted on FB it would seem Ben M won with Necron/Orks, daemons took second and Alan B got 3rd with his saber IG/DA.
They were something like 3 points apart, had Alan received higher paint scores I believe he would have taken overall. All of this is assuming the photo Spikey Bits put up was from the end of the tourney not the final round.
Las Vegas Open Head Judge
I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings or pride, but your credentials matter. Even on the internet.
"If you do not have the knowledge, you do not have the right to the opinion." -Plato
OverwatchCNC wrote: From what spikes bits posted on FB it would seem Ben M won with Necron/Orks, daemons took second and Alan B got 3rd with his saber IG/DA.
They were something like 3 points apart, had Alan received higher paint scores I believe he would have taken overall. All of this is assuming the photo Spikey Bits put up was from the end of the tourney not the final round.
That is accurate. There 5 Necron players in the top bracket. After Daemons was Nids GKnights Necrons Necrons ???? Necrons Daemons Necrons Necrons Dark Angels ???? Chaos Space Marines
So three out of the four top armies were very strong in assault and the Forge World heavy Sabre/Thudd Gun list didn't win. Doesn't seem to me that Forge World had that big of an impact overall.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/10 03:01:45
So three out of the four top armies were very strong in assault and the Forge World heavy Sabre/Thudd Gun list didn't win. Doesn't seem to me that Forge World had that big of an impact overall.
#1. The missions could have heavily influenced which armies won (anyone else find it odd that there are no tau there?)
#3. I do not know how many armies took Forge World.
OK, seriously folks, WarGamesCon JUST happened, we're starting to get some results, good players brought strong lists and did well (shocker)! Not only does the FW/no-FW argument have nothing to do with the top tables (Where good players bring good lists and do well no matter what the meta is), it's totally getting tiresome ... same people making same arguments on all threads, and never budging.
/would rather see WGC results / conversation / hooray-for-an-always-hard-TO'ing-weekend!
So three out of the four top armies were very strong in assault and the Forge World heavy Sabre/Thudd Gun list didn't win. Doesn't seem to me that Forge World had that big of an impact overall.
From what I understand, Alan won on straight battle points, Ben won on overall. Not surprising if you'd seen Alan's army, it clearly wasn't a labor of love. There's no doubting the man's command of the game, but that drive doesn't seem to extend to the hobby aspect.
How many people showed up?
I believe it was 100-120 or so day 1, day 2 I know we started at 38+8 tables and ended with 35+8
[Edit]
I played two of the top 16 necron players, their lists were practically the same. 2 night scythes, lord on barge, 2 ghost arks, 3 annhi barges. Both had voltaic crypteks, one had a triach stalker the other had deathmarks and immortals. There was a third player in the RT with the same core list who had deathmarks+the template cryptek.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/10 03:39:37
5000 points (Blue rods are better than green!)
5000 points (Black Legion & Pre-heresy Sons of Horus) 
