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On the topic of my gripe about Harlequins, anyone else wish that their Veil of Tears ability should be replaced with something better and the ability a part of their Holo-suits?

If someone is a shimmering kaleidoscope of colors, it should be pretty damn hard to hit them from range.

Additionally, I wish it was boosted (ala a certain female Dark Eldar unit) in melee. If all you can see is shimmering colors, it should be damn hard to land a blow.

And their weapons having almost zero AP are a bit ridiculous. How are you the elite caretakers of the Eldar race, at home with any of your brethren, with access all the equipment your race can fathom but you can't even pierce Necron armor.
-Who I would imagine are pretty "up there" in terms of foes.

I have to say I have been very impressed with Eldar as of late. I run a mechanized list with 3 Wave Serpents 3 Fire Prisms and a squad of Guardian Jetbikes, a Warlock and Farseer. The prisms hold nothing fancy - Guardians, Dire Avengers and Wraithguard. I've won 4 out of the 5 games I've played with the new codex; the other was a draw. These weren't close games, either. Most games were called by turn 3. I'm not trying to brag, I'm just saying I've had a very positive experience with the new book.

 evildrspock wrote:
I have to say I have been very impressed with Eldar as of late. I run a mechanized list with 3 Wave Serpents 3 Fire Prisms and a squad of Guardian Jetbikes, a Warlock and Farseer. The prisms hold nothing fancy - Guardians, Dire Avengers and Wraithguard. I've won 4 out of the 5 games I've played with the new codex; the other was a draw. These weren't close games, either. Most games were called by turn 3. I'm not trying to brag, I'm just saying I've had a very positive experience with the new book.

You bumped a thread called Eldar Disappointment.....to tell us you aren't disappointed?

There are only two disappointments to the new codex IMO.

1. Wraithknight has underwhelming weapon options. Nothing to affect fliers or hoards. Two awesome S10 blast templates but I can achieve that with other options so this is a build but not play option.

2. Totally random psychic powers. I would have paid up to 30 points to be able to select a power. 50% chance of getting power needed is just not good.

Other than that, battle focus has restored the mobility that the elder depend on and bladestorm is just a bonus.
Laserlock is nice as it opens up new loadouts. Serpent shield is a nice improvement. Other options are nice also.

No auto include but a lot of viable builds is good in my book.

I used to run a Alaitoc theme in 5th, with lots of Rangers and Pathfinders. I'm worried about the Rangers survivability with only a 4+ the majority of the time. I'm yet to get a game with the new dex in however, and am looking forward to Eldar just having a different feel.

Now that the GW versus Chapterhouse is settled, all those wasted boardroom salaries should be used for product development.
GW should simply get off their high horse and release new armies & FAQ the old.

This way little Billy's toy soldiers can forever be the bees knees.


I aint an authority of any kind, just a gamer who is content play-testing 4 codexs coz roling dice is what we do.
flame on < if you are looking to be on the pinnacle of cutting edge powerhouse builds please go play magic... DGAF > flame off

 zephoid wrote:
Wraithguard are only used in the defense of the craftworld or for missions of great importance. The loss of a eldar is regretable. The loss of a wraith construct is essentially stripping souls from the infinity circuit. I think every codex that i have read has included something to the likes that using wraithguard is essentially tomb robbing. Iyaden uses wraith constructs more often due to the smaller population and out of necessity. Current in-game eldar tactics is throwing them at the enemy as much as possible. Its like making 5 point horde guardians.

Given that the Eldar can see the future, the defense of a Craft-world is often a pre-emptive strike on another world. Therefore, a good offense is the best defense

Eldar Disappointment? Some people I will never understand...


Here is someone I agree with.

I am a little disappointed, but that's due to the models. The rules seem fine.

I was hoping for some improved aspect warrior models and jetbikes. Instead we only got stuff I have no interest in. I've never been into the Wraith portion of the Eldar, so IMO the only model that appeals to me at all is the sniper guy (Illic?). So to me, kind of a wasted release, as it leaves me with no desire to add Allies to my Dark Eldar.
As a guy that paints/models more than plays, its the models that make the release.

 Creeping Dementia wrote:
I am a little disappointed, but that's due to the models. The rules seem fine.

I was hoping for some improved aspect warrior models and jetbikes. Instead we only got stuff I have no interest in. I've never been into the Wraith portion of the Eldar, so IMO the only model that appeals to me at all is the sniper guy (Illic?). So to me, kind of a wasted release, as it leaves me with no desire to add Allies to my Dark Eldar.
As a guy that paints/models more than plays, its the models that make the release.

Some of the tau players feel the same way - awesome codex...but where are the new sculpts?

Personally, I speculate that with the rapid release of books, gw will run out of things to sell in about a year or so (other than a random expansion or two) and THEN we will see new models for old kits.

I base this upon the fact they always need new product to keep up a revenue stream - and I suspect the codexes will be done long before we get a new edition....so that leaves, potentially - new models.

Or is could be supplemental / expansion books (a kroot book, an imperial fists book, etc.) in waves with new models. Anyway...we will see, I would be very surprised we don't get new jetbikes and crisis suits and a few other goodies in about a year.

I tried Illic in my first game and was just really sad afterwards. Look Out Sir makes the ability the character has just kinda... limited. AP 2 Distort has potential for coolness but where do you even hide him to make the potential matter?

In my game a Dreadnought simply showed up and flamed my unit and I spent most of the time running. Hell, the Hexrifle for the Dark eldar is a better option, and it can be allied.

So yeah... I like the codex, but illic... Oh man how i want Illic to work... But it seems kinda iffy. I can get a lot MORE distortion with those points from much tougher units.

I think the rules are pretty good, in a vacuum. I feel like there are lots of viable lists that let you play the army in a bunch of different ways. I'm generally pretty satisfied with the codex.

Some of the rules changes are effective, fun to play, and fluffy - Battle Focus is great, and BS4 on everything was a long time coming. But some of the rules feel really off, from a fluff perspective.

I still don't understand 5+ saves on Guardians; I have no idea why the Eldar would do that. I realize that they have to be differentiated from Dire Avengers, but, really, who's idea was it to give semi-civilian forces the guns with the shortest range and the lightest armor, and then also give them a single long-range artillery piece per unit? Sometimes it's pretty obvious why they're a dying race.

Psykers are screwy. I wasn't really hoping they would do something about the randomness, as that complaint applies more or less equally to every other psyker in the game, but it's still annoying. About half of the Runes of Fate powers are terrible. Warlock psychic tests make them a lot less useful, and Warlocks can't trade places if the powers they roll work out better in each other's units. I don't understand why regular Farseers lack a Force Weapon option - one would think that would be a no-brainer after coming up with Death Mission.

Autarchs are a bit off too. They don't really feel like commanders. They get a pretty crappy reserves bonus which is blown out of the water by a power Farseers can get about 50% of the time if they want it. And they can become excellent solo harassers, which is just weird. Shouldn't they work more like Ethereals?

I dont agree on Autarchs. Autarchs are good. Its not like they are uber expensive!

I still don't understand 5+ saves on Guardians; I have no idea why the Eldar would do that. I realize that they have to be differentiated from Dire Avengers, but, really, who's idea was it to give semi-civilian forces the guns with the shortest range and the lightest armor, and then also give them a single long-range artillery piece per unit? Sometimes it's pretty obvious why they're a dying race.

Because

1: The aspects have all the good guns, the civilians are making due with basic weaponry to defend themselves

2: The Eldar don't want them getting close, thus the long range artillery, the basic guns are backup.

3: Tradition, some Worlds believe in the death god theory, while others (Biel-Tan) believe in having huge aspect warrior armies to defend themselves.

I'm not saying Autarchs are bad. I'm saying they feel off. One of the most popular setups right now seems to be giving them a Jetbike, a laser lance, and a Mantle. You're making a super- Shining Spear. That's just weird; if that's what the designers want then you should just be able to take various Exarchs as HQ choices. The Autarch is on the Path of Command, but the only thing he does that has anything to do with that is basically just worse than a 20 point upgrade to an Aegis defense line.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

Because

1: The aspects have all the good guns, the civilians are making due with basic weaponry to defend themselves

2: The Eldar don't want them getting close, thus the long range artillery, the basic guns are backup.

3: Tradition, some Worlds believe in the death god theory, while others (Biel-Tan) believe in having huge aspect warrior armies to defend themselves.

Of course you're going to be able to come up with some kind of story to justify any weird rule, but it just doesn't seem consistent. The Eldar are seriously limited in their ability to manufacture 24" guns and carapace armor? They build frickin' wraith constructs from the ground up. They build Titans. Yes, you can just say "the Eldar are terminally stupid as a society and have set things up in incredibly silly ways that lead to them taking lots more casualties than they need to", but there's not much indication that that's the case. They're pretty practical-minded when it comes to using wraith constructs.

Of course you're going to be able to come up with some kind of story to justify any weird rule, but it just doesn't seem consistent. The Eldar are seriously limited in their ability to manufacture 24" guns and carapace armor? They build frickin' wraith constructs from the ground up. They build Titans. Yes, you can just say "the Eldar are terminally stupid as a society and have set things up in incredibly silly ways that lead to them taking lots more casualties than they need to", but there's not much indication that that's the case. They're pretty practical-minded when it comes to using wraith constructs.

Considering Wraith-Constructs are usually Last Resorts (With exception of Iyanden, and that's because it's Near Death in terms of numbers). They are never a front-line unit until the defense of a Craft-world is Necessary or in area's with plenty of death. What with them being soul-empowered and not wanting their souls to be lost outside of the Wraith-gate.

And considering that their 24" inch guns are Shuriken Cannons, considering Dire Avengers get 18" variants.

Also they don't produce things normally, considering they technically "Grow" their weapons from wraithbone due to the Bone-Singers, it's hard to understand exactly how that would work in actuality..

And of course the Eldar find the time to build jetbikes for Guardians. You're telling me that whatever effort goes into making a jetbike couldn't instead equip four or five Guardians with equipment equivalent to a Fire Warrior's? I want to stress that I'm not saying "Guardians should be Fire Warriors" and certainly not "Guardians are a bad Troops choice". I'm saying that the rules don't fit the fluff, even though it seems like the game has the toolbox to do a better job here.

I think you're missing the point about wraith constructs. The point is that a whole lot of work goes into each one, and the Eldar really hate using them. The Eldar are presumably very concerned with minimizing their casualties. Whatever effort they have to expend to grow a wraithguard can't be used to make some pretty large number of Guardians significantly more effective (and less likely to die horribly)?

But like I said, yeah, you can invent stories about how Eldar manufacturing works such that that shuriken weapons and mesh armor can be produced at hundreds of times the rate of anything else. But that's just a weird thing to assume. The Dark Eldar don't seem to have any trouble arming everybody with 24" guns. The Imperial Guard do it fine, and they don't care at all about individual lives. The Tau don't have the relative industrial base of the Imperium, and their Fire Warriors get what you'd think would be pretty ideal toys for Guardians. Craftworld Eldar can't just make Swooping Hawk lasblasters for everyone?

And of course the Eldar find the time to build jetbikes for Guardians. You're telling me that whatever effort goes into making a jetbike couldn't instead equip four or five Guardians with equipment equivalent to a Fire Warrior's

And those jetbikes are still equipped with 12" Shurikens, except for the one who can be equipped with a cannon.

I think you're missing the point about wraith constructs. The point is that a whole lot of work goes into each one, and the Eldar really hate using them. The Eldar are presumably very concerned with minimizing their casualties. Whatever effort they have to expend to grow a wraithguard can't be used to make some pretty large number of Guardians significantly more effective (and less likely to die horribly)?

The same logic could go into Every Other Single Race. Why aren't IG equipped with bolters and carapace armor instead? The thing of the matter is, the Shuriken Catapult is the Basic Weapon of the Eldar, and before it's downgrade in 3rd edition, was able to horribly maim even power armor (It kinda can now, with it's AP2 pesudo rending) The thing of the matter is, is that in the fluff, it's far more effective (Just like how bolters can beat near everything)

I have no idea what you're trying to say. Yeah, for just about every three jetbikes made for Guardians, the Eldar manufacture apparently not only three jetbike chassis but also four shuriken catapults and a shuriken cannon. How does that help your side in this argument?

The IG aren't equipped with bolters and carapace armor because that stuff is expensive, presumably. The Imperium doesn't care about individual lives to nearly the extent the Eldar do, and have much less manufacturing capacity per capita. They're willing to sacrifice a whole bunch of lives in order to have a slightly stronger tank. It doesn't make sense for Eldar to make a similar tradeoff, for really obvious reasons.

And I don't understand saying "shuriken weapons don't match the fluff". Well then the rules don't match the fluff, and in this case they fail to match in a way that makes the game play oddly. I care that Guardians on the tabletop don't feel at all like what they should, given that the Eldar think each life is precious. Don't write fluff about a single Guardian shredding a squad of Space Marines with a shuriken catapult and the problem you bring up is solved, right?

IG also get a fighting chance since their lasguns are 24".

Is anyone else disappointed that there aren't any Eldar buildings in the new codex?

It seems like G-dubs missed a golden opportunity to sell "Webway Portals" or an Eldar equivalent of an Aegis line.

 Grugknuckle wrote:
Is anyone else disappointed that there aren't any Eldar buildings in the new codex?

It seems like G-dubs missed a golden opportunity to sell "Webway Portals" or an Eldar equivalent of an Aegis line.

Not really. Were there buildings in the other 6th ed dexes?

 Grugknuckle wrote:
Is anyone else disappointed that there aren't any Eldar buildings in the new codex?

It seems like G-dubs missed a golden opportunity to sell "Webway Portals" or an Eldar equivalent of an Aegis line.

Nobody got buildings in any other codex.

DAaddict wrote:
There are only two disappointments to the new codex IMO.

1. Wraithknight has underwhelming weapon options. Nothing to affect fliers or hoards. Two awesome S10 blast templates but I can achieve that with other options so this is a build but not play option.

2. Totally random psychic powers. I would have paid up to 30 points to be able to select a power. 50% chance of getting power needed is just not good.

Other than that, battle focus has restored the mobility that the elder depend on and bladestorm is just a bonus.
Laserlock is nice as it opens up new loadouts. Serpent shield is a nice improvement. Other options are nice also.

No auto include but a lot of viable builds is good in my book.

Regarding the WK, how do you not consider 3 S6 AP2 blasts and 4 S6 AP- shots anti-horde? Against most horde armies, you could potentially wipe out half a max-sized squad in one round of firing. Do you honestly expect any unit to completely wipe a max horde unit in one turn?

As for random powers, yeah, you and everybody else with a 6th edition book would absolutely pay an extra 30 points to pick and choose your powers. Hell, that is a freakin' bargain!

I disagree with the auto-includes for this book. Warpspiders=auto-include. Wave Serpents=auto-include. Jetbikes=auto-include. Farseers=auto-include. Many would also consider Dark Reapers, Striking Scorpions, Wraithguard, Warwalkers, and Fire Prisms as auto-includes as well.

davethepak wrote:
Personally, I speculate that with the rapid release of books, gw will run out of things to sell in about a year or so (other than a random expansion or two) and THEN we will see new models for old kits.

I base this upon the fact they always need new product to keep up a revenue stream - and I suspect the codexes will be done long before we get a new edition....so that leaves, potentially - new models.

Or is could be supplemental / expansion books (a kroot book, an imperial fists book, etc.) in waves with new models. Anyway...we will see, I would be very surprised we don't get new jetbikes and crisis suits and a few other goodies in about a year.

I got this impression when I saw the release pace at the start of 6th, well before Iyanden. Though I wouldn't say within a year - I'd say we'll have a good year and a half to two years after the last codex drops to the end of 6th edition, which is plenty of time to fill with supplements. And I'd be shocked if that isn't where we see the lions share of resculpts and completely new units that don't fit the giant walker/flyer trend. Plastic Aspect Warriors? Biel Tan supplement. New jetbikes? Saim Hann supplement. New Chaos cult troops and cult terminators? Legions supplement. New Space Marine bikes and attack bikes? White Scars supplement.

The only reason Iyanden hit now was because the majority of the Eldar initial release was related to Iyanden. There was literally never going to be a better time to release that supplement, because they blew Iyandens load with the codex release. If they had plastic Aspects ready and released them alongside the Eldar codex, we'd be seeing a Beil Tan supplement instead.

I am a new player and I have built an Eldar army.

They are a fun, mobile army to play.

There are three small changes I would like to see made:

I would have liked to see the Falcon as an Assault vehicle. It would give Scorpions, Banshees, Harlequins, and some other non-bulky units a lot more list options.

I would like to see the Firestorm come into the Codex and be priced in line with Night Spinners, Prisms, and Falcons.

The Crimson Hunter/Wraithfighter should have Shrouded, a 5+ invulnerable save, or should have its Jink save without losing its BS.

Daner0023 wrote:
I would have liked to see the Falcon as an Assault vehicle. It would give Scorpions, Banshees, Harlequins, and some other non-bulky units a lot more list options.

Banshees and Scorpions don't need a transport to get them into combat. Banshees are definitely fast enough on foot, and Scorpions are tougher than normal Eldar with Infiltrate and Move through Cover. They're fine.

Daner0023 wrote:
I would like to see the Firestorm come into the Codex and be priced in line with Night Spinners, Prisms, and Falcons.

GW don't do that anymore. They did with a few units, like the Trygon, but they've stated they won't cannibalise FW for units anymore, and GW won't put FW made resin kits in codices. You'll just have to buy the Imperial Armour book with the units you want.

Daner0023 wrote:
The Crimson Hunter/Wraithfighter should have Shrouded, a 5+ invulnerable save, or should have its Jink save without losing its BS.

May I ask why? Is this one of those 'they should be better than everyone else BECAUSE ELDAR' things?

Granted I haven't heard people talking about the Eldar flyers, but that's generally a good thing. No whining means people aren't finding them too powerful or too weak, which is good.

Daner0023 wrote:
I am a new player and I have built an Eldar army.

I would have liked to see the Falcon as an Assault vehicle. It would give Scorpions, Banshees, Harlequins, and some other non-bulky units a lot more list options.

.

Tbh, Eldar are already too damn mobile as they are. The ability to Shoot and Run or Run and Shoot has to be one of the best abilities in 40k yet. Their normal troops have the possibility of moving out of cover, shoot and cover again to avoid LOS like a cursed Battle suit. Or just cross the board full speed while being able to shoot.

Seriously, just for that I feel the Eldar Codex is just

 Kain wrote:

 Grugknuckle wrote:
Is anyone else disappointed that there aren't any Eldar buildings in the new codex?

It seems like G-dubs missed a golden opportunity to sell "Webway Portals" or an Eldar equivalent of an Aegis line.

Nobody got buildings in any other codex.

While this is true, it doesn't really make me less disappointed. Those other codecies should have buildings as well. Why does every building have to be imperial? But OK - maybe the buildings don't need rules. What I really want is models. GW is missing out on money! Necron pylons, Eldar web gates, Ork bastions.

Seriously. If GW could produce this
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1250232a
and this
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1250013a
Then there's no reason that they couldn't make good plastic kits for Xenos buiidings. Having rules for the new buildings in the new codecies would just be a marketing ploy to convince people to buy them. How long were the "Imperial Bastion" and "Aegis Defense Line" kits out there before anyone actually bought one?

 Grugknuckle wrote:

 Kain wrote:

 Grugknuckle wrote:
Is anyone else disappointed that there aren't any Eldar buildings in the new codex?

It seems like G-dubs missed a golden opportunity to sell "Webway Portals" or an Eldar equivalent of an Aegis line.

Nobody got buildings in any other codex.

While this is true, it doesn't really make me less disappointed. Those other codecies should have buildings as well. Why does every building have to be imperial? But OK - maybe the buildings don't need rules. What I really want is models. GW is missing out on money! Necron pylons, Eldar web gates, Ork bastions.

Seriously. If GW could produce this
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1250232a
and this
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1250013a
Then there's no reason that they couldn't make good plastic kits for Xenos buiidings.

It'll probably come in some separate game supplement that you'll have to buy for fifty quid.