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Hello there, just looking for some clarification as to the reserve rules found on page 124 in the BRB, searched a bit for the exact same argumentation that i find myself uttering when discussing it with a friend of mine.
I am going to have to quote the written text in question as the whole root of the problem lies in how the sentences are put together, moderators delete if it causes any issues. A Warning this might get a little complicated and a good understanding of how english grammar works is probably required, and is not supplied by me i know. I am Danish and english is not my first language, but second. Been reading english books since i was 12 (now 31) so i pride myself by having a good understanding the written english language), my own written english is lacking, just to pre-empt anyone who would shoot my down on this issue, because my own is not perfect.

The rule is as stated

When Deploying their armies, players can choose not to deploy up to half of their units (rounding up) keeping them as Reserves to arrive later.
Units that must start the game in reserve are ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a single unit for these purposes.
Independent Characters are also counted as a single unit regardless of whether they have joined another unit or not.
During deployment, when declaring which units are kept as Reserves, the player must clearly explain the organisation of his Reserves to the opponent.

Right on to the practicals..

Can i field a 100% drop pod army (more commonly a 95% drop pod army with a resilient safety unit) ?

Well you can understand that you can because there is a sentence that tells you that units that MUST start the game in reserve are ignored, and drop pods must do exactly that. But as i see it that raises a couple of issues, if you take the entire rule, and dont pick that sentence out of context. Lets look at it, the second sentence tells you that they are ignored, for the purposes of working out the number of other units that may do so. Now the next sentence tells you that a unit and its dedicated transport are counted as a single unit for these purposes.

Example:
You take 9 units of tactical space marines, buy a drop pod for them all as a dedicated transport. And before the game starts you inform your opponent that they all embark in the drop pod and therefore starts the game in reserve, as i see it that would be the correct way of doing things. That is what you do with every other transport and unit, terminators flyvers and such. Its all part of the introducing your foe to your army "A Note on Secrecy" as on page 118 BRB.
Now my opponent tells me that his reserve count is still zero because a drop pod doesnt count towards the reserve count limit, i find this odd as i have also just been told by the reserve rule that a unit and and its dedicated transport are a single unit for the purposes of determining how many units can be held in reserve. His argument would be that as the drop pod HAVE to deploy via reserve rule and cannot be placed during deployment, that they dont count.

Right so as i see it the whole root of the problem is where does this sentence belong ?

A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a single unit for these purposes

does it belong to this ?

When deploying their armies, players can choose not to deploy up to half of their units (rounding up) keeping them as Reserves to arrive later.

or this ?

Units that must start the game are ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units may do so.

The next sentence deals with independent characters and we are told that they ALSO counts a single unit, it is less important at this moment, but it does give the third sentence some creedence. Now i believe that the third sentece belongs to the first, as it is seperated from the second by a dot. Usually you start a paragraf concerning something and untill that paragraf ends, all that is written under this concerns the first sentence you put forward. If there is meant to be a connection between two sentences they are seperated by a comma.
Now there is a FAQ out that concerns this, and before taking this into account it is important to understand the difference between a "FAQ" and a "Errata", all of that is explained here: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=cat440134a&categoryId=1000018§ion=&aId=3000006

This is under the FAQ's and not Errata or ammendments, it reads:

Q: Do units that are transported in a vehicle that MUST start in
reserve count towards the number of units that can be placed in
Reserves? For example, must I count the units in a Drop Pod or
Valkyrie towards the 50% of units I can place in Reserves? (p124)
A: No.

Now this can be understood as to cover up this issue, the only thing that keeps me from conceding the point to my buddy and promptly serving him a meal, is that this is listed under the faq's and not under errata, now it is important to understand that GW adresses questions that are present, and answer them in a way so that future conflicts is also covered by these questions, so they dont have to go back and faq the same issue a second time. Now this does not change the rulebook but it covers some current and future issues and i understand that tyranids have a unit that MUST start embarked in a transport-like-thing, that MUST start the game in reserve. Space marine units are not forced to deploy in drop pods and can oddly enough buy drop pods, and not deploy in them, and dropping the pods down empty, for whatever tactical plans they may have. I concede that the faq might be covering my whole argument, by including the drop pod as an example, because as far as i know there are no space marine units that must embark in a drop pod, but a new space marine codex is probably not too far away, and they might be thinking about covering future units that are compelled to deploy in drop pods. If they were changing the main rule about reserves, they would have changed the sentences so that they are connected in a different way, and that would be under errata. But then again my argument there depends of my understanding of the actual rule. I know i am on thin ice here, and the majority will probably tell me i am delusional, but still i would like to get some dialogue on the matter.

If you have managed to read it all, give me your thoughts.

Yes, you can have all your models in drop pods because a unit inside their DT drop pod does not count towards what you have to have on the table. No, in that case you don't need to start with all models on the board. Keep in mind that if you don't get at least one model on the table in the first turn you lose the game.

However, the only way for this to happen is to place your drop pod landing target inside enemy units, on impassable terrain or to have the drop pods scatter of the table.

Edit: Page 124 has all the rules you need. You don't need the FAQ at all!
As for the FAQ it is entirely up to you whether you treat the questions and answers as rules corrections or not. This forum do.

The Deep Strike rules clearly state that if you have a transport which must Deep Strike, that ALL models which start the game embarked on that transport are exempted from the Reserve limitation.

The BRB FAQ later expanded this to include all transports which must start in Reserve (so Flyers, in addition to Drop Pods which were covered above), and by using the Valkyrie as an example, made clear that this applies to non-Dedicated Transport Flyers, not just DT Flyers.

You are Right! I failed to read The deep strike special rule, i guess i just spend around 2 hours rule contemplation i vain, and now i owe my buddy a kebab, uh that hurts..

There have been a few different posts on this matter BTW. I had to bring notes with my army list for a while early on in 6E (using a mix of Drop Pods and Al'Rahem + Vendettas to do a null-deployment) because people didn't understand the rules.

RESERVE (page 124)
When deploying their armies, players may choose not to deploy up to half of their units (rounding up) keeping them in Reserve to arrive later.
Units that must start the game in reserve are ignored for the purposes of working out how many other units may do so. A unit and its Dedicated Transport are counted as a single unit for these purposes.
Independent Characters count as separate units regardless if they have joined another unit or not.

DEEP STRIKE (page 36)
When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (along with any models embarked upon them) are ignored.
In addition, a unit that must arrive by Deep Strike (such as a Drop Pod) must do so even if you are playing a special mission where the Reserves special rule is not being used.

AERIAL SUPPORT (page 80)
Flyers must begin the game as Reserves - it takes time for a Warlord to organise and coordinate air support.

Those 6 lines are the important bits to the Reserves rules. It is more than a little annoying they are scattered throughout the BRB. Also, as Mannahnin stated, the BRB FAQ was updated and the example they use in the FAQ section uses Valkyries, so even though the BRB has that clarification about "Dedicated Transports" counting as a single unit in line 2, you still would ignore any unit embarked on a Flyer. Apparently that clarification is just there so that your Chimeras and Rhinos don't make reserving some of your army unrealistic.

So Drop Pods and their passengers are safe because of the Deep Strike rules, Flyers and their passengers because of the Aerial Support and normal Reserve rules.


It is important to note however, that if you don't want to lose the game automatically that you pretty much have to use Drop Pods if you try to play a null-deployment list. You have to have something on the board at the end of Game Turn 1. I think you can also use Deathwing Terminators with DWA. Just thought I'd mention this for anyone who wanted a "Reserve Everything" type list.

cowmonaut wrote:
I think you can also use Deathwing Terminators with DWA.

Only if you use a single unit. If you have more than one, only half of them can start in reserves (as they do count towards the limit).

Happyjew is correct - DWA has been specifically FAQ'ed that your units ARE considered for the 50% reserves limit. The jury is still out on older Codexes that haven't been FAQ'ed, but at least now the intent is clear.

Now one tweak to this is if you are running space wolves. I can buy my wolf guard a drop pod but then religate the models that would be in that pod to be leaders in other squads. So I can drop a blank pod.

Sorry to bring this thread back from the dead, but had a quick question i wanted to get clarified.

If i am running a 3 pod list (null deployemnt) and want to add a TWC unit to my army, since i can reserve half of my units rounding up, can i still have a null deployment turn 1?

Yes, as the Drop Pods do not count, so 50% of 1 unit = 1 unit that can be reserved

Absolutely Falco. I run pods and I've done this before.

Awesome! just wanted to make sure I was in the clear. I love twc and wanted to make sure they were a viable option to add to my great company