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Is that idea not ideal?

 DemetriDominov wrote:
That's still Marines with spikey bits, and still Marines without...

Those spikes have deep meaning! Mo'rcck, Phraz-Etar, and Ans'l demand tribute!

I don't really care about the marines, spiky or otherwise-- not that there's really much of a difference between spiky and not-spiky anyway, never mind the lack of difference between the various chapters/legions...

Regardless of that, it's an MMO so it's going to be immersion-breaking anyway, unless they somehow enforce roleplaying, which would be rather unpopular.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Gitzbitah wrote:
Player made chapters are rolled out- 2 days later, the entire chapter of the Angry Marines is banned for blatant abuse of other players, each other, gross violations of profanity, and abuse of several dozen people who have never played the game.

Oh god, imagine if 1d4chan would make a chapter...It would be awesome

Let's not even talk about the possibility of the Something Awful goons joining. lol.

 Melissia wrote:
I don't really care about the marines, spiky or otherwise-- not that there's really much of a difference between spiky and not-spiky anyway, never mind the lack of difference between the various chapters/legions...

Regardless of that, it's an MMO so it's going to be immersion-breaking anyway, unless they somehow enforce roleplaying, which would be rather unpopular.

I'm sure there'll be roleplay guilds and such, though. So that stuff'll be there if you want it.

I'm not holding mjy breath on that.

I think they should have a large variety of chapters already availble with each being a guild. So when a guild is made they then register themselves as a chapter but there can only be one, if your favourite chapter isn't there you can apply and providing there is enough info they'll be added to the list

I was behind this game until the Dark Angels got mentioned. Guess the game has been misnamed. Off to a bad start.

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
I was behind this game until the Dark Angels got mentioned. Guess the game has been misnamed. Off to a bad start.

How self entitled are you to think that the game is going to be made with your favorite chapter in mind? Especially considering how many space marine chapters are out there what are the odds that your favourite one is going to be picked? They also mentioned there was going to be pyskers

in one of the interviews so you should have been somewhat expecting no Black Templars.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also who gives a feth what chapter of space marines you play the difference between them aren't much in terms of stats it mostly just fluff and visual style changes.

I said its misnamed and Im absolutely right. Im sure WH40K: All Is Dust featuring the Red Corsairs will be a great game. Whatever it is youre trying to do Im not interested.

Cheesecat wrote:Also who gives a feth what chapter of space marines you play the difference between them aren't much in terms of stats it mostly just fluff and visual style changes.

In fairness, it's a valid concern that simply hinges upon one's emotional attachment to their favourite army, or by extension sub-faction. Even for me it'd be a huge difference whether I'd get to play a Chapter such as, say, the Celestial Lions, or the Space Wolves, simply because I'm aware of the various Chapters' backgrounds, and thus have different opinions on all of them.

That being said, Dark Angels aren't exactly a surprise - they do seem to be the Chapter that is being "featured" this edition. See the TT Rulebook cover, see the Dark Vengeance starter set.

And with three alternative options to play, I'd simply look to one of the other races rather than letting go of the game entirely. Are Orks really that bad a choice?

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
I said its misnamed and Im absolutely right. Im sure WH40K: All Is Dust featuring the Red Corsairs will be a great game. Whatever it is youre trying to do Im not interested.

OK, yeah you're right the title is misleading I'm just frustrated about people complaining about not having their favourite chapter, army, whatever in the games get over it. I mean it's unrealistic to expect every faction and sub-faction (although I can understand and agree with some posters

concerns about lack of female options that just seems like a bad decision especially for players who like to play as female characters) to be crammed into the game just be grateful that they're at least making a game.

The chapter I play as in 40K are the Carcharodons. This game won't become dead to me just because "my" chapter isn't in it. Just as I played Space Marine for hours upon hours despite the fact I despise Ultramarines with all my being.

People like d3m01iti0n won't be missed.

Unless you are roleplaying it really does not matter which chapter they picked, and most people will not be roleplaying. The DA are as good a choice as any and better than some.

I find the whole teabagging execution example to be rather peurile even though I suppose it will appeal to immature players.

One thing that I am very curious about is: What happens if your race is defeated 1 month into a 3 month long campaign? I cant imagine that you are not allowed to play, but if your race has been defeated then what is the point? What will you be able to do while the campaign finishes up.

One major culture screw up he made was mentioning the KGB. Similar to the earlier interview, when he described a hypothetical group of ex-Navy seals using their expertise and winning a campaign fast he used the same example with the KGB. Very, very bad move. The KGB are hated only slightly less than NKVD and they were mostly a bunch of terrorists and thugs, not military geniuses. That was a truly cringeworthy moment in the interview.

Despite people complaining that details were not provided in the interview, I think he has so far given us a very good idea about what his vision of the game is. Now whether this vision translates into a game that is fun to play remains to be seen but you cant criticize the team for not having a passion for 40k.

Having played extensively in a MMORPG that required a linkshell group to get anywhere at end game I am just very skeptical about the degree of control that players will have over other players in this game. Maybe the fact that at the top end of the hierarchy the fact that the leader is over hundreds rather than a couple of dozen players, it might actually work out better than I would expect.

The developer in the interviews has implied that a knowledge of real world tactics will give players a great advantage, eg a group of ex-Navy Seals being able to dominate in a short time. I find this to be rather amusing because players will try all kinds of crazy things that no one would try in real life and the result is they will find exploits and loopholes that people wedded to real life military doctrines would never find.

JWhex wrote:Unless you are roleplaying it really does not matter which chapter they picked, and most people will not be roleplaying.

Meh, people don't roleplay in the Tabletop as well, yet still the majority feels strongly about the various armies. As they say, "you eat with your eyes first".

JWhex wrote:One thing that I am very curious about is: What happens if your race is defeated 1 month into a 3 month long campaign? I cant imagine that you are not allowed to play, but if your race has been defeated then what is the point? What will you be able to do while the campaign finishes up.

I'd guess that such a situation would be difficult to achieve, as the other force will also have two more enemies to deal with in addition to greater Tyranid attacks in their rear area. Perhaps they will gain various helpful resources by all the territory they control, but they won't gain additional players. Stretch out your forces too far, and you will invariably introduce weak points that will be exploited by the enemy.

Note: I'm assuming a race cannot actually get defeated "for reals", but rather just pushed back to wherever they spawn. Everybody keeps their ship in orbit, and can choose to launch a new invasion wave at any time. Ideally, the "underdog" faction should coordinate their landing for maximum efficiency.

JWhex wrote:One major culture screw up he made was mentioning the KGB. Similar to the earlier interview, when he described a hypothetical group of ex-Navy seals using their expertise and winning a campaign fast he used the same example with the KGB. Very, very bad move. The KGB are hated only slightly less than NKVD and they were mostly a bunch of terrorists and thugs, not military geniuses. That was a truly cringeworthy moment in the interview.

From a Western perspective? Their President is ex-KGB. I wouldn't be surprised if at least a large number of Russians would have different opinions about their nation's past.

JWhex wrote:The developer in the interviews has implied that a knowledge of real world tactics will give players a great advantage, eg a group of ex-Navy Seals being able to dominate in a short time. I find this to be rather amusing because players will try all kinds of crazy things that no one would try in real life and the result is they will find exploits and loopholes that people wedded to real life military doctrines would never find.

Agreed. I think this was mostly done because it "sounds cool". Anything military is hip these days.

I agree with Lynata, especially about the KGB; one cannot really argue the weapon when they ignore the hand behind it. The KGB was a tool, just the same as SEAL Team 6. Regardless of the ideals they kill/killed for, if they took the orders from the same person, they'd be killing for the same cause.

 Lynata wrote:
Note: I'm assuming a race cannot actually get defeated "for reals", but rather just pushed back to wherever they spawn.

Now imagining a bunch of stupid ten year old brats in pink space marine armor "roflstomping noob orks" by spawn camping.


Your ideas don't make me feel too confident about the game.

@Lynata on the KGB. No, definitely not from a western perspective. For several years I worked closely with a team of Russian biologists and had a chance to travel with them in Africa and visit them and their families in Moscow and St. Petersburg.

You do not mention the NKVD, ever. They were hated as were the KGB. That is an era that many want to forget. Biggest social mistake I made on an early visit was asking a question about the NKVD. The question was harmless but my friend later told me in no uncertain terms never to bring that subject up.

----------

On topic. Does anyone else think that the main activity promoted so far sounds a bit monotonous? It might be fun a few times but partaking in a massive zerg rush does not sound that great to me. In the interviews the developer points out specifically that it is an advantage of their system that you are doing pvp in a large group instead of a small one and thus people will not be criticizing your actions.

The logical extension of this is that your individual actions do not amount to a hill of beans. Is there something I am missing here? How many times is participating in a big free for all fun?

I would like to know if you can target members of your own faction. Seriously, after about 5 zerg rushes I am going to be looking for something interesting to do with a lascannon and that pesky 14 year old commander has a big target on the back of his power armor.

JWhex wrote:
@Lynata on the KGB. No, definitely not from a western perspective. For several years I worked closely with a team of Russian biologists and had a chance to travel with them in Africa and visit them and their families in Moscow and St. Petersburg.

You do not mention the NKVD, ever. They were hated as were the KGB. That is an era that many want to forget. Biggest social mistake I made on an early visit was asking a question about the NKVD. The question was harmless but my friend later told me in no uncertain terms never to bring that subject up.

----------

On topic. Does anyone else think that the main activity promoted so far sounds a bit monotonous? It might be fun a few times but partaking in a massive zerg rush does not sound that great to me. In the interviews the developer points out specifically that it is an advantage of their system that you are doing pvp in a large group instead of a small one and thus people will not be criticizing your actions.

The logical extension of this is that your individual actions do not amount to a hill of beans. Is there something I am missing here? How many times is participating in a big free for all fun?

I would like to know if you can target members of your own faction. Seriously, after about 5 zerg rushes I am going to be looking for something interesting to do with a lascannon and that pesky 14 year old commander has a big target on the back of his power armor.

one Of the Devs aswered this (on MMORPG) to questions about zerging and blobing:

Hi Savij & StMichael, Miguel asked me to jump in and answer some questions!

To address your topic, when it comes to the structure of campaigns and things like territory control, we're trying to create the feeling of a planetary sandbox of war. So rather than really try to limit & control the size or course of conflicts with very strict game mechanics, we're aiming to create logical takeover & disruption sequences as well as motivations for different sizes (or specialties) of groups to tackle different things. Thus while you technically could attack, say, a small resource-producing outpost with a massive army, most of the time that size of a force would be better directed elsewhere. This sort of thing is still under development of course.

Even in situations where a giant force is warranted, however, we're looking at ways to break up the blob. Making big gains will require a faction to make concerted efforts on multiple fronts and in addition we have a strong focus on the "squad"-sized unit so your elite group of specialists still have meaning within the larger army. As a possible example, if a large force convenes on a fortress they're going to want to open up the gates and that might mean you and your friends who've all spec'd out as jump infantry have a specific role to play in getting behind the wall and cracking things from within.

More on this to come!



-Brent, Lead Designer

That sounds quite a bit more promising.

I agree. He also hinted at "Behind Enemy Lines" operations where players can break away and do some sort of infiltration to break up the enemy's supply chain. I really like this idea since it was only somewhat used in Alterac Valley using the mines or a stealth capture of the GY in front of the boss, but with great success.

AWesker1976 wrote:
The chapter I play as in 40K are the Carcharodons. This game won't become dead to me just because "my" chapter isn't in it. Just as I played Space Marine for hours upon hours despite the fact I despise Ultramarines with all my being.

People like d3m01iti0n won't be missed.

First few pages of this thread I stated that I wanted chapter selection. That helps everybody. How selfish of me. I mean I love the Iron Warriors but apparently this game is dead to me now.

 d3m01iti0n wrote:

AWesker1976 wrote:
The chapter I play as in 40K are the Carcharodons. This game won't become dead to me just because "my" chapter isn't in it. Just as I played Space Marine for hours upon hours despite the fact I despise Ultramarines with all my being.

People like d3m01iti0n won't be missed.

First few pages of this thread I stated that I wanted chapter selection. That helps everybody. How selfish of me. I mean I love the Iron Warriors but apparently this game is dead to me now.

How would you explain this fluff-wise? So we're going to sacrifice the immersion of the game for everyone else for a couple of players who want to be able to fly their own colors?

JWhex wrote:
The developer in the interviews has implied that a knowledge of real world tactics will give players a great advantage, eg a group of ex-Navy Seals being able to dominate in a short time. I find this to be rather amusing because players will try all kinds of crazy things that no one would try in real life and the result is they will find exploits and loopholes that people wedded to real life military doctrines would never find.

Yeah, I picked up on that too. I think he's underestimating gamers just a bit, there.

Being a military stratagist is all well and good, but you're up against people who may very well sink many hours into learning everything there is to know about the gameplay. I doubt it would be the curb-stomp he makes it out to be.

 Troike wrote:

JWhex wrote:
The developer in the interviews has implied that a knowledge of real world tactics will give players a great advantage, eg a group of ex-Navy Seals being able to dominate in a short time. I find this to be rather amusing because players will try all kinds of crazy things that no one would try in real life and the result is they will find exploits and loopholes that people wedded to real life military doctrines would never find.

Yeah, I picked up on that too. I think he's underestimating gamers just a bit, there.

Being a military stratagist is all well and good, but you're up against people who may very well sink many hours into learning everything there is to know about the gameplay. I doubt it would be the curb-stomp he makes it out to be.

Military tactics also do not factor in specific 40k things such as Power Armor, orbital bombardments, suicide hoard armies, etc. Tactics change as technology evolves, the firing lines of the Revolutionary War to the blitzkrieg tanks of Germany finely proves this point.

Or maybe overestimating...

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
I said its misnamed and Im absolutely right. Im sure WH40K: All Is Dust featuring the Red Corsairs will be a great game. Whatever it is youre trying to do Im not interested.

What the feth is he talking about?

Anyways im not really interested in the Dark Angels, so depending on how they do the game I may not jump on immediately.

I would love to try out the Sisters of Battle instead of the Dark Angels but if they dont add them till like years later then ill just go Dark Angels.

Of course this is assuming the game is actually fun which im not sure about yet lol.

It makes perfect sense to only have one chapter. On a large scale like this, most chapters are more or less the same, and it doesn't matter what you want to roleplay as, because this isn't a roleplaying game. It's a shooter. Sure, there's nothing stopping you from roleplaying, but that isn't what the game is about. It's about participating in large-scale, team-based combat, and that's how they're talking about it so far. So saying that the game is "dead to you" because it doesn't have your favorite color of marines is a little bit of a silly reason.

I am willin to forgo a bit of fluff for a color selector. You can be as hardcore as you want, and if I want to play pink space marine who cares?

 Galdos wrote:

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
I said its misnamed and Im absolutely right. Im sure WH40K: All Is Dust featuring the Red Corsairs will be a great game. Whatever it is youre trying to do Im not interested.

What the feth is he talking about?

He expected the Black Templars to be the "main" chapter due to the title having "crusade" in it. Templars are always crusading against something. He's a lil annoyed that they announced Dark Angels instead. All is Dust is the mantra of the Thousand Sons, so if the game was WH 40K; All is Dust and the main chaos warband was the Red Corsairs instead of the Thousand Sons people would claim the game mislead them.