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Spell ward (non Morrowan) would be a cool rule, only connie can cast on them (and other Morrowan casters if they become a thing)

If it's anything except sacred ward the unit wouldn't really solve any problems for the faction at large. The last thing I want in Cygnar is more cornercase models that look amazing but never hit the table. I have too many of them already.

Or they could just have no spell protection. That would be fine too.

 Dais wrote:
I for one would love to see a morrown answer to menoth's bastions.

Now that would be interesting, especially with some Weapon Master goodness.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BTNeophyte wrote:

 Mad4Minis wrote:
Seems that Cygnar needs heavy infantry.

They do...they're called boomhowlers

NO. Actual faction units.

 Mad4Minis wrote:

BTNeophyte wrote:

 Mad4Minis wrote:
Seems that Cygnar needs heavy infantry.

They do...they're called boomhowlers

NO. Actual faction units.

Boomhowlers are exactly the unit you're looking for, and the faction is balanced around all the choices you have available, not just those that you find appealing. I'll agree that I'd want something more Cygnar-y, but that's a fluffiness-vs-effectiveness argument.

Need, no.

Like, of course!

I think a second Morrowan unit of heavy knights would be awesome.

 Mad4Minis wrote:

 Dais wrote:
I for one would love to see a morrown answer to menoth's bastions.

Now that would be interesting, especially with some Weapon Master goodness.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BTNeophyte wrote:

 Mad4Minis wrote:
Seems that Cygnar needs heavy infantry.

They do...they're called boomhowlers

NO. Actual faction units.

Boomhowler with Captain Jonas Murdock. Faction unit.

Alright boys, your all the prettiest girl at the prom...
I realize that this thread is old but I wanted to add my two cents worth.
I'm a long time player of the Boys in Blue myself and have played a great deal of tabletop overall. Here's the skinny on Cygnar currently.
We are facing a turnover of faction wide battle strategy. We once reigned supreme as the premier ranged army but have seen the rise of other faction creating units to counteract that. But we still have one thing the others don't have. Lots of tech tricks.
Cygnar has been laid low recently but not out. They still have some of the best tricks in the whole game. The biggest issue I've been facing is a lack of rule updates to reflect this. PP has given us a lot of good finesse and ability models recently but hasn't given us a way to make them stick quite yet. Hordes a particularly bad problem since virtually none of Cygnar's effects even interact. Now the Convergence has reared it's ugly head and Cygnar is nearly powerless versus them. I feel that the rules need a good going through to balance things again.
On the other hand, we now can enjoy a adaptability that few factions could even consider. One just has to keep a few things in mind.
1. Cygnar loves points. Seriously, the faction as a whole costs more per unit than almost anyone. We do get the tradeoff of many really cool abilities but they are still costly. As a result Cygnar doesn't really see full potential until around 50 points and less than 35 is a why bother moment.
2. Plan ahead. We have a hard army to play. I feel it safe to say that only Convergence is harder to get right. The generalized nature of the faction means that we have to plan out every step of the strategy ahead of time.
3. Concentrate your list. We can't backup plan worth **** so just fortify your attack plan. If you are going super shooty then don't bother taking a bunch of heavy melee elite infantry. You might take some tarpit but even then a well built body of Trenchers can be just as hard to get rid of when Dug In and can screen.
4. Fight smart not hard. Deception and trickery is your friend. It doesn't seem like it for the cost but we have a great deal of throwaway units. Again Trenchers are the example. At face value they seem like high cost simple screen infantry who can't do anything else. Their shots suck, melee is a no go and they have no health boxes or survivability of any kind. Don't bother right? Wrong, they are one of our staple light infantry choices for a reason. Firstly they have both Dig In and advance deploy. This means you can deploy 16" with a chance to respond to your opponents deployment. Deploy, run them and let them entrench themselves. At def 17 arm 13 your foe will have to expend resources to get rid of them. Add in 3 Rifle Grendiers, a Captain/Sniper and Marshal two Hunters. Then drop in Maxwell Finn and a accompanying unit of Rangers and watch your opponent be forced to deal with them. Your Trenchers are now a Combined Ranged unit of 15 guys with +2 to both attack and damage, a 17 def, 13 arm, and can hit up most Khador jacks with straight dice for damage. Don't forget the Hunters. Add a dash of Journyman for spell support and maybe another Hunter and you've got a winning combo. Now you've got an in with someone like E Caine or E Haley or even a Striker with some Storm Knights to charge in and mop this up!
5. Gun Mages! No really. Just put hem in your list. They are probably our most handy unit overall. They have Snipe, Critical Brutal and Thunderbolt. You ever see a bunch of Khador Doom Reavers try to reach Gun Mages only to get shot back just out of charge range constantly? Enough said.
6. We are probably THE page five faction. Just adhere as closely as possible to those rules. Let them become your mantra. Then school you opponent on their full meaning by outsmarting them in a fight...

That having been said. We are expecting a story update soon. Two new warcasters have been leaked and while one of them is pretty mediocre the new mounted Stryker shows some promise. Afterall, the story say that Cygnar is planning a large counteroffensive to Cryx. One would think that perhaps our best days are ahead and not behind us...

OP why not play "mangled metal" 2 caster 50 point games? If it's just you and a buddy playing you can always sort out dome house rules. I think 2 caster "mangled metal" (and by the "" I mean mostly jacks with support) would be really fun.

Bleak Seraph wrote:

We are facing a turnover of faction wide battle strategy. We once reigned supreme as the premier ranged army but have seen the rise of other faction creating units to counteract that. But we still have one thing the others don't have. Lots of tech tricks.
Cygnar has been laid low recently but not out. They still have some of the best tricks in the whole game. The biggest issue I've been facing is a lack of rule updates to reflect this. PP has given us a lot of good finesse and ability models recently but hasn't given us a way to make them stick quite yet. Hordes a particularly bad problem since virtually none of Cygnar's effects even interact. Now the Convergence has reared it's ugly head and Cygnar is nearly powerless versus them. I feel that the rules need a good going through to balance things again.

I'm going to have to disagree with some of your points.

Cygnar hasn't been the premier ranged army since Mk 2 came out. Ret has been at least as good, if not better. And if you play Steamroller scenarios (in tournys or outside) then ranged armies are not really the bees knees anyways. The best way to play Cygnar would be combined arms.

Cygnar hasn't really been laid low recently unless you are referring strictly to the fluff. In actual game terms the Stormwall and other releases (Blazers, Stormknight capt, etc) since it came out have made Cygnar one of the better factions. Stormwall in particular has been game changing. If you don't consider those to be at least solid, if not excellent, recent releases then I'm not really sure what to say. And Cygnar still has caster like eHaley and eCaine.

I don't think Hordes really gives Cygnar any more issues than warmachine factions. Most of our best units/casters/etc don't really care. And if you are taking things just for disruption or for use against jacks then you are doing it wrong. Shoot, most Warmachine armies don't have more than 1-2 jacks, anyways.

And I have no idea where you got the idea that Cygnar is "powerless" against COC. Again, our best units don't care if they have a ton of things with no cortex. And disruption still works great against them. If anything it works even better against COC because of how they can bounce focus around.

I guess (because I am yet to have any real action on the table) that many feel Cygnar has bad infantry, because they lack tarpit - But the way I see it, Cygnar doesn't actually need one if the do their stuff well enough. Trenchers can be a tick to move and can screen other shooters like Long Gunners, the Centurion can keep enemies at bay for a time while others and stop them from charging, while other, more killy units engage the unit he is fighting (use Sword Knights for maximum damage), and if you really feel like using something else than Cygnar, use something beefy with Murdoch and upkeep that Arcane Shield. We do have a lot of access to Arcane Shield, and can use Junior to give any extra 'Jack some ekstra OMMPH. An example is the Sentinel - Though not massivly tough, it is still rather tanky and can keep enemies at bay for quite a while.

That said, I would like some kind of Cygnar unit just dedicated to keep folks from getting to your forces. Something like a Stormknight unit with a special mechanika-shield that can gives automatic Aura of Protection alongside Shieldwall or/and Defensive Line when B2B, or cheap Halfjackish machines as small, darting constructs attacking ground forces' feet to knock them down or simply making them unable to move as some kind of hordish unit.

 The Wise Dane wrote:
That said, I would like some kind of Cygnar unit just dedicated to keep folks from getting to your forces. Something like a Stormknight unit with a special mechanika-shield that can gives automatic Aura of Protection alongside Shieldwall or/and Defensive Line when B2B

So like, Silverline Stormgaurd?

 Mordekiem wrote:

 The Wise Dane wrote:
That said, I would like some kind of Cygnar unit just dedicated to keep folks from getting to your forces. Something like a Stormknight unit with a special mechanika-shield that can gives automatic Aura of Protection alongside Shieldwall or/and Defensive Line when B2B

So like, Silverline Stormgaurd?

Well yeah, but they are not that great at tying up enemy forces now are they? Sure, they prevent charges and can set up some really heavy damage for other lightning-based attacks, but I don't see them used as a tarpit-unit.

You're responding in a nearly year-old thread, guys

 Mahtamori wrote:
You're responding in a nearly year-old thread, guys

WELL IT'S NEW TO ME

 The Wise Dane wrote:

 Mahtamori wrote:
You're responding in a nearly year-old thread, guys

WELL IT'S NEW TO ME

Lol. It's old to everyone else. Yet surprisingly useful...

 The Wise Dane wrote:

 Mordekiem wrote:

 The Wise Dane wrote:
That said, I would like some kind of Cygnar unit just dedicated to keep folks from getting to your forces. Something like a Stormknight unit with a special mechanika-shield that can gives automatic Aura of Protection alongside Shieldwall or/and Defensive Line when B2B

So like, Silverline Stormgaurd?

Well yeah, but they are not that great at tying up enemy forces now are they? Sure, they prevent charges and can set up some really heavy damage for other lightning-based attacks, but I don't see them used as a tarpit-unit.

I bolded what you said. Silverline do that by stopping slowing down charges. They are also a stormknight unit.

Basically you are asking for a tarpit unit of which Silverline are one. How well of a tarpit unit they are does depend on how you use them, what else is in your list, the scenario and your opponent's list. But they are almost pretty much exactly what you described. Especially if you toss Arcane Shield on them, use rhupert and/or other buffs that Cygnar has access to.

 Mordekiem wrote:

 The Wise Dane wrote:

 Mordekiem wrote:

 The Wise Dane wrote:
That said, I would like some kind of Cygnar unit just dedicated to keep folks from getting to your forces. Something like a Stormknight unit with a special mechanika-shield that can gives automatic Aura of Protection alongside Shieldwall or/and Defensive Line when B2B

So like, Silverline Stormgaurd?

Well yeah, but they are not that great at tying up enemy forces now are they? Sure, they prevent charges and can set up some really heavy damage for other lightning-based attacks, but I don't see them used as a tarpit-unit.

I bolded what you said. Silverline do that by stopping slowing down charges. They are also a stormknight unit.

Basically you are asking for a tarpit unit of which Silverline are one. How well of a tarpit unit they are does depend on how you use them, what else is in your list, the scenario and your opponent's list. But they are almost pretty much exactly what you described. Especially if you toss Arcane Shield on them, use rhupert and/or other buffs that Cygnar has access to.

Well, never looked at them that way. Their Battle College site is kinda lackluster in terms of tactics, and while I did notice their role to be different from the Stormguard, I didn't really think of using them - I don't like using models whos fluff I don't know beforehand. I am stupid like that.

Can you elaborate, both fluffy and crunchy? I mean, who are they and where are they from? Do you see them used in any specific way, or should I get to the drawing board to create some elaborate strategy?

From my research it sounds like their fluff is in NQ #50.

For tactics, I would suggest checking out the PP factions boards. There was quite a bit of info on them when the rules were released.

Hope that helps!

 Trazyn the Murderous wrote:
Hey guys. Over the time I have played Warmachine, people have given me mixed reactions to my Cygnar. Some say they suck (fixed that by beating them) and some say they are too overpowered (Never have I thought that any Warmachine faction was overpowered) I was just wondering if anyone had gotten these reactions, or if they had gotten other reactions. (Note: Most of the people I play against also play Warhammer. Don't know if this has any connection, but its always helpful to have more info.)

I think it says something that at national/world tournaments they're always well represented, and almost always top tier. They have a lot of good casters, a lot of "place template" effects, and in general they're a really good army.

Also, their tendency to run masses of magical damage/weapons negates a lot of people's effects, and that pisses on a lot of parades.