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What are peoples opinion of it?, espically with Tau with massed FW Kroot and pathfinders and most probably Eldar with shrouded gurdians behind aegis lines scooting forwards and backwards to shoot with platforms. The ap5 isnt really a issue imo, things with 3 plus armours shouldnt really be in cover! ha, but the eldar tau nids etc this is where it is strong. I have the model but yet to run in a competitive game, think I run one once only in a fun game and it done ok.

I like that you have to get up close and personal with it. I wish it was fast though. If you want to shoot it's quite slow. And with only AV12 a bit vulnerable to getting blown up or shut down.

up close?, its 36inch range!, I would use them as mid deployment in cover kicking out large blasts! at least thats what it looks like in my head haha.

It's only really good, if you pair it with assault unit's that need grenades, so assaulting unit's that hug cover.

I've had great success with mine. I find it very rarely gets shot at with all the FMCs and hounds flying towards their lines getting most of the attention.

The grenades effect has probably been more helpful but I mostly play against MEQ armies.

I'd like to use it asa way to wipe out units camping behind the ADL.

I have run it a few times in tournaments. I lost the main gun turn 1 in one game to some Hive Guard - it then ate overwatch on the charge, finished off a few random Gaunts and eventually succumbed to an angry Tervi. I was amazed how useful it ended up being even after it lost the Cannon - regaining a Hull Point on a 2+ when causing a wound is actually quite good.

From a shooting perspective it really changes the calculus of unit survival - especially since many armies try to use terrain, invisibility, etc to makeup for weak saves otherwise.

At S8 amd BS 5 it is also pretty good for shooting at vehicles in cover too.

The ability to charge things after losing you're cannon is a good option, especially since it's stronger than normal and can heal you.

I'm considering it as a cheap armor saturation tool, supporting princes, bloodthirster and maulerfiends.

Given that the Skull cannon is pretty much the only way for Daemons to assault through cover at initiative, it's a borderline auto take for Slaaneshi and Khornate armies. And it's pretty good on it's own merits even without the ability to grant those precious assault grenades to your Daemons to avoid getting clobbered to death by Guardsmen before you can get to swing.

I like it, could have been a bit cheaper IMO since it is taking a heavy slot but S8 Ignore cover is pretty damn useful.

tgf wrote:
I like it, could have been a bit cheaper IMO since it is taking a heavy slot but S8 Ignore cover is pretty damn useful.

Might be worth using just to strip HP from Eldar and Tau skimmers.

Was thinking of running it with lots of hounds so 2 skull cannons would help a lot

My issue with it is that it eats a slot for both soul grinders and daemon princes. Is it better than both of those things?

It doesn't do more damage than those, but it's quite necessary if you want to assault things safely.

Points wise, I have done my prince list and done ok with it (see my ongoing bat rep with them http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/534117.page) they are so expensive when run with the needed upgrades I cant scale it down to 1650.

I also fancy doing a opposite to that list, horde instead of elite

 Griddlelol wrote:
My issue with it is that it eats a slot for both soul grinders and daemon princes. Is it better than both of those things?

If you want your assaulty units to not get their faces punched in by far cheaper and technically worse at assault units then the Skull Cannon is absolutely necessary. The cannon itself is nice, but the secondary effect is a godsend for your army which as a whole desperately needs grenades.

Really? I'm not convinced that my 20 dogs will get wrecked by tac marines or guard. I'm also not convinced that my screamers will die to gants just because they're in cover.

Maybe I'm underestimating the power of striking at initiative, I'll have to run some numbers.

I've lost bloodletters to firewarriors in assault repeatedly.

Khorne wept.

Seems sad to waste I9/10 on a prince or greater daemon.

Can the skull cannon assault?

Since it is a chariot, yes.

I've never fielded one before but my friend has tried 2 of them, when he put them on the bored turn 1 they got dark lanced to death, needless to say i said no... My heavy slot is already crammed with DP's and my Slaanesh Chariots so i couldn't take one even if i wanted to. Not to mention I have come to the understanding that my troops arn't meant to charge, but just stand their on objectives and look pretty, as for my MC's, hounds, screamers, flamers, etc... they don't need the cannons help honestly, most of the time the enemy units inside cover suck in cc anyways so it's fine if they swing first because i'm just going to steam roll over them when it's my turn, and most of the enemy units that you want to attack before they do are outside of cover charging at you and with my high initaitive models it's never a problem. The large blast does sound appealing but the ap5 makes me yawn

have to agree with riddick40k. If there was an option to run a cavalcade with them like the seeker chariot it would be more tempting but that 1 heavy slot is better used in my opinion with a DP or a SG. The synergy of giving your assault units grenades does not out perform another DP in my opinion.

Napkin math of dogs against GHs (who fortuitously rolled a 6 for MotW) which are considered an above par assault unit. Well here goes:

Khorne dogs charge without skull cannon
GHs put down 4 wounds, which doesn't necessarily mean 2 dead dogs but I'll assume it does mean 2 deaths.
The now 18 khorne dogs put down 8 GHs.

So obviously, the dogs are going to do more damage when attacking at initiative, however the question you have to ask, is 125pts and a heavy support slot worth 0.89 extra wounds on MEQ?
For me, that's got to be a no.

So even without grenades the full squad of dogs wins combat by double.

Of course I make some assumptions:
1) no dogs die from over watch. Although this isn't really relevant to the grenade question.
2) the hounds are at full strength (but by the other side of the coin, I'm assuming the GHs are full strength)
3) no grimoire on the dogs. Which would have cut the losses.

I am going to be experimenting with them a bit this week. I think you will find them a lot more useful with Tau and Eldar taking center stage in the new meta. The skull cannon ignores jink saves on hammerheads (yes I know they are armor 13 on the front) and gaks markerlight pathfinders. They also ignore the jink saves on mechdar and troop jetbikes which a lot of people will be taking in the next months. Wave serpents should be bunched up nicely for this if they are trying to avoid our fast assault units . Soulgrinders are a bit too expensive if you go the extra battle cannon route imho.

-Drakkol

I'm not using a one shot weapon with ap5 to peel a single hull point each turn. That's a horribly inefficient way to use the skullcannon and to kill vehicles.

So what happens when you take one Daemon prince, he gets shot to crap before he does anything, the grinders are meh imo, yes the large blast is nice at ap3 but how many times will cover saves be taken against that?, what happens when you are facing Tau or Eldar behind aegis lines, 4 plus covers (or gtg for 2plus and use their rally ability) and eldar having shrouded warlocks for 2plus cover saves. The bs3 on the grinder really is not appealing as a three shot str 7 AA weapon either.

2 skull cannons is 250pts, I cant get a decent prince for that, cheapest soul ginder is 165pts (with Khorne, who wants that? ha),

Of course I could drop out the two cannons and some hounds for a prince but one prince on his own will not be enough to support the rest of the army, he will be ok as it will be either the hounds they are shooting or the prince but at 4 wounds he wouldnt last long.

 Griddlelol wrote:
I'm not using a one shot weapon with ap5 to peel a single hull point each turn. That's a horribly inefficient way to use the skullcannon and to kill vehicles.

I think of it more as giving you options, as it's strong enough to threaten most vehicles in addition to smashing light infantry and providing assault grenades.

Biggest drawback I see is not providing and AA firepower.

Given the lack of MEQ armies in the current meta, I've found it to be pretty good for the price.

Is thus better than the soul grinder?