wraith knight: a shooter, a beater, or a both-er?

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**kitch102**

I play de and as many others no doubt are, I'm gonna bring in some craftworlders as allies. I've always liked the wraithxxxxx models, and the idea of having a wraith knight as my hq (using iyanden supplement) is very appealing, with wraith guard amd wraith lords to boot.

Can anyone tell me where the knight is best placed though? It seems to have access to pretty devastating guns, though with cc options available too I can't decide which it's aimed more at?

**Vaktathi**

It's an anti-big thing unit really, at least it it's most effective configuration. It's primary method of attack should be its ranged weapons, utiliizing the CC ability in more of a counterattack role or to exploit a gap once created with your firepower.

Toss S10 AP2 shots into an MC or tanks at range, if anything shows up in your lines give it a volley and dive it into CC and make those S10 CC attacks work for you.

**kitch102**

Cool beans, that's what I'd hoped

I face tau and orcs exclusively, is it best off with the big guns or multiple smaller, higher rate of fire weapons? Presumably it'd be the big guns to take on rip tides and battlewagons, leaving the rest to deal with everything else?

Really I need to get a copy of the dex to see the options available and what the guns are capable of, as they're just names to me atm. Do we know anything about how they differ for iyanden yet, other than capable of being a warlord?

**Peregrine**

kitch102 wrote:
wraith knight as my hq (using iyanden supplement)

Note that HQ and warlord are not the same thing. Doesn't the supplement just have it be your warlord? So you'd get all the benefits of the warlord traits on that model, but it's still heavy support.

**zephoid**

WK out shoot melee armies and out-melee shooty armies. Thats how eldar are supposed to run. Wraithlord are too slow to fill that role. The jump infantry characteristic makes the wraithknight worth taking. If the enemy doesnt bring a balanced army, you can focus on one aspect or the other, then let the wraithknight deal with the other. If he brings heavy melee, kill the shooty part with your army and kite the rest. If he brings shooty heavy, kill the melee and close to assault.

**Warboss Brokentoof**

I think the wrath knight is too expensive for what it does I vote to not "bother".

**kitch102**

What do you suggest as a viable alternative to the wraith knight, depending on load out, for it's points cost and consumption of just one force org slot?

(Genuine question)

**Sasori**

Here is my quote from one of the other threads about the Wraithknight:

For a while, I was pretty much in the "No-take" camp, but Then I actually started using it.

It's actually, really good, in it's base configuration.

I'm never suprised at the amount of T5 Targets without EW it has available, it's also pretty good in close combat. You don't really need to hide it either. Just stick it's foot in Terrain, and you have a 5+ cover save.

So far, it hasn't died in any of my games that I've used it in. You just have to mix the Wraithcannon shooting and assault when you need it.

Remember, it gets a strength 10 HOW attack, even if it doesn't have an AP, that's a pretty good way to start out a cc.

While Ancedotal, last game my WK killed Three Oblits, 3 Termies, and a squad of Noise Marines. It more than made back it's points, and only took 3W in the process.

With the Iyanden supplement, you can make it your Warlord, and benefit from the Warlord trait table therein. The WK benefits a great amount from most of the traits.

I think overtime, you'll start to see them used more often. On paper, they are pretty off-putting, at first. Once you use them effectively though, you'll be pretty surprised. It's a lot harder to take them down than you think, and their firepower+assault is quite good.

**Halfpast_Yellow**

I too think the default bare bones upgrade is best, complements the Wave-serpents nicely, bringing long range Str10 AP2 and some form of melee ability.

**DrCrook**

What would you say is the best way to take one out? What should these guys try to avoid?

**Sasori**

DrCrook wrote:
What would you say is the best way to take one out? What should these guys try to avoid?

Take them stock.

Avoid Poisoned weapons in CC, and things like TH/SS termies, and Horde units.

**DaddyWarcrimes**

DrCrook wrote:
What would you say is the best way to take one out? What should these guys try to avoid?

Avoid other Eldar (Distort spam is dirty), Grey Knights with Daemon Hammers, Mephiston, Swarmlord, anything with poisoned attacks, Jaws (you still die on a 1 in 6), and anything else that can Instant Death you, or pile wounds onto you despite your T8.

**kitch102**

In this months WD there's a comment about it finally being tied down by th ss termis. Not sure how they compare points wise, though if it's a case of spending that simply to neautralise an equally expensive or higher points cost model, it may be worth it just to save your other units?

**lokust2501**

I don't understand how it can get caught by terminators that are slower than it unless it has done something horribly wrong.

**Nivoglibina**

lokust2501 wrote:
I don't understand how it can get caught by terminators that are slower than it unless it has done something horribly wrong.

Landraider most likely

**kitch102**

Deepstrike next to it and assault?

**Powerguy**

Nivoglibina wrote:
lokust2501 wrote:
I don't understand how it can get caught by terminators that are slower than it unless it has done something horribly wrong.

Landraider most likely

You have still done something horribly wrong if you get caught by Terminators out of a Land Raider. They have a 24" reach at best (realistically a more like a 18-20" reach, they don't have Fleet) and you can move 12" per turn. The assumption would be that you don't just zerg a WK straight at things that can kill it, you screen it with stuff if there are things that might threaten it.

kitch102 wrote:Deepstrike next to it and assault?

They can't assault the turn they arrive, so the WK can either a) jump 12" away and leave the Terminators with a very long charge (depends on how close/crazy the Deep Strike was) or b) get some help from the rest of his army (you know, the Eldar army that has torrent of fire and quasi Rending coming out its ears) to trim down the Terminators so he can charge in and squash the last couple himself.

**McNinja**

The only reason you should charge terminators is after you've shot them to kingdom come and there's a straggler who refuses to die. Then you charge him, kill him, then gtfo.

The WK is a fantastic support unit, buffed immensely by the Runes of Battle table (regain +1 wound per turn? sure). By itself, it will only lay down some of the law (meaning it won't chop through dedicated assault units or annihilate tanks), but when accompanied by a Spiritseer or Farseer (or both), it becomes amazing. The standard configuration looks to be the best, the rest are too expensive and simply do not provide enough of a bonus, especially when that bonus (usually re-rolls to hit) can be found elsewhere.

As I see it, the WK is halfway between the Riptide and Avatar; a jack of all trades, master of none. If it hits, it hurts, but it doesn't have enough shots or attacks to justify throwing at whole units of Terminators. And, as with pretty much everything, it gets stupid awesome with psychic powers.

**Aeroroot**

As a tau player, I usually laugh at a wraithlord trying to outshoot me. I usually pack a railhead or two, so big models like that don't last long if I have my way. That being said, I am deathly afraid of wraithlords in close combat. I'm not overly familiar with their rules, but in terms of points, if you are going to shoot, use a squad of war walkers instead. Then again, if you are dark eldar, why bother with shooty eldar support anyway if you have enough dark lances and such. As for close combat, which is better: a wraithlord or a talos? I honestly don't know, since I have actually never played against one.
From what I have seen of Iyanden codex, a wraithguard unit with spiritseer is scary (as long as they can get in range) especially with the possibility of battle focus. Also, their crazy singing spear-of-everything-being-toast is an amazing upgrade. Oh, and d-flamers? (shudders)