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What if the Tyranids preceeded the Eldar and possibly the old ones? They are the galactic locust swarm and even though they are coming in from unknown space, maybe they are just on a return sweep? This may be further backed up by the ymgarl stealers being left dormant ahead of the swarm, or possibly left behind. The Ymgarl are also not absorbed by the Hive after they meet up. This may be due to their advanced independence, or a long forgotten strain the Hive no longer wishes to assimilate with. There are numerous instances in nature where life can be found in inhospitable circumstances only to emerge when the conditions are optimal, such as the triop that can remain dormant for decades until rain arrives. This could also explain how the Eldar found so many worlds ripe for terra forming into maiden worlds. They were already stripped bare by the Tyranids and all other forms of life and danger removed and ready for maiden world forming.

Quite possible, especially when you consider the distance between our galaxy and any other galaxy that the Tyranids may have just left, and the time it would have taken them to cross that void*. If they were here before, it could have been billions of years ago...

*Assuming the Tyranids don't have more cool/weird physics-breaking bio-tech developed from Throne-knows where that lets them travel super-fast, making the staggering distance a bit less of an issue.

A planet that is stripped bare by the Tyranids is no longer capable of supporting life. Even its atmosphere is consumed. I'm not certain that the Eldar's terraforming capabilities are quite that good.

 Psienesis wrote:
A planet that is stripped bare by the Tyranids is no longer capable of supporting life. Even its atmosphere is consumed. I'm not certain that the Eldar's terraforming capabilities are quite that good.

The Eldar, perhaps not, the Old Ones? Quite possibly.

Thats not an outrageous idea.

It happens in nature on our planet, why wouldnt it happen our there??

I would like to see the rules for a Genestealer cult again...that was a cool idea and it should be more fully explored...it would be a great way to allow I.G. allies in a Tyranid army...

Xyptc wrote:
Quite possible, especially when you consider the distance between our galaxy and any other galaxy that the Tyranids may have just left, and the time it would have taken them to cross that void*. If they were here before, it could have been billions of years ago...

*Assuming the Tyranids don't have more cool/weird physics-breaking bio-tech developed from Throne-knows where that lets them travel super-fast, making the staggering distance a bit less of an issue.

They did. Pretty much the nids use a technique to ride gravity waves. Not as fast as warp travel, but still much much faster than normal.

I'd hate to have them be 40k's version of the reapers.

I thought 40k had the "reapers". Or maybe I am thinking of the Enslavers.

 mjl7atlas wrote:
I thought 40k had the "reapers". Or maybe I am thinking of the Enslavers.

The Enslaver plague was closer to the flood than anything else.

 Kain wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
A planet that is stripped bare by the Tyranids is no longer capable of supporting life. Even its atmosphere is consumed. I'm not certain that the Eldar's terraforming capabilities are quite that good.

The Eldar, perhaps not, the Old Ones? Quite possibly.

The Old Ones are gone, though, and were gone well before the end of the War in Heaven. The Eldar did not have the time to start building Maiden Worlds and the like until the Ctan-Necron-Eldar-Krork-Old One War was over with, leaving the Eldar the undisputed masters of the galaxy. Also, prior to the War in Heaven, the Old Ones did not give much of a gak about physical space, as they had the Webway and the Warp to play in...

... and, also, and not insignificantly, in RealSpace, we have the Nightbringer, who is a physical embodiment of the concept of death, and is said to be responsible for the innate, primal fear of death in all living things. Since the Tyranids seem to lack this fear, we can assume that they did not enter a galaxy at any point that had the Nightbringer alive, active and unsharded in it. Since we know that the C'Tan have no beginnings and no ends, this indicates that the Tyranid have never before been in the Milky Way, at least not prior to the War in Heaven.

No idea what the 40k reapers are/were, but if anything, the Necrons are closer to Mass Effect's reapers than the Tyranids are. Reapers can actually be spoken to and reasoned with, but they see the galaxy as theirs to control and lesser races should be culled to allow for their return and dominance.

Tyranids, though... Tyranids, they just gotta EAT.

Its unlikely this is the second time the Nids have come around.

What is known, is that the Genestealers were sent far ahead of the main fleets and have been here for thousands of years.


There are also some planets that have some life forms that are theorized to be of tyranid origin. Cut off from the hive mind completely after thousands of years of separation.

This means it is possible a scouting hive fleet passed through the galaxy thousands or potentially millions of years ago. Leaving behind Genestealers and a few other species, with only the Genestealers remaining true to the hive mind.




The Tyranids, after consuming a Galaxy, likely send out scouting organisms to find new feeding grounds. Genestealers being the primary component, but not the only one.

After new grounds are found, the main mass will head towards the new galaxy.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Its unlikely this is the second time the Nids have come around.

What is known, is that the Genestealers were sent far ahead of the main fleets and have been here for thousands of years.


There are also some planets that have some life forms that are theorized to be of tyranid origin. Cut off from the hive mind completely after thousands of years of separation.

This means it is possible a scouting hive fleet passed through the galaxy thousands or potentially millions of years ago. Leaving behind Genestealers and a few other species, with only the Genestealers remaining true to the hive mind.




The Tyranids, after consuming a Galaxy, likely send out scouting organisms to find new feeding grounds. Genestealers being the primary component, but not the only one.

After new grounds are found, the main mass will head towards the new galaxy.

please explain why this is unlikely. your points could actually be made to support my theory.

Given the speed Tyranids move, it would have been uncounted billions of years for them to have eaten this galaxy, nommed a bunch more, and then come back to this one where life has come back. Simply not enough time for that to have happened.

The Necrons would also surely remember this threat.



Any remnants of tyranids that came here before the main hive fleets are almost assuredly the remains of the scouting forces the Nids send out to find food.

They have integrated into the lifeforms of this galaxy to act as a beacon for the fleets.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Any remnants of tyranids that came here before the main hive fleets are almost assuredly the remains of the scouting forces the Nids send out to find food.

They have integrated into the lifeforms of this galaxy to act as a beacon for the fleets.

Just to expand on this.

This is old fluff, but not contradicted. There's examples in the older codicies of life forms of the galaxy that resemble, even slightly, Tyranids and have no known origins. One example is the Catachan Devil, and 'Von Horstmanns Leaper' which draws similarities to a Hormagaunt. When Tyranids scout a planet, they send out a Vanguard, made up of Lictors and Genestealers, to assess a planets bioresources and defensive strength. It's not unlikely they'd do the same with galaxies, and the remnants you mention from eariler codicies are a good indicator that they do.

People get too worked up about the single line Cruddace put in the 5th edition codex about the astronomican drawing the Tyranids. Once they're here, sure, it's a huge 'free buffet' sign, since psychic beacons like that are how Tyranid vanguards signal fleets. The astronomican, to the Tyranids, looks like a massive system full of life rich, defenseless worlds. A perfect meal.

The problem is the astronomican doesn't reach past the galaxy - it doesn't even reach the limit of the Eastern Fringe, which is where the Tyranids originally attacked from. So something drew the Tyranids to the Milky Way, and it wasn't the astronomican. The remnant organisms point to very outstretched vanguard fleets, which makes sense. Some managed to prosper and broadcast a beacon - Ymgarl Genestealers. It's not unlikely there's more that humanity just never found.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Any remnants of tyranids that came here before the main hive fleets are almost assuredly the remains of the scouting forces the Nids send out to find food.

They have integrated into the lifeforms of this galaxy to act as a beacon for the fleets.

Just to expand on this.

This is old fluff, but not contradicted. There's examples in the older codicies of life forms of the galaxy that resemble, even slightly, Tyranids and have no known origins. One example is the Catachan Devil, and 'Von Horstmanns Leaper' which draws similarities to a Hormagaunt. When Tyranids scout a planet, they send out a Vanguard, made up of Lictors and Genestealers, to assess a planets bioresources and defensive strength. It's not unlikely they'd do the same with galaxies, and the remnants you mention from eariler codicies are a good indicator that they do.

People get too worked up about the single line Cruddace put in the 5th edition codex about the astronomican drawing the Tyranids. Once they're here, sure, it's a huge 'free buffet' sign, since psychic beacons like that are how Tyranid vanguards signal fleets. The astronomican, to the Tyranids, looks like a massive system full of life rich, defenseless worlds. A perfect meal.

The problem is the astronomican doesn't reach past the galaxy - it doesn't even reach the limit of the Eastern Fringe, which is where the Tyranids originally attacked from. So something drew the Tyranids to the Milky Way, and it wasn't the astronomican. The remnant organisms point to very outstretched vanguard fleets, which makes sense. Some managed to prosper and broadcast a beacon - Ymgarl Genestealers. It's not unlikely there's more that humanity just never found.

Technically, if we want to expand this even further, bringing in the subject of scouting fleets and the Ymgarls, there is a distinct possibility that the reason why the Ymgarl strain is so valuable, and yet so hated, is a purposeful trait imposed by the Hive Mind makes it the ultimate long term survival mechanism. The Hive Mind creates one of only a few organisms among the hive that are capable of surviving long terms in stasis, the other notable one being the hive guard which are capable of being brought to full term and then being left unborn until needed. So, the Hive Mind obviously originated from some biomass rich environment. So, it eats all the food, and now it's facing starvation. It packs up it's bags and faces an issue of transportation. So, rather than putting all it's eggs in one basket, it shoots out most likely countless pods of Ymgarls, newly engineered to survive long periods of time without activity. You think about it the hive spreading out in every direction behind them, there is a distinct possibility that the vast majority of the Tyranid fleets could be millions if not billions of years out from the galaxy since most would likely be having to pull some serious travel time in to catch up to the closest fleets. Long story short, why absorb a specially created organism whose sole purpose is to live and find the next source of food for the rest of them?

 Grey Templar wrote:
Given the speed Tyranids move, it would have been uncounted billions of years for them to have eaten this galaxy, nommed a bunch more, and then come back to this one where life has come back. Simply not enough time for that to have happened.

The Necrons would also surely remember this threat.

I thought they did. Isn't that why the Silent King returned, so he could unite the Necrons against the Tyranids? (and also one of the reasons the necrons were played up as the rivals to the necrons here and there) Though I could be interpreting it wrong and there could be alternate explnations.

TiamatRoar wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Given the speed Tyranids move, it would have been uncounted billions of years for them to have eaten this galaxy, nommed a bunch more, and then come back to this one where life has come back. Simply not enough time for that to have happened.

The Necrons would also surely remember this threat.

I thought they did. Isn't that why the Silent King returned, so he could unite the Necrons against the Tyranids? (and also one of the reasons the necrons were played up as the rivals to the necrons here and there) Though I could be interpreting it wrong and there could be alternate explnations.

The Silent King saw them coming when he was in the extragalactic void (GW mistakenly keep calling it the intergalactic void). Tyranids don't move particularly fast - while they have a means of rapid transit, it's still sublight speed. When he saw them, they were on their way. That was actually only about 200 years before the current time in the 40k timeline, so he saw them when they were fairly close.

 -Loki- wrote:
The Silent King saw them coming when he was in the extragalactic void (GW mistakenly keep calling it the intergalactic void). Tyranids don't move particularly fast - while they have a means of rapid transit, it's still sublight speed. When he saw them, they were on their way. That was actually only about 200 years before the current time in the 40k timeline, so he saw them when they were fairly close.

Not really Loki, Narvhals seem to just pop open a worm hole to make most of the jumps very short. It's the issue with reaching the point where gravity forces them to slow down and travel at sublight speed. Tie in the fact that tapping into the gravitational well disrupts natural forces, and it's actually rather odd that things haven't happened on a galactic level. I wonder actually, now that I think about it, if some of the warp storms in the previous centuries, perhaps even as far as several thousand years ago, or even before the Horus Heresy, could be considered natural disasters. It gives you some decent speculation if its been over 10,000 years and only the forward sections of the hive have reached the galaxy. Then again, this is where people start arguing over just how much gravitational pull a galaxy exerts outside of itself.

Narvhals use gravitational lensing magic. No wormholes, not warp.

I actually missed the little part about it being light speed. However, as you said, it's debateable about galactic gravitational forces. Honest speculation would be they'd need to be fairly close before their Narvhals could do it, which would require a long time at sublight.

Even still - at light speed, the Andromeda is is 2.5 million light years away from Earth. That's a long distance even at light speed.

 -Loki- wrote:
Narvhals use gravitational lensing magic. No wormholes, not warp.

I actually missed the little part about it being light speed. However, as you said, it's debateable about galactic gravitational forces. Honest speculation would be they'd need to be fairly close before their Narvhals could do it, which would require a long time at sublight.

Even still - at light speed, the Andromeda is is 2.5 million light years away from Earth. That's a long distance even at light speed.

Actually, reading up on the Narvhal, it seems that it can tap into a gravitational pull from any distance. It's only once it gets into its actual gravity well that it becomes a problem. You know, it's a shame they never go into the technical side of our forces. A nice Xenobiology book based solely on Tyranids would be rather interesting.

Even if they can act at any distance they still require a stupid amount of time to travel between galaxies.

And that also assumes the speed they travel is constant regardless of distance, which is unlikely.

 Unyielding Hunger wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
Narvhals use gravitational lensing magic. No wormholes, not warp.

I actually missed the little part about it being light speed. However, as you said, it's debateable about galactic gravitational forces. Honest speculation would be they'd need to be fairly close before their Narvhals could do it, which would require a long time at sublight.

Even still - at light speed, the Andromeda is is 2.5 million light years away from Earth. That's a long distance even at light speed.

Actually, reading up on the Narvhal, it seems that it can tap into a gravitational pull from any distance. It's only once it gets into its actual gravity well that it becomes a problem. You know, it's a shame they never go into the technical side of our forces. A nice Xenobiology book based solely on Tyranids would be rather interesting.

I would pay good money for such a book.

Also, a moment of Fridge Logic. Narvhal's mess with the gravity of whatever they are pulling the fleet towards, resulting in earthquakes and other craziness. Maybe a galaxy-to-galaxy transit has an even bigger effect... hence supermassive black holes at the centre of the Milky Way!

I still have a copy of the old Xenobiology book. As a young kid who liked science and was learning about dissecting things, it was really fascinating.

 Enigwolf wrote:
I still have a copy of the old Xenobiology book. As a young kid who liked science and was learning about dissecting things, it was really fascinating.

Xenology is still one of the best fluff pieces GW has ever made.

Despite the fact that almost nothing in it can be taken as in-universe truth. It's more useful for illustrating how terrible the AdMech actually is at Science.

 Psienesis wrote:
Despite the fact that almost nothing in it can be taken as in-universe truth. It's more useful for illustrating how terrible the AdMech actually is at Science.

Hey, they are learning, slowly but surely. Sure there will be some snags along the way, a destroyed forge world or two, several science ships replaced with debris, several slave uprisings here and there, but hey, they will get there eventually. Personally, I would take the book at maybe 75% factual and the rest being GWs sense of humor.

Considering the Xenobiology book is 1) an in-character source and hence its conclusions are suspect and fallible, and 2) GW manages to get its biological terminology woefully wrong, I wouldn't put much weight on anything in that book.

Iracundus wrote:
Considering the Xenobiology book is 1) an in-character source and hence its conclusions are suspect and fallible, and 2) GW manages to get its biological terminology woefully wrong, I wouldn't put much weight on anything in that book.

It does state in almost no uncertain terms that the Ethereals are the Eldar's gift to the Tau which seems to be backed up by the inordinate fondness the Eldar have for the Tau and the fact that they're battle brothers in game. And it's just Xenology.

Iracundus wrote:
2) GW manages to get its biological terminology woefully wrong.

Implying you're an expert on the proper scientific terms used to describe alien biology in the 41st millenium