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Ok, so I'm trying to determine what models to buy for my theme-y 1500 pts list. Here's what it absolutely must have:

FAST ATTACK
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)


DETACHMENT (Imperial Guard):

FAST ATTACK
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)

Total (so far...): 460



I've been painting a ton of these Tallarn Rough Riders for WarbossTae's challenge and I really want to max out on them, but I want to make the most effective list possible under these restrictions... What am I going to need? I figure I'll probably need some Hydra Flak? As I don't have the option to get Vendettas, but you tell me.

Sorry, but your list is like asking how to cut your balls off, and still have kids.
Hydras will help with flyers, but they won't keep those horses and riders from dying horridly.....

You can't have an army ally with itself.

What is your primary detachment? Right now you have IG dex + IG dex allies...which is impossible.

Take IA12 DKoK assault list. Take grenadieers, deathrider platoons in the FA slots, and some thunderbolt fighters for your AA needs (they are HS). The deathriders are downright better rough riders and can take a commissar in the command squad (you could theoretically take 66 riders per FA slot).

 LordHamshire wrote:
Ok, so I'm trying to determine what models to buy for my theme-y 1500 pts list. Here's what it absolutely must have:

FAST ATTACK
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)


DETACHMENT (Imperial Guard):

FAST ATTACK
Seekers of Slannesh

Something like that could work. Pair a couple of doom horror squads & a doomy LoC.... Charrrge!

Oh, sorry.

Well how about this:

FAST ATTACK:
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)


BTW, I know I'm never going to win, I'm just saying to lose the least horrendously.

Check out the forge world Talaan riders

I don't know what IA there from but a google search should help

 LordHamshire wrote:
Oh, sorry.

Well how about this:

FAST ATTACK:
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)
Rough Rider Squad (Sergeant w/Power Weapon)


BTW, I know I'm never going to win, I'm just saying to lose the least horrendously.

I really think using them with ANYTHING other than a HL is a waste.
You can still Add Vets, PIS squads, PCS and CCS, right?
What about Tanks?

I'd try to give them cover with something like Chimeras (Vets, PCS, CCS) maybe?
The biggest problem is they're so fragile and there's really no way to change it, IMHO.

EDIT:
FWIW there's nothing wrong with buying and collecting units you don't field. That covers about 1/3 of my collection.

I almost think that arming the squad with two flamers might help, since they can run around and flame infantry if they win the first round of combat.

Also, you can use conscripts or large blob squads as a honey trap to lure squads into CC, then hit them in the rear with the RRs.

Ratlings and PSBs would also work to pin units and allow you to get the charge on them. Or three PSBs and a few colossi to encourage people to get out of cover.

Durandal wrote:
I almost think that arming the squad with two flamers might help, since they can run around and flame infantry if they win the first round of combat.

Also, you can use conscripts or large blob squads as a honey trap to lure squads into CC, then hit them in the rear with the RRs.

Ratlings and PSBs would also work to pin units and allow you to get the charge on them. Or three PSBs and a few colossi to encourage people to get out of cover.

Why would I be lured into CC with something that I can kill very easily by shooting? They're easier to see/ harder to hide IG troops, T 3.
Trust me, I REALLY want to like them and say they can work. So do the 3 squads I have.....

Best way is to have small squads that can run around with flamers.. If they're small enough (5) hide them behind tanks, And move to make best use of flames at last moment

You can also have one squad with full sticks that's can counter-charge any platoon squads that get assaulted..

You need Mogul Kamir for this list. A unit of Fearless, Rage, and Furious Charge at a baseline St 5 and I 5 powerweapons will crush just about any other infantry in the game.

Now, to make this list viable I see this working like this:

HQ -160

Colonel Iron Hand Straken
Astropath
Bodyguard

Elites

Gaurdsman Marbo -65

Stormtroopers - 1 Meltagun -95 points (Use Behind Enemy Lines)

Troops - 285

Captain Al'Rahem 100
Ministorum Priest with Eviscerator- 45

4 Meltaguns 40 points

Infantry Squad 1
Infantry Squad 2
Infantry Squad 3
Infantry Squad 4

Troops 2 - 185 points

Vets
Harker
Demolitions
3 Meltaguns

Troops 3 - 115 points
Vets
Forward Sentries
3 Snipers

Fast:

460 of your RR's

Sub a sergeant (-10 points), Add Mogul Kamir + 40 points

Points so far: 1,395

Dark Angel Allies

Lib level 2 100 points

Total: 1495

Here's how this goes: Because you are trading your armor for this level of FA, your goal is to divert fire from it for as long as possible. 2 Squads of vets, Marbo, and Stormtroopers can all infiltrate and destroy your enemy's armor extremely early in the game. (this is imperative!) It will also bog down the enemy. Your core platoon of 40 models will come in fairly early because of your Astropath (as will Marbo). Use this flanking to hit wherever you think is needed most, then get Al'Raham's unit and Straken into combat as soon as possible. Altogether, their aura bonus's are this: Furious Charge, and Counter attack, Straken has a powerfist that strikes at I 3 (4 on charge). he and his unit are fearless, and Al'Rahem has Reroll to Hit, as well as inflicts instant death on any failed invuln save. Talk about stuck between a rock and hard place.

Now add several dozen charging Horsemen at S 6 I 6 and Rage.

Finally, why the Librarian? Look up "Invisibility" and watch what happens to your enemies when they can't shoot or attack your Cavalry.....

The only problem I'd see you having is with flier spam. If that's the case, get rid of Marbo and your ST's take 150 of Hydra's and you're fine.

The only way to make best use of them I'm afraid is to keep them small and cheap, and put lots of other targets to shoot at (blobs) but they will need backup from REAL units..
If you use flamers send them behind a chimera full of vets with plasma/ melta.. If you want counter charge sticks keep them behind large blobs of 30+ w/commissar and Heavy

Like was stated before, look at the IA12 list, platoons of rough riders with 4+ armour, 2 wounds, FNP, Rough rider command squads.

It's not just a barely viable way to run them, they are just good.

 alarmingrick wrote:
Sorry, but your list is like asking how to cut your balls off, and still have kids.

Before I offer some tips I just wanted to be a smart alleck and answer this: Adoption!

Now tactics wise you could run a few leman russes and hide the rough riders behind them and move them up the field. When you feel that you are in a resonably good and/or easy charge range spread your tanks out and run the Riders through the gaps, seen this work quite well.

Strayan wrote:
The only way to make best use of them I'm afraid is to keep them small and cheap,

10 Rough Riders is small and cheap. Taking three of those doesn't really change things, it leaves you 1200 points to spend on things most people would ignorantly shoot at first, like tanks or troops.

 gmaleron wrote:

 alarmingrick wrote:
Sorry, but your list is like asking how to cut your balls off, and still have kids.

Before I offer some tips I just wanted to be a smart alleck and answer this: Adoption!

Now tactics wise you could run a few leman russes and hide the rough riders behind them and move them up the field. When you feel that you are in a resonably good and/or easy charge range spread your tanks out and run the Riders through the gaps, seen this work quite well.

That why I said "have". Maybe I should have gone with "produce"!

I also considered that suggestion. Now your harder to hide, fragile MSU is stuck moving Russ speed. Slower is worse for them, IMHO.
You're making them easier to pick off. That's why I suggested Chimera, for the 12" move. Still wouldn't run them, and certainly not 30.....

I just don't think they are worth the points/efffective enough to be guarding with 55 point vehicles, lol. Points you could be spending on trying to make up for lost points where ever you can, right?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I like a lot of DemetriDominov's idea. Like 'Iron Hand'.

Here's my idea for a list though it may be a bit hypocritical to the the statement above:


Company Command Squad (Colonel 'Iron Hand' Straken, Laspistols, Medi-pack, Regimental Standard, 1 Heavy Flamer, 1 Flamer, Astropath, 2 Bodyguards)


Guardsman Marbo


Infantry Platoon:
Platoon Command Squad (Desert Raiders, Captain Al'Rahem, Vox-Caster, 3 Plasma Guns)
Infantry Squad (Desert Raiders, Sergeant w/Plasma Pistol, Plasma Gun, Vox-Casters)
Infantry Squad (Desert Raiders, Sergeant w/Plasma Pistol, Plasma Gun, Vox-Casters)

Veteran Squad (Gunnery Sergeant Harker, Desert Raiders, 3 Plasma Guns, Heavy Bolter, Forward Sentries)


Rough Rider Squad (Five Additional Rough Riders, Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Five Additional Rough Riders, Sergeant w/Power Sword)
Rough Rider Squad (Mogul Kahmir, Five Additional Rough Riders)


Ordnance Battery (Medusa w/Bastion-Breacher Shells)
Ordnance Battery (Medusa w/Bastion-Breacher Shells)
Hydra Flak Tank Battery (2 Hydra Flak Tanks)

 LordHamshire wrote:
I just don't think they are worth the points/efffective enough to be guarding with 55 point vehicles, lol. Points you could be spending on trying to make up for lost points where ever you can, right?

But if you're using them to transport and screen and use their weapons, it's a solid 55 point investment.

In regards to your list, you don't need to put forward sentries on Harker's Squad. They already have stealth.

Consider getting Meltabombs for your RR's since you really don't have much Anti Armor in your list. Other than that, I think you're golden.

I bet people are going to be pretty surprised to see RR's on the field, and even more surprised when they find out how you'll use them effectively. I +1 this thread due to it's bawlsyness and willingness to be part of a theme not many try.

Definitely bring Mogul Khamir, you can use the Empire Mechanical Horse model as a basis for a pretty cool conversion.

Otherwise, cram 2 melta guns into each squad. That way after they blow their proverbial load, they can still threaten things...

 DemetriDominov wrote:
In regards to your list, you don't need to put forward sentries on Harker's Squad. They already have stealth.

Consider getting Meltabombs for your RR's since you really don't have much Anti Armor in your list. Other than that, I think you're golden.

I bet people are going to be pretty surprised to see RR's on the field, and even more surprised when they find out how you'll use them effectively. I +1 this thread due to it's bawlsyness and willingness to be part of a theme not many try.

They FAQed either Harkers ability or Forward Sentries I don't remember, either way they stack.

Meltabombs might be a good idea, they're pretty cheap.

Thanks!

Fair enough. Think it's time for me to check out that FAQ.

 DemetriDominov wrote:

Dark Angel Allies

Lib level 2 100 points

Total: 1495

Aren't you missing a DA troop selection?