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Made in us
Old Sourpuss






Lakewood, Ohio

I'd be interested to see it, might as well post it for the masses man.

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Made in gb
The Daemon Possessing Fulgrim's Body





Devon, UK

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
But if you want a look at it, I would gladly PM it to you. But I'm afraid you missed the great spelling and grammar error party me and Azreal had, but extra input is always welcome.


I wouldn't go that far, considering I'm literally 2 1/2 times your age, with all my extra education and life experience, if I couldn't have made at least a bit of a contribution it would have been a bad job.

As it was, you had written a solid cake of a letter, I just tarted up the icing a bit!

We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark

The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.

The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox

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Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

Where's the letter?

Remember:

Short, to the point, factual, avoid getting emotional, and ask for some sort of clear resolution. These are all the elements of a good complaint letter. Never say "I'm never shopping here again!" because you remove all incentive for them to fix your problem; and that's what these letters are: a problem to be fixed, not a rant.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/27 20:15:23


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.

 Flinty wrote:
The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
 
   
Made in us
Fireknife Shas'el





EDIT: NOTE THIS DAY YOU SCURVY CAT LOVERS, Frazzled may have been wrong. I know I am as shocked as you are.
In PMs with the OP he sounds like a very balanced chap and I am impressed with the whole taking an army on a bus thing, so I now pitch my tent in his camp. You're all still a bunch of hippy tree huggers though, and probably like cats too.


This quote is exactly how I am explaining frazzled from now on.


As far as I can see the kid did the right thing The Manager is doing the right thing in reacting to Multiple complaints. Simple as that.

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Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

 captain collius wrote:
As far as I can see the kid did the right thing The Manager is doing the right thing in reacting to Multiple complaints. Simple as that.

Agreed, captain collius. Also quoting this over since it got caught on the last page:

 RiTides wrote:
The letter should most definitely Not be posted here. It's already a bit of a circus :-/ and Alex indicated he wanted this to remain on-topic and positive (as much as possible). Publicly posting the letter of complaint would not be appropriate, imo. There is a reason things like that are conducted privately / in confidence.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/27 19:45:03


 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Agreed.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in gb
Angered Reaver Arena Champion




Connah's Quay, North Wales

I will post it up here if that's what the Masses wish, I just thought it may of caused unneeded arguments over where the comma should go and such .

Read at your own peril, I would prefer input to be PM'ed to me rather then put on the thread if possible so as to not clutter the thread.
Spoiler:
To GW Chester, A letter of concern

This is my account of what happened on Wednesday 14th August.

I took the bus into Chester and arrived at the store at around 11 o'clock. I went into the store with the intention to buy an army figure case, but upon seeing it was out of stock I decided to wait until my dad came out of work to ask him to order one in for me. The member of staff welcomed me but was engrossed in watching a game. I greeted my friend playing the game and decided to watch the game until its finish, then play a game with him.

After the game finished my friend and I were discussing point limits and such and began to place models on the table. Upon rolling for mysterious objectives I realized I didn't have my Main Rulebook with me (it wouldn't fit in the smaller case I brought with me in anticipation of bringing a new figure case home) and my friend didn't either so another friend offered to let us use his. The member of staff then came along and told us to pack up because we didn't have our own main rulebooks. I explained why I didn't have mine, he remarked ''Should have bought a bigger case'', I pointed out the irony that I intended to buy one that same day. He said ''not my problem''. My friend, who had come in specifically to play some games, decided he would leave. I thought I could wait in the store until my dad got off work or one of my buses home was due.

I sat down on my figure box near the painting table and began to work from my codices on new army and purchase lists. After a few minutes the staff member came up to me and asked what I was doing, I told him I was creating an army list. He said ''You could do that at home, have you got anything to paint?''. I replied that I had not brought my painting equipment. He said I would have to find something to do otherwise I would have to leave. I reminded him I was creating an army list. He walked away to talk to a customer. I continued making an army list. When the customer was gone, he called to me ''I am serious, either find something to do or you have to go''. I said I was waiting for my bus, he said ''Well this isn't a day care, either buy some painting equipment or you have to go''. I said that wasn't fair, he remarked ''Life's not fair''. I then said that it's also not in GW's policy of 'We encourage people to come in and play, paint and collect our hobby in our stores', he said that if I didn't leave he would call the police. I asked what he was kicking me out for, he said for ''Doing Nothing''. I once again said this wasn't fair and that I had nowhere to go, he simply said to take it up with you. I said gladly and left.

I waited 1 hour 45 minutes at a bus stop until a bus came to take me home. My normal bus came later at 5 so the bus I caught dropped me off about 45 minutes away from my house. On the way home several of my models found themselves broke by the mileage, although I don't think I can blame that unfortunate consequence on him directly but this understandably soured my day further. Now I am not sure if what he said and did were within his rights to do, they probably were, but I believe how I was treated was not fair to a loyal customer or any customer at all.

I come to the Games Workshop store because of the friendly staff, welcoming environment and like-minded people. These are the things that make the hobby for me as much as the hobby itself, but if the store were to change from the friendly and welcoming environment I am accustomed to, I'd be forced to move to online discount suppliers. People pay the added premium because the Hobby centres are places to pursue the hobby with the help and guidance of friendly staff, and I was disappointed to find, for the first time in many years, that this wasn't the case.

I dearly hope this doesn't occur often, as I know it has never happened before with either you or Adam, so I can continue returning to my favourite hobby in my favourite hobby store again and again.



Highest regards.
Alex Wallace


Any input is good input, but I mainly want to know if I sound whiny or 'Butt-Hurt' or 'Entitled' because i tried to stay away from those things and kept with Facts really.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/08/27 19:53:45


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

Alex... do not post it. Trust me (and Frazzled, although maybe he was responding to the post above mine) on this. I've been around the block on internet forums, and you do not want to grant the "masses" wish, in this case. Handle it in private with the manager / employee, and simply post what the resolution is.

Edit: I see you edited it in above, again, my advice is to remove it... no benefit can really come from having it on the forum that you couldn't get from polishing it via PM. And worse things could come...

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/08/27 19:54:24


 
   
Made in us
Bounding Black Templar Assault Marine





Floor-ahhh-duhhh!

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
I will post it up here if that's what the Masses wish, I just thought it may of caused unneeded arguments over where the comma should go and such .


Any input is good input, but I mainly want to know if I sound whiny or 'Butt-Hurt' or 'Entitled' because i tried to stay away from those things and kept with Facts really.



Alex. Please pull it. You got a lot of feedback already and even moved a few from the employee's camp to yours.

Peace.

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Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

I think thats a really appropriate and well worded letter.

I think the GW Staffer could have been a bit more...diplomatic... in his handling (I don't get the "you don't have your rulebook, so you have to leave thing") but I don't think he was necessarily wrong.

We've been around the whole "not a baby sitting service" notion (and I think it's pretty funny that the staffer actually said that) and we've also done the whole "life's not fair" tango.

With that being said, I hope the GW Staffer isn't reprimanded too harshly or fired, but rather retrained to be a it more gracious to the younger customers.

Regardless, I imagine they will be a bit more clear in what the expectations are of everyone (customers and staff) in regards to treating the store as a clubhouse.

 
   
Made in us
Androgynous Daemon Prince of Slaanesh





Norwalk, Connecticut

Alex, that letter is fantastic, and if I had 14 yr old students writing to that level when I was teaching, I'd be proud as hell. Nice job. Small correction: in the fourth paragraph, you wrote "broke" and it should be "broken". Small fix, but just wanted to help in any way I could.

Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.

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Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.  
   
Made in us
Old Sourpuss






Lakewood, Ohio

Well worded, explains the situation well. Best of luck dude!

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Made in nl
Zealous Knight







I've seen some fellow law students write worse letters than that (admittedly the exceptions, but still).
The one small issue I have with it is that I'd "work into" the introduction a bit more gently (funnel structure etc) but that's really more of a style issue, and a personal one at that.
Well written, not "angry" in a way that would put a reader off of helping you - generally just a good letter of complaint.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/27 20:05:16


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

I'm glad to see that folks read it and reacted reasonably... cheers, Dakka! It's moments like that that give me hope
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

 RiTides wrote:
Xcaliber, I thought your first post was quite reasonable (and the one above)... I think that was just a misunderstanding.

The letter should most definitely Not be posted here. It's already a bit of a circus :-/ and Alex indicated he wanted this to remain on-topic and positive (as much as possible). Publicly posting the letter of complaint would not be appropriate, imo. There is a reason things like that are conducted privately / in confidence.

Agreed. DON'T post the letter in public. Just keep it to PM's for those interested in viewing. Turning this thread into a potential circus isn't going to help your cause.

Oops. Commented too late.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/27 20:07:43



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Made in us
Old Sourpuss






Lakewood, Ohio

 RiTides wrote:
I'm glad to see that folks read it and reacted reasonably... cheers, Dakka! It's moments like that that give me hope

You've hit, "get off my lawn" levels of old person pessimism 'Tides Alex had gotten plenty of help from Dakkanauts, those of us just wished to see what the final outcome of the letter was. If it was one or two people I could see him not posting it just to sate their curiosity, but enough of us were interested.

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Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

Remember that all of us, regardless of what side of the fence you fall, are typically just happy to see coherent letters go to GW.

We usually only see rambling, illogical, over-emotional diatribes that make the community-at-large look like a bunch of over-entitled babies.

This isn't that at all. Thank goodness.

 
   
Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

 RiTides wrote:
Handle it in private with the manager / employee, and simply post what the resolution is.


I agree totally with this... normally. You should absolutely follow the process, and only make a public stink if you're right and if there was no satisfactory resolution.

b-b-but; this is not the case here. The barn door is open and it's not getting locked again, the die has been cast.... we're on page 20 of a public thread. The thread was re-opened specifically so we could have this new information, yes?

If it's a good letter, it serves a useful public benefit since part of the issue was a young adult requested help with conflict resolution.

If it's an awful letter, it's also useful for the same reasons, but as a critique of what not to do.

I found it to be an excellent letter.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.

 Flinty wrote:
The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
 
   
Made in gb
Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control





England

I have been in the same situation as you my friend. I know it may be a bad experiance, for 4 year the same store, every week same time like clockwork. Unfourtnatly, I was kicked out by a new store member, he was also new but what I quickly learned is many on these staff members don't hang around too long. Before you know it he may have already moved on to a different store.

Good for you expressing your story and I wish you good luck in having a good time in games workshop like you used to.

   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

Agreed Ouze, and that's probably why it has worked out OK after posting it... whereas in my mind I saw an absolute trainwreck . Again, cheers Dakka!
   
Made in gb
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord







Great letter. It doesn't come across as an angry rant which is always a good thing!

Definitely feel the disappointment, and the sense of being let down.

What's the manager going to do with this?

   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

 RiTides wrote:
I'm glad to see that folks read it and reacted reasonably... cheers, Dakka! It's moments like that that give me hope


I like it. Its calm, acclaims damages, but is just young enough so other's don't think its a scam. I might have noted insted of online recourse, recourse to other systems, but thats just me.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in gb
Raging Rat Ogre




Hmmm. I've been following this thread with interest and then it's revealed to be the Chester branch...

My best friend (yes, it's one of 'those' stories) who got me into wargaming used to frequent the Chester GW before it moved premises across town and he's since lost all interest in visiting there now, due to what he termed as a 'change in atmosphere' due to staff members. They've become more impersonal and try pressure sales tactics and generally made him feel uncomfortable, according to him. This has always been the GW way as far as I've known!

He's moved on and games at a club more often now and orders off of the internet instead. I'm just a lowly dirty casual (home/garage) player!

At any rate, it's GW's loss.

Best of luck with your letter Alex!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/27 21:42:26


 
   
Made in gb
Morphing Obliterator






Coherent complaint letters? Kanluwen and Frazzled admitting they were wrong? Reasonable discussion on an Internet forum?

Just what the feth have I been drinking?


On-topic: Good luck with the letter Alex! The regular manager sounds like a cool guy, I've met a few people like them before. Unfortunately, I've also met a couple of pushy salespeople as well, but I won't derail your thread!

See, you're trying to use people logic. DM uses Mandelogic, which we've established has 2+2=quack. - Aerethan
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Made in ca
Blood Angel Chapter Master with Wings






Sunny SoCal

Locking again until something new.

   
Made in gb
Angered Reaver Arena Champion




Connah's Quay, North Wales

Hey, just wanted to post a resolution and thank you for everyone who stuck with me this far. Although the resolution isn't action packed or full of drama, its the resolution I would of liked the best.

The manager looked at the letter, never said anything to me other then thank you, and I have yet to see the staff member again. The manager handled it discreetly and I'm sure if I asked what he did with the info he would tell me, but I'd honestly not want to know. All I did was bring the concern to their eyes, I should have no say in there internal politics.

All I can do is hope the man is nicer to other people back in his own store in Liverpool and I can forget about it ever happening. No fuss, no gift cards, and hopefully no dismissals as I would feel horrible (He wasn't very social, but for I know his dog might of died or something).

Thanks for the support all the way through and the help in resolving the issue. As well as helping me see the other side of the story. Dakka may be full of trolls, but they are nice trolls, and they are our trolls

Alex

 
   
Made in us
Androgynous Daemon Prince of Slaanesh





Norwalk, Connecticut

Thanks for posting a resolution Alex. Hope you don't have to deal with poor customer service like that again. Congrats to being one of the most mature 14 year olds to grace this forum, if not the most, as your ability to put up with the older trolls attacking you has been exemplary. Well done, sir!

Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.

Manchu wrote:I'm a Catholic. We eat our God.


Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.  
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

Nice post and great resolution. Cheers
   
Made in us
Sslimey Sslyth




I will post this for probably the fourth time in this thread:

Alex has been far, far more professional and mature in his posts in this thread than have many of his detractors (you know who you are). Those self-same detractors could take a lesson from Alex's forum presence on Dakka-Dakka and modify their posting habits accordingly.

The rest of us would appreciate it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/09/09 18:03:02


 
   
Made in us
Androgynous Daemon Prince of Slaanesh





Norwalk, Connecticut

Have an exalt, Saldiven! Truer words never spoken.

Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.

Manchu wrote:I'm a Catholic. We eat our God.


Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.  
   
 
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