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I'm here because, well... I need help. After years (neigh, almost two decades!) of Marine play I've bought my first xenos army. Deciding to fully embrace the lack of power armor and default T4, I've gone with the Dark Elder. Now I need to see if my first list is even slightly worthwhile.

HQ
Duke Sliscus (warlord)
3x Haemonculus (3x Hexrifles)

Elite
4x Incubi (w/ Demi klaive Klaivex) -- Venom w/ Spinter Cannon (Nightshield, flicker field)
5x Trueborne (2 blasters, 2 splinter cannon -- Venom w/ Splinter Cannon (Nightshield, flicker field)

Troops
8x Kabalite Warrior -- Raider (Nightshield, flickerfield, splinter racks)
9x Kabalite Warrior -- Raider (Nightshield, flickerfield, splinter racks)
9x Wyches w/ Haywire grenades-- Raider (Flickerfield, Aethersail)
20x Kabalite Warrior w/ Splinter cannon

Heavy Support
Ravager -- 3x Dark Lance (Nightshield)
Ravager -- 3x Dark Lance (Nightshield)
Ravager -- 3x Disintegrator Cannons

Comes out to 1745 on the nose. The incubi might be getting a little too expensive, or maybe it's better to drop the Wyches to 5 and use them in a venom to take out a vehicle.

Thoughts? Thanks in advance.

Hmm well its not bad but there are a few things.

I would never take all 3 haemon. Too many points for a guy to give FNP.

I would always take 1 in wtches as they need it to get to combat. wytches unfortuatnely are not very good as t3 s3 is bad.

I would add night shields to all the vehicles.

I would make your true born all with blasters or not with any. They should not be mixed as that makes the other weapons uselss each turn. 2 splinter on 3 mans in venoms or 4 blasters is the way to go.

DE units need to be decicated to 1 task. FORGET ALL YOU LEARNED AS A MARINE! We dont excel at multi tasking...

I would add a flyer if possible. You have no anti air. The missiles are great anti infantry/light tank and 2 dark lances are good at killing enemy flyers. Also the flyer can get flicker fieilds which is great.

I dont think the incubi are over costed. They are very good but be careful of getting locked with units you dont wipe right away as onely a few guys can get bogged or killed by power weapons you didnt kill.

Hope this helps a bit. I play my DE often so I have tryed a bunch of lists. You just need to play till you get a style you like.

20 kabalites on foot is too many points for basically guardmen toughness and saves. I would only take units in transpots.

Personally I run 5 mans with a blaster in venoms with night shields.

Make the raider units full 10 mans so you can fully benefit from the racks. Take the cannon too. I know it doesnt work with racks but is extra dakka!

i agree with the OP about what you should do some anti air is the only thing i see this list lacking. but if you don't see to many flyers in your meta than you should be fine

Thanks for the advice. Meta in the area tends to skew away from flyers, which is why I didn't add any AA.

Great advise on the trueborne weapons and haemonculi. How do you recommend using haemis? Just one with the HQ, or drop them all together?

This was why the warriors in the raiders didn't number 10. I saved room for the haemonculus.

1 would be okay but 3 can be a bit expensive also try switching one rav. out for a talos pain engine if you like those there hell for the opponent if you get it to him

I normally just take 1 as my only hq. I look at it this way. 65 points (venom blade and liquifier) leaves me so many more points for units that actually do damage. Duke is good but I would rather spend points on more scoring/damaging units.

The thing I'm having trouble with as I list build for DE is getting around the 4 troop limit in the force org. Raiders can hold 10, venoms 5... but I also don't want to footslog weak troops.

Is there something to the army I'm missing? 4 groups of 10 in transports seems to be a low model count vs. cost, but seems to be the only way to keep them (somewhat) protected

A couple things stand out to me with this list.

Firstly, the hexrifles, while awesome in fluff and concept, are not terribly effective. I find the liquifier gun very effective and useful. 50% of the time it will ignore power armor and 33% it will force TEQs to take their invulnerable, so that's pretty sweet, especially with a template and at that points cost, it's a steal.

Secondly, I'm not conviced that taking 3 Haemies is so out of place here, I'd just challenge you to use their pain tokens more intentionally. I only run 2, but if you really want the pain token, take it. FNP is a really sweet power, but it's value is a bit lost on a mech'd out squad, who are paper thin in most contexts. I'd put one of them with the wyches, one with the Incubi and one with the trueborn, who you want to protect for their weaponry.

I actually really like the 20 man kabbie squad, but I'd run them with darklances instead, just due to the fact that you are not hurting for splinter fire on this list but you are coming in with pretty few darklance shots. A good rule of thumb is to have 1 darklight shot (blaster or darklance) per 100 points in the army.

With that last point, unless you are expecting droves of TEQs and high toughness, strong saves, dont take the disintigrators. They're wonderfully powerful, but only for one purpose.

Just my two cents, take it or leave it.

You can take 6 troops man. 4 is optional. 2 mandatory. Same as othe races.

I like the following types.

5 warriors with blaster in venom
10 with cannon in splinter raider
5 wytches haywire venom (easy kill point)
Wracks 5 or 10. You choose transport (unlocked by haemon as hq)
These are the best choices. Foot de is rough.

 Icelord wrote:
You can take 6 troops man. 4 is optional. 2 mandatory. Same as othe races.

I have absolutely no clue how I derped on this so badly. I suppose playing Marines I'm never used to having enough points for 6 troops.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Thanks for the advise jberry, definitely plan to implement some of those. Meta tends to be a lot of MEQ, with a good amount of TEQ -- that said, liquifers feel more fun... which is what I'm looking for.

Yeah, Wracks are really great. Super cheap, pretty solid shock troops, that come standard with a pain token. I'd take 1 squad of five at least.

Any point putting liquifiers on wracks, or is it best to keep them uber cheap and throw them at something to earn their points back, and little more?

Definitely go with the liquifier gun. Like I said before, I think they're really stellar. This lets you take the wracks in more strategic and targeted places when you notice your enemy lining up a 2 by 10 quad of fire warriors/plague marines, or blobbing their orks or hormagaunts. Usually you can swing around sideways and get 6 or 7 hits under the template before you charge. In fact, I often leave the Haemies in the boat after the wyches, incubi or whoever disembarks just to have them fly around flaming from the tip of the boat, while the venom (or raider) dakkas away on other targets. Plus, its literally a no brainer at that cost.

a beast squad is also very very fun to use and can be very deadly. if you get the chance try taking a max squad and throw vect in it and watch what happens i have had some success with it

The main thing with DE is play style.

Haemis are great to pass off a first token to warriors, but after that they should pretty much go hide. You'd be much better off with 10 man warrior groups who started the game out of the transport but in coherency with a haemi. Once the game starts move the warriors into the transports---taking the token with them.

For the trueborn: equip them all with the same gun. Otherwise you have a unit whose potential is simply wasted. They are great vehicle hunters. Use that.


I know some people really like disintegrators on ravagers. I don't To me ravagers are there to hit big stuff and the lance rule helps out tremendously. Infantry are better handled by the warriors.

I do agree about taking a cronos/talos instead of one of the ravagers. They absorb a tremendous amount of punishment before falling. I've had several games where my opponents spent multiplies shooting phase from their entire army trying to drop it. The thing is that it is unlikely to get close enough to actually hurting anything while scaring our opponent into making bad mistakes.

I notice you don't have any jetbikes. Those come in handy for scouring and line breaker. You might consider fitting a group in.

Regarding wyches: not my favorite. It may be that I just haven't figured out how to use them in 6th, but I've rarely see. Them recoup their points. Yes, haywire grenades kill vehicles. However they are almost always shot off the table immediately afterwards. At most I'd consider 5 in a venom with orders to hit the biggest thing they can. Pretty cheap for that.

I also like wracks. A small group with a haemi is good for backfield objectives.

Regarding beasts: haven't played them...yet. I have a group ready for assembly and will be using them in a couple weeks. Everyone says good things about them.