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Sisters of Twilight list

Soon I will be playing a 2k point match against a friends Skaven. I haven't played him yet but every game he has played was a win and now he is coming for me because I am the longest playing fantasy person in the store. Now I knew it wood be an up hill fight from the start, but what troubles me are his pair of doomwheels. So I needed to find a way to counter it as wood elves have very few answers apart from pin cushioning it and magiking it. But looking through the book I found the Sisters of Twilight and thought I'd give them a try because Naestra bow would cause a doomwheel to take a strength test on lowest strength or not move, they're lowest strength is strength 2 . While Arahan has ripe targets for her template bow in the masses of Skaven. So anyway, on with the list.

Sisters of Twilight on Gwindalor 325pts.

Heroes

Spellsinger level 2 with 1 dispel scroll and a cluster of radiance 175pts

Noble BsB with Razor standard with Asyendil's Bane + HODA 185pts

Alter Noble with Potion of strength and Wildfire Blades 140pts

Core

15 Glade guard with musician 186pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

Elites

3 Treekin 195pts

Rare

Treeman 285pts

5 waywatchers with sentinel 128pts

1997pts

Contemplating swapping out Waywatchers for eagles, but I want to see how they do there job of sniping weapon teams. I know I am lacking strong magic defence, but that's what happens when you don't have a lord level mage. But I have a lot of arrows, which the BSB will stand in the middle of the big unit to grant it armour piercing. Alter Noble is there to kill a doomwheel if it gets close. Treeman goes, when doomwheels are dealt with, to go tie up a really big Skaven horde while treekin go in from side, hopefully. He has no cannons, whats your thinking?

I'm not sure if the arrow of strenght test would work
it says that the unit has to take a strenght test (using the lwoest if there are several values within the unit). When a model with multiple profiles is called upon to make a test, you use the highest stat available on its profiles
Meaning if you had a Doomwheel (S6) embedded within a unit of clanrats (S3), you'd indeed test on S3 as it is the "lowest S within the unit", but the Doomwheel has an effective S6 against all things requiring Str checks

And yes I know, you cannot embed a Doomwheel within another unit, it was for the demonstration

As for your Noble killing a Doomwheel, it's a risky proposal. If he charges you, you're dead
If you charge it, you will damage it and then very probably die (2 S6 hits with grinding wounding on 2s then 7 rats attacks hitting on 4s and wounding on 5s)

I've looked at the rule book and I see no reason why the Arrow wouldn't work. The chariot page says treat Chariots as a single model with multiple profiles. Naestra's bow says take a strength test with the lowest available. It says the wounds, Toughness and armour save of the crew is never used, nothing about the strength. So on a single model with multiple strength profiles (That's what a chariot is) forced to take a strength test on the lowest, why wouldn't we use the lowest? I can't think of anything thing else this would work on effectively apart form maybe Stegadons with skink crew or an Araknorok with Gobbo crew.

As for the noble, he would be intending to hit already wounded doomwheels and kill them in one, but it is risky I grants you. I could drop Wildfire blades for normal 2 hand weapons and take stone of crystal meer for a 3+ Ward save or stone of rebirth for a 2+ before I die. But that would mean i'd have to drop the HODA's to fit into 500pts. Maybe the potion of strength isn't that way to go at all, maybe I should simply go for a GW and one of the Ward saves maybe?

The reason why the arrow would not work is because it tells you to take the lowest strenght in case there are several different strenght values in the unit
The doomwheel is a unit of 1 model
That model has different strenghts values but the unit as a whole has only 1 value, which is S6, so the unit of 1 doomwheel would test at S6
it would work the same way with any chariots or monsters ridden with a crew that you can't target specifically (Stegadon / Sphinx with no character for instance)

By all means, that could be how its intended, but this is another way it can be put to use. Look at the Skaven army book, under the doomwheel entry it says unit size, 1 doomwheel and crew. So that means the crew are part of the unit. It states use the lowest strength if there is more then 1 in the unit. The Crew have the lowest strength. So you use the Crews, should I start up a YMDC thread?

Your list is illegal atm. You can't take multiple scrolls and you can't have a BSB with magic banner and magic equipment.

Oh, your true with the 2 scrolls but wood elf BSB's can buy magical equipment, quite the opposite infact, that they cannot buy non-magical equipment. For the scroll problem I guess I have to lose 1 scroll and gain a cluster of radiance that'll have to do.

A crew is not a character riding a monster, it's a single entity
If you Dwellers a Stegadon, you roll under the strenght of the model, which is S5 (or S6 for ancients ...) and kill the model or nothing, you can't leave the crew stranded
There's a difference between:
"different strenght values within a model"
and
"different strenght values within a unit"

A model is for all purposes (except when it is attacking) always considered to be (not only to use, but to be) the highest S, T and such available

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Oh, your true with the 2 scrolls but wood elf BSB's can buy magical equipment, quite the opposite infact, that they cannot buy non-magical equipment. For the scroll problem I guess I have to lose 1 scroll and gain a cluster of radiance that'll have to do.

You have given your BSB a magic banner and some magic items, he can have either one or the other, but not both.
Its the third paragraph under the Army BSB section in the heroes section of the army lists

The Battle Standard Bearer can have any magic banner (no points limit), but if he carries a magic banner he cannot carry other magic items

Oh, my fault, got magic and enchanted items mixed up, silly me :S

What do you think I should do with the 40pts that would give me? I could drop the shadow sentinel to give me 48pts + the 3 left over I could add an eagle to take me up to 1999pts. So it would be

Sisters of Twilight on Gwindalor 325pts.

Heroes

Spellsinger level 2 with 1 dispel scroll and a cluster of radiance 175pts

Noble BsB with Razor standard 145pts

Alter Noble with stone of crystal meer and GW 144pts

Core

14 Glade guard with musician 174pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

10 glade guard with musician 126pts

Elites

3 Treekin 195pts

Rare

Treeman 285pts

5 waywatchers with sentinel 128pts

1 Eagle 50pts

1999pts

Does that look better?

*Edit* Change round with Alter noble left me needing 4 points for GW, so I dropped a GG for that and the Sentinel back.

Drop the Razor standard off your BSB since it doesn't affect shooting attacks.
Drop alter off your other Noble and put him on the Eagle so he gains +1 M, T and W
Give another dude to the 15 man GG unit and give it the Banner of Eternal flame.
And that should probably do it.

Oh, I was just copying another Wood Elf player near me, I'm going to have to shout at him. He has killed so many knights with that! Well I know the Skaven player hasn't got a Helpit, he hates the things. So I was thinking of dropping the magical banners all together to get back my HODA's or indeed, put him on an eagle, But I'd have to balance my character precariously on the back of said eagle . Flaming attacks won't help over much as his chariots are immune to psychology and he has no beasts, only hordes and hordes of Skaven clan rats.

If the objective is to kill his doomwheels, then I would totally drop the razor standard and give the BSB back his hail of doom (and bow to fire it (I still can't believe GW hasn't errata'd that, given that they did it for ogres and IIRC brets immediately)). I would also suggest swapping the alter over to an eagle noble, with whatever gear you need to survive the D3 S6 grind attaks that happen before swinging, and then be able to plop 1-2 wounds on the wheel. Doomwheels are not good if you get the charge on them, and poor LD means you can usually break them pretty easily. Trick is catching and hurting them, but between an eagle noble and maybe the sisters (and shooting and usual skaven unreliability) you should have it down.

Now if the objective is stomping clanrats into paste, I'd suggest dropping the treeman and turning him into 3 more treekin, bringing that unit to 6. Treeman are pretty easy to drop for skaven - I do it with doomwheels and crack's call, others use WLC and brass orbs, etc. Multiple treekin however take longer to remove, and once in combat pump out pretty similar damage to the treeman, but are also just about as hard to kill, S3 being what it is vs both T5 and T6. This should free up some points for getting that eagle.

Personally, I'd also like to see some banners in the list, at the least on the larger archer unit. I don't play a lot of B&G but rolling Fortitude 4 @ 2000 points just flat out feels a little more solid

I poked a list up if you're interested. Not mind-blowing, just doing the stuff I said above ...
- Salvage