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I see on GWs website it's still being sold at full price as though it wasn't about to become obsolete.

Supposedly the new codex is coming out September 7 which is only a couple of weeks away.

If someone bought this would they end up losing their money or would GW maybe advise them that a new one was coming out ?

They'd lose their money.

This is the big reason GW doesn't like announcing things too early.

If GW let people know long beforehand that a codex or a model kit would be getting an update, then people wouldn't buy it. As it stands, keeping people in the metaphorical dark allows them to sell the last remaining inventory they have.

If it's that big of a problem that you bought an obsolete product, you can return it if it's unopened. Otherwise, tough luck; buy more GW!

It will probably disappear as soon as the teaser or preorders go up.

This behaviour was exactly what soured me towards WFB. In the last few weeks of 5th edition I got into WFB and bought the core set, the magic expansion, the vampire counts army book and around 100 miniatures. Then 6th came out. Pissed me off and started the beginning of the end of me being GW's customer.

That was 13 years ago and I still remember and tell people about it.

Selling someone a 5th ed Space Marine codex while you know a new one is on the way is a dick move that people will remember for a very, very long time.

My local GW sold a new starter a 5th edition 40k rulebook 2 days before they launched the 6th edition, and then refused to let them refund it.

For the independant stockists, it becomes unorderable about 4-8 weeks before the replacement is due out.

For every story there is about GW's awesome customer service, there's one (or more) about GW being unbelievable dicks. "Sorry you bought that product two days before it became obsolete, which we knew about and just refused to tell you because we figured we could force you to spend more money with us on a new one. No you can't get your money back, no we won't even discount the new book for you. Sucks to be you I guess."

But hey, who cares? Nothing bad could possibly come from being a colossal, unscrupulous dick to your tiny customer base, especially when you have no advertising and rely almost entirely on word of mouth from satisfied customers to stay in business.

 Jinxy wrote:
My local GW sold a new starter a 5th edition 40k rulebook 2 days before they launched the 6th edition, and then refused to let them refund it.

And nobody in the store bothered to tell them that 6th was going to be released in a couple days? Seriously, the store sucks but you really should say something when that kind of thing happens.

Many times people witness the attempt to return the product rather than the actual sale.

I imagine that kind of thing wouldn't make you very popular with the staff. Considering how desperate they are to make sales (thanks to GW being ignorant in how it trains its staff) I wouldn't be surprised if you got banned from the store for such a move.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Jinxy wrote:
My local GW sold a new starter a 5th edition 40k rulebook 2 days before they launched the 6th edition, and then refused to let them refund it.

And nobody in the store bothered to tell them that 6th was going to be released in a couple days? Seriously, the store sucks but you really should say something when that kind of thing happens.

#

Unfortunately i was there when the person was trying to swap them, not during initial purchase, otherwise i would have stepped in. Havnt been in that store alot since then anyway (helps when you know someone that starts up a small stockist).

With something like 40k, it is really best to do your homework before jumping into the hobby.

Just recently I've been looking into getting a 1/60 gundam model (always was a fun when I was younger and saw tonnes of awesome kits as Fan Expo Toronto this weekend). After reading a few reviews I quickly learned that the newest kit actually isn't the one for me.

Making table top gaming purchases is similar. Read reviews, check out release rumours, and ask questions in forums. It's amazing how the answers to a few questions could save you a lot of hassle and regret.

Not to mention that the Black Templar codex is also about to bexme obsolete, but I still saw that at my FLGW last time I was there.

It's a dick move for sure to do that, knowing it will be

obsolete in a month or so, but then again so is putting 40K

discount retailers out of business almost overnight.

Suddenly they had a change of heart, so f*** the little guy

seems to be the end result of most of their decisions these

days. I think for most of us, if we didn't love this damn game

so much, we would have told them, and their prices to "suck

it" years ago, as it stands, I just bought an enormous Eldar

army, so, looks like I'll just keep ponying up, and accepting

their dick moves/Ferarri pricing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 gossipmeng wrote:
With something like 40k, it is really best to do your homework before jumping into the hobby.

Just recently I've been looking into getting a 1/60 gundam model (always was a fun when I was younger and saw tonnes of awesome kits as Fan Expo Toronto this weekend). After reading a few reviews I quickly learned that the newest kit actually isn't the one for me.

Making table top gaming purchases is similar. Read reviews, check out release rumours, and ask questions in forums. It's amazing how the answers to a few questions could save you a lot of hassle and regret.

Excellent advice, but lets say "Jim" heard about the hobby, likes some space marine models, after playing the PC game, and buys the codex to test out some rules/ check out game mechanics. He's in a situation I like to call

"you don't know how much you don't know" meaning, he doesn't even know Dakka exists, some people don't even think to look in places like this, or use existing avenues, because they have always figured things out on their own, or it simply never occurred

to them to do so. Those are the people I think suffer from GW selling outdated stuff. I think as soon as they start printing a new dex, they should place the old one in an "archived" codex section of their store, and sell it for cheap, so the collectors can buy up the remaining stock.

(which they will, everyone has "that" friend who has all the codex's.)

It doesn't really matter because no matter when they announce the new codex or take the old one off the shelves, there is always someone who JUST bought the old one.

Moving the announcement up a week just means that the people who bought it last week get screwed instead of the people who bought it this week.

My local store still had the old Tau codex on their shelf when we all knew there was a new codex coming out. The manager said he couldn't return the old books to GW, so he had to try and sell them. The employees were cool enough, though, to deter new players from picking it up. There is no better way to lose a potential customer than having them buy a book to use their army only to say it's illegal a month later.

It's not exactly a best practice on GW's part but I do agree that due to how expensive and time consuming the hobby is.. players need to take some responsibility and do a bit of research on their own.

Granted, it sucks for very new players but you also may want to stop and think before you throw 500$ at a time game.

Some people still play old editions of 40K, because they prefer that ruleset over later editions. There's still a demand for the older books.

The codex has been around for what, 6 years? I think they've made their profit on it. It would be good PR to reduce the price to say the cost of printing it in the weeks leading up to the new release.

Given how expensive the new one is likely to be, it wouldn't hurt to whet the appetite of new players with a dirt cheap older codex.
They're not going to sell enough older codices before the change to offset the ill will they'd create by selling codecis that are about to be put to bed.

 Kirasu wrote:
It's not exactly a best practice on GW's part but I do agree that due to how expensive and time consuming the hobby is.. players need to take some responsibility and do a bit of research on their own.

I agree with this pretty much. I wouldn't put down the monetary investment necessary to start a 40k army without doing some research.

Agreed. The starter set, I could understand being a mistake - heck, they used to sell the thing in Argos along with board games and the like so you could be easily fooled into thinking it was a one-time purchase like Space Hulk or Heroquest (and hey, if you didn't want any more then it could be anyway!).

However, if you're looking at buying a Codex then you likely already have the starter set or rulebook, and are looking at getting more models too (and probably glue, paints, brushes etc.). That's a significant investment - even if not on the spot, just from seeing the prices of what's in store you already know you're looking at spending £100 or more. That's enough for a bike, or a fridge. It's a "big thing", it's not really passing spending money.

If anyone is either:
1) happy to part with that much money without looking into it first;
2) trusting the word of the staff who are trying to sell you the goods; or
3) being talked into buying a Codex before they even have the starter set or rulebook

...then they are a fool who deserves to be parted with their money.

this is funny. you expect little timmy to do his research?

more or less the same thing happened to me that happened to frozen waste. when I got into it as a kid I didn't even know they flip the rules all the time until one day I walk into the store and all of a sudden the staff are telling me to buy all new books.

that pushed me out of the hobby for around 10 years give or take. even as a dumb kid I knew I wasn't willing to buy all my crap over again.

It does at least look like the iPad version has been removed from the iBookstore...unless I just missed it while scrolling through.

kb305 wrote:
this is funny. you expect little timmy to do his research?

I expect his parents - the ones actually providing the money - to check it out. After all, they'll bear the brunt of little Timmy's tantrums if it turns out the money's wasted.

 Super Ready wrote:

kb305 wrote:
this is funny. you expect little timmy to do his research?

I expect his parents - the ones actually providing the money - to check it out. After all, they'll bear the brunt of little Timmy's tantrums if it turns out the money's wasted.

I don't expect uninterested parents to research Timmy's new love at all. If they don't know that the rules get updated then they don't know to ask the right questions and so are at the tender mercies of the shop staff. If you're going to buy a "premium" product from a branded store then you expect to get steered in the right direction by well trained happy chappies, not taken for a ride by unscrupulous hawkers out to make a quick profit.

Speaking of which, what happens to old stocks of codecis and rule books, in non-GW stores, when they become obsolete? Do the stores get a 'sucks to be you' response for being lumbered with unsaleable stock or does GW take it back?

Alright, I'll be a bit more specific... I would expect Timmy's parents to do at least a modicum of research on something they're going to drop a buttload of cash on. If Timmy keeps asking for more money for the hobby, then more and more and more, it should be ringing alarm bells in the parents' heads at which point they should really find out more before the cost gets too high. It's not unreasonable to expect the same level of background research that you'd put into, say, buying a console to make sure you get the right one. I'll admit that by that point an obsolete Codex is possible, mind.
If Timmy's parents have spent anything over £100 without knowing more about what they're buying first, then they're either lacking in common sense, intelligence, or just plain spoiling the brat.

cadbren wrote:
Speaking of which, what happens to old stocks of codecis and rule books, in non-GW stores, when they become obsolete? Do the stores get a 'sucks to be you' response for being lumbered with unsaleable stock or does GW take it back?

I don't think so. I've seen two shops to date with obsolete Codexes on sale (discounted of course) over the last 10 years.

 Sidstyler wrote:
I imagine that kind of thing wouldn't make you very popular with the staff. Considering how desperate they are to make sales (thanks to GW being ignorant in how it trains its staff) I wouldn't be surprised if you got banned from the store for such a move.

No one says you have to wave a big sign in the air and jump up and down about it. When the sales geek moves off to another victim quietly tell the buyer to wait a week and come back to get the *new* version. QED.

If they ban you from the store you will have gained a friend *and* gained more cash staying in your pocket.

Skriker

I think it would be unreasonable to expect GW to remove the current Codex from the shelves until the new one is released. Other stores and brands don't either and it would't make sense to either.

I do however hope that staff would not be trying to steer customers to purchase the current, soon to expire, Codex knowing the new one is on the horizon. And I'd also hope they would sensibly tell customers that a new version may be due out soon if somebody did go to buy it.

If passing a GW store I might even try acting dumb and see what they advise if I show interest in starting a SM army.

 Super Ready wrote:

I expect his parents - the ones actually providing the money - to check it out. After all, they'll bear the brunt of little Timmy's tantrums if it turns out the money's wasted.

What planet are you from? My parents never once investigated any of the things I did as hobbies. They gave me an allowance and if I blew it on minis, or RPG books or whatever they weren't concerned. If I went to them and said "I need $500 today to buy an army to play this game I want to play" they would have laughed at me, they wouldn't have looked into it to make sure it was a good investment or that a new ruleset wasn't going to invalidate my purchase 2 months later. Parents that will willingly give their kids $500 to buy an army of toy soldiers to play a wargame all at once are also not very likely to be looking beyond anything but buying little Timmy's happiness instead of beingt he adult either...

Skriker



Automatically Appended Next Post:

LuckyCraig wrote:
I think it would be unreasonable to expect GW to remove the current Codex from the shelves until the new one is released. Other stores and brands don't either and it would't make sense to either.

I do however hope that staff would not be trying to steer customers to purchase the current, soon to expire, Codex knowing the new one is on the horizon. And I'd also hope they would sensibly tell customers that a new version may be due out soon if somebody did go to buy it.

If passing a GW store I might even try acting dumb and see what they advise if I show interest in starting a SM army.

Well it really depends on the product doesn't it? Selling last year's model of Kuerig coffee machine up until the day they release the new model has zero impact on those who buy the old model, except maybe the new model has an exciting new feature. The old one *still* makes coffee and is still 100% usable for the reason it was purchased. Same with buying last year's model of car. Sure some features may change, but the car you bought right before the new models came out is still a car and still does all the things a car does and doesn't become useless to you after the new models come out. I can even read an older print run of the Lord of the Rings just fine despite them bringing out a fancy new edition with pretty images from the movies on the covers in recent years.

Meanwihle a space marine codex, when it is replaced is only usuable with other gamers who aren't going to upgrade to the new book and want to continue to play with the old book, but is useless if the player wants to play in pick up games at the local GW store or play in official events or tournies or most local stores that stay on top of the update curve which is most of them. Definitely a bit of a difference. Sure you can still use it as a fluff and modeling guide, but its primary use: as an army rulebook is now invalid in most instances.

It is one thing to make it still available. I have no problems with that. I do have problems with the fact that they will not mention the new version coming out in a week to someone. If that person then says, "Oh I am joing an established group that plans to stick with the older versoin" then everyone is happy. If they person wants the latest, greatest he will be happy to not waste his money today and will come back to buy the new book instead. The store then gets a customer likely to keep returning...but it often doesn't play out that way...:\

Skriker

 Skriker wrote:
What planet are you from? My parents never once investigated any of the things I did as hobbies. They gave me an allowance and if I blew it on minis, or RPG books or whatever they weren't concerned. If I went to them and said "I need $500 today to buy an army to play this game I want to play" they would have laughed at me, they wouldn't have looked into it to make sure it was a good investment or that a new ruleset wasn't going to invalidate my purchase 2 months later.

I'll give you that - under ordinary circumstances mine would have laughed at me for that too, and the allowance is not so much that I could have gone and bought a Codex *just like that* anyway. So in the meantime there was plenty of chance to find out what was what. What's NOT so unusual is asking for something big for Xmas or for a birthday. To give an example, once upon a time I did ask my parents for Guitar Hero - which was twice the price of any other game at the time because of the guitar. So, naturally, they were a bit concerned and asked me why it was more...