Devastator loadouts, and what to do with spare heavy weapons.

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**stargasm**

Hello Dakka!

I'm sorting through some of my marines to get them back up to scratch for the new dex. I'm just curious as to how i can optimise my devastator squad. I have 2 plasma cannons, 2 lascannons and 2 missile lunchers. I also have a heavhy bolter, but that's tied up in a tactical squad, although it could be swapped out.

I know the new dex is coming, but we know what all the weapons do, and that ML will be cheapish, plasma slightly more, and Las most expensive. however i'm sure ML will get optional pricey flakk missiles.

I'm currently leaning towards 2x ML and 2x Las, making it a dedicated tank busting unit with the option of flakk for AA. is this a good choice?

Also, what should i do with the plasma cannons? would one fit well into a tactical squad? i find them quite restricting as they can't snap fire, so the whole squad looses flexibilty of movement. I go for the HB in the tact because it is cheap, and probably won't fire much if i'm stuck in a rhino for too long.

Any advice greaty appreciated!

Thanks!

**Martel732**

I'd avoid MLs. They aren't that effective in 6th.

**stargasm**

Martel732 wrote:
I'd avoid MLs. They aren't that effective in 6th.

Avoid completley, or avoid in devastator sqauds? Would a Las/ Plas dev squad be any good? sounds too pricey and has no definite purpose. with 2 ML and 2 Lascannons i can pop pretty much any vehicle in one round of shooting (if the las cannons don't destroy it outright, the MLs help take the hull points down with glancing hits)

What would you recommend?

**Kain**

Some have found success with a dev squad manning a quad gun while also having flakk missiles for all the missile launchers. It can put a neat hole in any flier out there short of the Caestus assault ram, but sadly the Devs lack interceptor to make this truly formadible, you can still put presience on them so that any flier on the board can suck on eight BS4 twinlinked S7 shots though.

**Nevelon**

I prefer my dev squads for hunting troops, not tanks. I've had reasonable success with 2xML and then either 2xHB or 2xPC depending on points. Full 10 man squad.

I'm waiting till I have the new book in hand to think about what the point changes and chapter tactics are going to do. With the lowered points, I suspect that PCs and LCs are going to be a bit more viable. I might also drop down to a 5 man squad as well. I felt compelled to have the bullet sponges there to protect the expensive heavies.

Not sure how I feel about the flack missiles. My knee jerk thought is either go big with 4xML, or don't bother. I'm not a big fan of having most of the squad sitting around while one or two guys do the work.

It's never a bad idea to have the heavy weapon troopers built and on the shelf. They can be swapped in and out of squads as the needs of the list dictate.

**Martel732**

My BA don't use any MLs that aren't on typhoon speeders. Shooting front armor with ST 8 AV 3 sucks. Speeders can get side shots much easier.

**Admiral General Aladeen**

I use blood angel dev squads because thats the army I play.

a few things to consider.

Never mix and match rolls, you just reduce efficiency, if you want some for tanks and some for infantry take 2 squads.

I take 4 las cannons, and 4 plasma cannons when I run devs, it has nice synergy and overall you get good utility. blow up a tank, melt the squad inside or choose 2 targets etc.

**stargasm**

Thanks for the advice so far guys! I barely play any fliers, and absolutley no FW units, so a full flakk squad on a quad gun wouldn't be much use.

For now i'll just paint up all the guys, but i'm still leaning towards the ML/ LC build until i can get more las cannons or plasma guns.

I only have a small force so far with no dedicated tank busters, so these guys can fill that role until a get some tanks with big guns.

**Kain**

stargasm wrote:
Thanks for the advice so far guys! I barely play any fliers, and absolutley no FW units, so a full flakk squad on a quad gun wouldn't be much use.

For now i'll just paint up all the guys, but i'm still leaning towards the ML/ LC build until i can get more las cannons or plasma guns.

I only have a small force so far with no dedicated tank busters, so these guys can fill that role until a get some tanks with big guns.

Also, how heavy on high save units is your meta? It seems that the Graviton cannon is going to make TEQ and MEQ heavy armies break out in hives.

As for a good tankbuster once you've expanded, given the price decrease that Trilas predators have had in other codices lately, I'd recommend some. Of course Dark Angel Dev lascannons also got cheaper so you could spam them in a meta without heldrakes if Vanilla lascannon devs follow the same pattern.

**MWHistorian**

My original idea was to have my Devs as tank hunters, but when I saw the cost of las cannons, I had to scrap that idea. I went heavy bolters and missile launchers but never really use my dev squad anymore. Great for switching tac squad weapons though.

**stargasm**

Kain wrote:
stargasm wrote:
Thanks for the advice so far guys! I barely play any fliers, and absolutley no FW units, so a full flakk squad on a quad gun wouldn't be much use.

For now i'll just paint up all the guys, but i'm still leaning towards the ML/ LC build until i can get more las cannons or plasma guns.

I only have a small force so far with no dedicated tank busters, so these guys can fill that role until a get some tanks with big guns.

Also, how heavy on high save units is your meta? It seems that the Graviton cannon is going to make TEQ and MEQ heavy armies break out in hives.

As for a good tankbuster once you've expanded, given the price decrease that Trilas predators have had in other codices lately, I'd recommend some. Of course Dark Angel Dev lascannons also got cheaper so you could spam them in a meta without heldrakes if Vanilla lascannon devs follow the same pattern.

My flgs would actually be Warhammer World, so if i get adventurous and challenge new people i can come up against litterally anything, but i generally play among friends. They have plenty of high save stuff playing C:SM and CSM for the most part. We all got back into the hobby about a year ago, but since we're also doing degree courses we're still massive n00bs.

**GarretAsh**

If you must use devastators i find the 4 ML a good combo , good for anti horde with 4 small blasts , and Ok for Anti Armour (they can glance AV14 on a 6) and viable for Insta killing t4 units , Plasma cannons are also great weapons but i tend to use them more in my tactical squads.

**Martel732**

4 ML can't kill most armor quickly enough to be effectively called anti-armor. They awesome for overkilling meqs, but really suck at their advertised job.

**generalchaos34**

I find alot of luck running plasma cannons against pretty much anything. You get a chance to kill light vehicles if you want to, but your are pretty much going to vaporize any infantry in the game, light or heavy. Plus I have a lot of the models after i scavenged several dark vengeance box sets =P. Now, i really want something like heavy bolters to be so cheap or even free, that you pretty much will want to run them, because that model is sweet and I want to relive my moments of asking extra angry Sgt. Avitus to suppress something. Which, btw, you guys ever feel like Devs with HBs should get to have the pinning role so that they could fulfill their codex role of fire suppression?

**Krellnus**

Based off what you say you have, your best bet imo, will be to fork out for another dev box to get 2 more lascannons (or try bits sites, if the price is right) the thing about 6th edition is that it favours specialisation of units run in redundancy, similar to the most common Guard and DE lists in 5th ed.

This means that mixed weapon dev squads are pretty bad overall, and spacing means that templates can easily only hit one or two models and the ML is outclassed at anti-tank by the lascannon. So I would run two squads (after buying another dev box) one with 4x Lascannons and one with 4x Heavy Bolters.

TL DR: Get another box and specialise your dev squads.

**Martel732**

Don't they sell individual devs anymore?

**Krellnus**

They might still have the individual metals available, but they don't scale well with the plastics due to age and at their price if you need more than one you may as well go the full mile and get the plastic kit.

**Kain**

stargasm wrote:
Kain wrote:
stargasm wrote:
Thanks for the advice so far guys! I barely play any fliers, and absolutley no FW units, so a full flakk squad on a quad gun wouldn't be much use.

For now i'll just paint up all the guys, but i'm still leaning towards the ML/ LC build until i can get more las cannons or plasma guns.

I only have a small force so far with no dedicated tank busters, so these guys can fill that role until a get some tanks with big guns.

Also, how heavy on high save units is your meta? It seems that the Graviton cannon is going to make TEQ and MEQ heavy armies break out in hives.

As for a good tankbuster once you've expanded, given the price decrease that Trilas predators have had in other codices lately, I'd recommend some. Of course Dark Angel Dev lascannons also got cheaper so you could spam them in a meta without heldrakes if Vanilla lascannon devs follow the same pattern.

My flgs would actually be Warhammer World, so if i get adventurous and challenge new people i can come up against litterally anything, but i generally play among friends. They have plenty of high save stuff playing C:SM and CSM for the most part. We all got back into the hobby about a year ago, but since we're also doing degree courses we're still massive n00bs.

The graviton gun and it's variants is meant to be a screw you to MEQ, TEQs, and most monstrous creatures. It's AP2 and wounds based on your armor save. So termies are wounded on 2s and only get their invulnerable saves. And the thing is, all the variants get a lot of shots.

The cannon I think gets 3/5 Salvo. Which means they can wipe a Riptide off the map in no time and literally do not care if a TMC has iron arm or not.

This is counterbalanced by being staggeringly useless against low armor units like blobbed tyranids, guardsmen, and daemons. And also vehicles.

**Super Ready**

You can easily get the spare weapons from Ebay or bitz sites, though these will be without the Marines to come with them - if you're looking to do two units, by the time you work postage in it'd be better to just get the two boxes.

With the spare weapons left over, if you have spare Marine bits then just build them up and try switching out the heavy weapon in tactical squads from time to time (legs and torso backs are what you'll find is missing most often as there are usually spare pads, heads and the like).

Here's the advice I gave in another thread for Blood Angels, though I've dismissed heavy bolters based on what this guy already had, they're still worth it if you want an anti-infantry role for the squad:

Super Ready wrote:
I would suggest one of the following combinations:
1) 4x plasma cannons
2) 4x lascannons
3) 2x of each (you can make this setup with what's in the box).

Plasma cannons are best used against tough infantry like Terminators, but will do against larger mobs too (they're still more effective than missile launchers for this, they're just a bit too expensive for the role).
Lascannons as mentioned previously are classic anti-tank although in a pinch they can also be useful against tough infantry - it's only having a single shot each that makes them less useful there.
Both are perfectly capable of taking on light vehicles (AV10/11 with a couple of hull points).

Heavy bolters would be a decent, cheap option for taking on large mobs but you already have that covered in your other units. Again, you need to build more units capable of taking on heavier stuff.
In general - try not to overdo it on your units' upgrades. Giving them all options to be able to take on every conceivable type of unit they might come across gets expensive *quick*, especially for Blood Angels, and at times it's impossible too (Devastators are never going to win close combat against a dedicated assault unit, for instance, so it's rarely worth giving the Sergeant anything). Instead, have a role in mind for each of your units, and stick to it.

**GarretAsh**

Martel732 wrote:
4 ML can't kill most armor quickly enough to be effectively called anti-armor. They awesome for overkilling meqs, but really suck at their advertised job.

Yes that is the sad true , the best way for dealing with Armour are triple las predators , but IF one must go with devastators i like 4 HB but they are not that "take all comers" like the ML , there selling point is the versatility they offer , they can be good for hordes and like you said over-killing MEQs (they can also do TEQs, forcing that ++ save) , and of course a las cannon is better to kill Armour but its to focus , if you take 4 lascannos you are good at one thing but suck at the rest , the ML reminds me the Bard in D&D , Good at mostly everything but not great at everything.

**Crimson**

Imperial Fists Devastators are getting Tank Hunters in the new book, how will that affect usefulness of various heavy weapons? Would that make missiles more valuable, especially as you can get flak?

**minigun762**

Crimson wrote:
Imperial Fists Devastators are getting Tank Hunters in the new book, how will that affect usefulness of various heavy weapons? Would that make missiles more valuable, especially as you can get flak?

Its more reason to take Lascannons.
Lascannons really are the heavy weapon of choice these days with the influx of BIG MCs and more armored units.

**Crimson**

minigun762 wrote:
Crimson wrote:
Imperial Fists Devastators are getting Tank Hunters in the new book, how will that affect usefulness of various heavy weapons? Would that make missiles more valuable, especially as you can get flak?

Its more reason to take Lascannons.
Lascannons really are the heavy weapon of choice these days with the influx of BIG MCs and more armored units.

Yes, but Centurions can take lascannons too, and they can move and shoot with them. They probably can't get skyfire though.

**DaddyWarcrimes**

Why would you bother with something like Devastators for anti-air when you can take Stormtalons, who have turreted assault cannons and won't die instantly to the first Heldrake that looks their way?

**Crimson**

DaddyWarcrimes wrote:
Why would you bother with something like Devastators for anti-air when you can take Stormtalons, who have turreted assault cannons and won't die instantly to the first Heldrake that looks their way?

Devastators can man Aegis with Quad Gun/Icarus. And I've not found Stormtalon to be that amazing anti-air. In any case, I'm planning to have both. Besides, missiles are great TAC choice, they might not be outstanding, but they do something useful regardless of who you're fighting.

**Krellnus**

Crimson wrote:
Devastators can man Aegis with Quad Gun/Icarus. And I've not found Stormtalon to be that amazing anti-air. In any case, I'm planning to have both. Besides, missiles are great TAC choice, they might not be outstanding, but they do something useful regardless of who you're fighting.

Not really, when people spread out upon seeing that you have MLs,you will be better off firing kraks anyway since both rounds will only be able to get 1 hit at most anyway, in which case you may as well take lascannons which will hit even harder

**Martel732**

No, MLs are not a good TAC choice. Because they are not actually good against anything except overkilling T4 meq characters and a few niche critters.

**stargasm**

For now, I think i will go 2x ML 2x PC as i play a lot of TEQ and MEQ, and just about zero fliers.

I'll pack my tank bashing power into a predator since it sounds like the trilas will be a lot cheaper.

I take it a Lascannon on a tactical squad would be fairly pointless?

**Martel732**

Not if you combat squad the tactical squad. I would highly recommend against using any MLs that aren't Typhoons.

**Kangodo**

I really don't like ML's, not even when they are free.
But now that C:SM has to pay a gigantic amount of points for them I hate them even more.