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i use a csm army and have played a few games now to understand my army. i am starting to see some of the short comings and am wondering if allying with daemons fills most of the gaps.

csm only has 1 assault transport and its expensive. does chaos have transport (probibly not) or do they make up for it with more beast( or just 12" movement) options. how many choice have 12" movement and do most have fleet aswell?

csm are not bad at close combat but there not that good either. i assume most daemons are better at c.c.

csm can shoot pretty well and have good choices and builds but i find the elite units are kinda counter productive to there marks. i.e 1k sons seem built for heavy weapons but can't take anything, noise marines have a high intitive but are a shooting only troop,( dont even come with ccws) berzerkers arent bad but can get expensive when given the few options they can take. they dont even have 2 base attacks. and plague marines seem to be the most versitile of them all and they come with a special ccw. are there many daemon choices that can shoot anything or is that the pysker models only??

i guess im getting at would it be practical to run a csm army that is mostly shooty and have daemon allies for ccw?

p.s. do daemon have jump pack or flying model besides demon prince with wings?

Anything that is a Daemon of Slaanesh has fleet and move extra inches when they run. All their Elite and Fast Attack choices can move 12" on the move due to either being cavalry or beasts.

Two of the nameless Greater Daemons have wings as standard wargear and Flamers of Tzeentch are jump infantry (they're a shooting unit though and only really useful for frying Tau and Eldar infantry, not combat).

Do daemons tend to have higher WS and strength then standard models? Do any have armor saves. I know they have a 5+ invul. But any armor or feel no pain?

the GOAT 765 wrote:
Do daemons tend to have higher WS and strength then standard models? Do any have armor saves. I know they have a 5+ invul. But any armor or feel no pain?

On average no, but they have AP3 (Khorne) rending (Slaanesh) poison (Nurgle)

Nurgle can get Feel No Pain with a herald.

Some daemons have higher WS and S than other models. Take a flesh hound for example. It costs about as much as a marine, but it is WS5, W2, A2 a beast, and has furious charge and scout.

If you could get a first turn charge, flesh hounds would be doing it. A unit of 10 will get 30 WS5 S5 attacks on the charge. You can throw a herald of khorne on steed and buff the hounds so they can re-roll all misses in the first round of CC. On top of that, the herald can take an ap2 weapon and has a beastly statline. (also I6)

I think daemons work well because they can pretty much ignore most anti tank weaponry. A daemon always gets the +5 invul.
Plague drones are jet pack, but not jump pack.

The biggest problem with havign your CSM sit back and watch the CC while shooting, is once your daemons get into CC, you might not have much to shoot at.

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Plague drones are jet pack, but not jump pack.

Specifically, they're Jet Pack Cavalry. Meaning they get 12" movement as a cavalry unit with the option to fly over terrain without taking DT unless they land or begin movement in it. They also get fleet as a Cavalry unit which helps with the charge.

It really depends on your list and the points you're playing at.

A Bloodthirster and 20 Flesh Hounds is a good addition to most army lists. 10 Plaguebearers for a cheap backfield objective holders are good too.

Take a LOC for Divination goodness. You can do all sorts of crazy with re-rolling obliterators.