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Sure, most of the attention has been on Ben Affleck being cast as Batman in Zack Snyder's sequel to Man of Steel, but what about the rest of the Batman universe? Deadline reports that Fox has closed a deal for a television series centered around none other than the Dark Knight's ally Commissioner Gordon. Called Gotham, the show focuses on Gordon's early years as a detective on the Gotham City police force, and while it will include some of Gotham's most famous villains it will reportedly not feature Batman himself.

Bruno Heller, the creator of The Mentalist, will be producing the show in conjunction with Warner Bros. Television, and Fox's deal includes a series commitment — signaling just how bullish the network is on the project. The Gotham announcement comes on the same night that Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. makes its debut on ABC, and with a Flash show also in the works at the CW, one thing's for sure: Warner Bros. and DC aren't ceding television to Marvel without a fight.

This should be a smash, just like Birds of Prey TV series.

I actually like this idea. And no one who died in any movies needs to be brought back from the dead for it! maybe we'll get something gritty but not quite fantastical along the lines of Arrow.

Of all the comic book characters who should have gotten a series, this is probably in the, like, bottom 10.

while it will include some of Gotham's most famous villains it will reportedly not feature Batman himself.

Yeah, well, what kind of a draw is Batman, anyway? I mean, who could put asses in seats as well as Captain Stingaree?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
note: Captain Stingaree is #11 on the list of characters who should never get their own show.

"Gotham Central"(a comic series based upon the idea of "What is it like being a cop in Gotham City?") has done fairly well for itself--and "Arrow" has done fairly well.

Yeah, I see this as either doing REALLY well...or bombing so bad that Halle Berry's Catwoman looks like pure gold by comparison. I'm hoping for the former, as it has the potential to be great, it really does. I like Gordon. I think it's got a shot.

Honestly, I'm not sure anything can bomb as badly as Halle Berry's Catwoman... Once you're worse than Catwoman you've entered 'So Bad it's Good Territory.'

 Kanluwen wrote:
"Gotham Central"(a comic series based upon the idea of "What is it like being a cop in Gotham City?") has done fairly well for itself--and "Arrow" has done fairly well.

Gotham Central was always something that should have been made into a gritty crime series like the shield. I wish that was more the focus then on Gordon, but I won't argue if it's done well.

But goddamn, I really don't want it on or associated with the CW. Put it on TNT or show time and make it directed more at adults in a quasi-Nolan Gotham.

At first I thought they were doing an Agents of SHIELD thing, where it is set in the same universe as MoS and the coming sequel, that it would be a trojan horse to introduce us to the Gotham of that world, but alas, it seems not.

If it isn't going to have Batman in it at all, it should also avoid any of the top tier rogues gallery that require a Batman in the first place. I think it has potential if they stay away from to much of the comic book stuff and make it a life on the streets POV.

 LordofHats wrote:
Honestly, I'm not sure anything can bomb as badly as Halle Berry's Catwoman... Once you're worse than Catwoman you've entered 'So Bad it's Good Territory.'

Catwoman was so bad it went past good and back to bad again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ahtman wrote:
If it isn't going to have Batman in it at all, it should also avoid any of the top tier rogues gallery that require a Batman in the first place. I think it has potential if they stay away from to much of the comic book stuff and make it a life on the streets POV.

That one is tricky, I think. Because if you just focus on more streetlife stuff, then I'm not sure it's really going to be any different to any of the hundreds of police procedurals that are already on TV.

But on the other hand, if they have Gordon as a regular cop taking on and defeating major characters of Gotham's rogues gallery, then that makes Batman look a lot impressive. So I don't know, maybe mix more regular crime with the odd minor villain, and maybe introduce longer running arcs involving more important villains, who won't necessarily get taken down by the likes of Gordon..

In fact, that's kind of an interesting idea - introduce a heavy dose of despair in to the show - make it clear that despite their heroism and their odd wins along the way, that guys like Gordon just aren't going to fix what's wrong with Gotham. Leave a feeling that the city really needs Batman.

Where's my deadpool show.

 xole wrote:
Where's my deadpool show.

Deadpool keeps threatening the authors cause they're not paying to use his likeness

They should do a show based on the old Marvel mini series "The Cleanup Crew".
It told the story of the company that had the contract to clean and repair damage after super hero/villain battles.

That one is tricky, I think. Because if you just focus on more streetlife stuff, then I'm not sure it's really going to be any different to any of the hundreds of police procedurals that are already on TV.

I'm not saying they should use no villains from the Rogues Gallery, but avoid the top shelf (Two-Face, Joker, Bane, ect). They should be more things whispered about in dark corners, with the characters dealing with the effects these people have on the city more than the people themselves. We can run into Joker goons, but not the Joker, or have them dealing with an aftermath of a Joker spree.

It would be cool for the show to maybe show the origins of super villains like the Joker. Surely Harvey Dent could be a character that we'd get to see the dark side of from time to time. Maybe a young Catwoman, the Peguin, and Riddler before their times as masked villains, hiding in the shadows biding their time because Batman hasn't come to draw them into the world just yet. Show how maybe these individuals are as much a product of Gotham as anything. Most cop shows have the good guys win unambiguously by the end. Gotham is a crap sack world. No one ever really wins.

When the time for a series finale comes, Gordon can sit in his office, recently promoted to Commissioner, contemplating his time on the force and his inability to solve the ills around him. How every step forward is met with a step back. End scene with a lightning flash casting Batman's shadow through the closed window.

How can someone not want to see that at least for 1 season XD.

I read that Cracked article yesterday about how Jeb Bartlett wasn't originally supposed to be a main character in The West Wing. The more they thought about it, the more they realised that wouldn't work, and then when they wrote him in, well sure enough he ended up a major character. I think having a show that doesn't show the central figure would just get to be distracting after a while.

That doesn't mean they should just go West Wing and bring in Batman as a main character, it means they have to be smart about. Have one series with no Batman, just some regular street crime, and a few origin stories for some of the villains (thanks LordofHats). Even show Bruce Wayne as a rich guy playboy. Over the series show Gordon and the police struggle to defeat some major villain, only to be saved in the end by a masked vigilante who brutally attacks the police.

Second series and you can have a long running arc in which Gordon at first investigates this new vigilante, and over the course of the series, and possibly due to the threat of some other villain, Gordon accepts that Batman is needed to bring crime under control, and maybe end with a secret deal between the two to share information.

But don't ever make Batman the main character. Don't show his motivations, and don't give him much screentime at all. He is seen only through the viewpoint of Gordon, who is never at all sure if Batman is any more sane than the villains.

Not having him as the main character lets you play more with his anti-hero status. It actually gives you scope for a much more interesting Batman.

 Ahtman wrote:
I'm not saying they should use no villains from the Rogues Gallery, but avoid the top shelf (Two-Face, Joker, Bane, ect). They should be more things whispered about in dark corners, with the characters dealing with the effects these people have on the city more than the people themselves. We can run into Joker goons, but not the Joker, or have them dealing with an aftermath of a Joker spree.

Yeah, I said as much in the next sentence after the bit you quoted

And I think you could have the Joker and other major villains, but you just don't have Gordon and the police bring them down, and they sometimes can't even stop their plans. Let the heroes lose some episodes, to show how desperate things are, and that they need Batman.

 LordofHats wrote:
It would be cool for the show to maybe show the origins of super villains like the Joker. Surely Harvey Dent could be a character that we'd get to see the dark side of from time to time.

That's a great idea.

Seriously. Y'all need to investigate the Gotham Central series. It's pretty much exactly what you're describing here.

 sebster wrote:
I read that Cracked article yesterday about how Jeb Bartlett wasn't originally supposed to be a main character in The West Wing. The more they thought about it, the more they realised that wouldn't work, and then when they wrote him in, well sure enough he ended up a major character. I think having a show that doesn't show the central figure would just get to be distracting after a while.

Columbo has a similar origin as does Timmy of South Park (he was intended to die and never return in the pilot episode). Often times it works out well, because the character is just that awesome. In this case I think it would be a missed opportunity. We've all seen Batman on TV, many times. I enjoy it don't get me wrong, but I'm always happy to get behind a new twist on an old story. A pre-Batman Gotham crime drama is an awesome idea (and evidently tried before ;D)!

 LordofHats wrote:
Columbo has a similar origin as does Timmy of South Park (he was intended to die and never return in the pilot episode). Often times it works out well, because the character is just that awesome. In this case I think it would be a missed opportunity. We've all seen Batman on TV, many times. I enjoy it don't get me wrong, but I'm always happy to get behind a new twist on an old story. A pre-Batman Gotham crime drama is an awesome idea (and evidently tried before ;D)!

No, what I'm saying is removing Batman entirely would just be distracting, just like trying to avoid having the president in The West Wing would have been distracting. But including him doesn't mean letting him become a main character (and soap box for Martin Sheen), and in fact keeping him as a main character can give you a lot of scope to explore Batman as more of an anti-hero.

 cincydooley wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
"Gotham Central"(a comic series based upon the idea of "What is it like being a cop in Gotham City?") has done fairly well for itself--and "Arrow" has done fairly well.

Gotham Central was always something that should have been made into a gritty crime series like the shield. I wish that was more the focus then on Gordon, but I won't argue if it's done well.

But goddamn, I really don't want it on or associated with the CW. Put it on TNT or show time and make it directed more at adults in a quasi-Nolan Gotham.

It's going to be on Fox, not CW.

Honestly I think that being on a network like TNT or Showtime does not mean that the show can be "directed more at adults" than being on a general network. The time slot and format will do that far better than simply moving networks.

I just saw that it's going to be on FOX, so thank god for that. I merely chose TNT/Showtime because they're two WB affiliates that have had more 'mature' offerings on them.

But FOX should work too.

 Ahtman wrote:

That one is tricky, I think. Because if you just focus on more streetlife stuff, then I'm not sure it's really going to be any different to any of the hundreds of police procedurals that are already on TV.

I'm not saying they should use no villains from the Rogues Gallery, but avoid the top shelf (Two-Face, Joker, Bane, ect). They should be more things whispered about in dark corners, with the characters dealing with the effects these people have on the city more than the people themselves. We can run into Joker goons, but not the Joker, or have them dealing with an aftermath of a Joker spree.

This is what I was thinking... Something like him investigating a bank robbery, and spending a season chasing down the mysterious organization who leaves those Joker Cards.. a whole story arc that follows them trying to track these big bad guys around, but we never see them.

Or with Poison Ivy, paint them as your more "run of the mill" eco-terrorist group, etc.

So far, the general premise seems to be that this will be set prior to Batman ever emerging--which might still be used as the "catalyst" for the various supergangs, etc.

There is some very interesting discussion coming from DC that they are looking at using this to establish Gotham before Batman v. Superman

Alright I slept on it, and I've reconsidered my stance.

Captain Stingaree deserves his own show.

 Kanluwen wrote:
looking at using this to establish Gotham before Batman v. Superman

At first I was thinking that as well, but since (and I forget this by my second post ) it takes place before Gordon is Commissioner and in the upcoming movie they have described Batman as being "tired and wearied and seasoned (with oregano?) and been doing it for awhile" so the time between this show and the movie seems it would be, at least, a decade.

I think my concern is that while there are lots of ways this could be really good, there are more that it could go really badly, and I've seen more mishandled than done right. Still, Arrow and Agents of SHIELD have given hope for live action licensed comic book series on network TV.

They really want to compete with Agents of Shield don't they?

DC has maintained a TV presence, on and off, for sometime. I doubt they're trying to directly counter one series in particular. EDIT: Especially since Arrow is already a success and they're likely just trying to capitalize on something equally gritty.

yeah but Gordon is pretty vanilla, he's DC's Coulson

 Ouze wrote:
Alright I slept on it, and I've reconsidered my stance.

Captain Stingaree deserves his own show.

Sleep on it again, dude.




If it's a young gordon, it will be pre-batman and pre-joker, right? No reason to have hints of either running around I suppose.

They should definitely have the Penguin, though. And some of Raz Al Ghoul's guys could be running around Gotham, stirring up the criminal under ground. Plus, lots of mobsters and stuff.

I dunno. I never read Gotham Central that cincydooley's talking about.

Ra's Al Ghul could very well play a part.
The League of Shadows and the League of Assassins is actually playing a part in season 2 of "Arrow".