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So me and my friends all decided to get into WH40k and after making all of our models we went to a tournament and someone mentioned that you should do WYSIWYG. They talked about getting magnets and green stuff to make them have easier to change on the fly for what you are using in a game. Now as a new player and not a wealthy person should I care about the fact that my glued unpainted 2000ish point Space Wolves army looks cool to me but is not very WYSIWYG at all. In fact some models have weapons that they can't even use on them primarily my GH which could have been converted into WG. Something I didn't know about so they have stuff that GH can't take normally wouldn't. My WG Terminators Have TH and SS because I thought it made them look pretty sweet, but found out I don't always want them to have that load out, and one last example is my TWC having all TH and SS then finding out that is also an impossible load out. So should I spend the money and get magnets and try to pry the already glued pieces off and change them, or leave them as it is and not care about people complaining. Mind a lot of these mistakes were made by my friends also as we didn't know any one who could give us insight after buying the models and getting into the game.

I say yes, do get magnets. It really is worth it.

It will always depend on your opponent or the tournament organizer, but as a general rule, WYSIWYG usually only matters in tournaments, but it's a courtesy to your opponent to have an army that looks the way it is supposed to and is not confusing for him to look at and try to formulate strategies against.

Nobody wants to lose a game just because they were "tricked" by an incorrect weapon loadout or because they were too busy keeping track of which weapon actually represented what other weapon to play the game to their full potential.

Where would I buy magnets and is there any way to unglue them or do I have to pry their arms off. As a new player this just seems like a hassle and I think they should have metioned this on the box or in the booklet that you should get magnets and only build what you are gonna use. Also how would I apply the magnets?

As far as the manufaturer of the models is concerned, you should always glue things into place and buy as many complette sets as you want variations.
People use magnets to avoid buying additional sets.

In general, using magnets on (small) infantry isn't necessarily worth it. For bigger models, walkers, vehicles and monsters it will be more effective, both with more space to work with and with more money to save.

The basic method for using magnets is to use a pair, with a magnet recessed into a hole in each part. Rule of thumb is to use magnets as big as you can fit into the part without tearing it when drilling.
Polarity is key, take care to insert the second magnet in the right orientation relative to the first one, otherwise you'll have to damage one part to get the magnet out again. A handy trick is to use a bigger magnet (I use a 10mm rod with 4mm diameter) as a handle. Click the handle to the already inserted magnet and deposit the seond magnet on the handle's other side. Then use the handle to insert the second magnet.

Magnets are sold on eBay and by many retailers. Just google "buy neo-dym magnets" and review prices and S&H conditions.

If you're just playing with friends at home, then anything goes... if you take to a tournament or a more public setting, well it's up to the organizer but other people are paying money/time/effort to come and play games on tables with terrain and painted armies, and not have to figure out which weapon is which while they are playing.

In future try to equip your army with what you mostly play them with, or intend to play them with. It makes playing with strangers easier and can feel more satisfying being able to field exactly what you want to use.
If you have the motivation, experiment with magnetising combinations (cheap rare-earth magnets can be found on ebay, mine are usually sourced from sellers in Hong Kong). Loads of tutorials are on the forums and Youtube.
As for what you already have, I wouldn't start tearing apart your models and possibly damaging them at this stage. Later you might want to re-paint them or something, that then would be a good time to try and redo them. If you're playing primarily with your group of friends and you're all relaxed about not being WYSIWYG, you shouldn't worry about it.
My two pennies anyway.

My local store is gonna be holding more tournaments and so far it has not been to bad except for 2 guys who didn't like it. but like GH can get flamers but there are none in the sprues they get so what do i do here. do i have to order online to make everyone happy that one guy now has a flamer instead of just saying my only guy with a flag is the guy with a flamer

If you intend to play in lots of tournaments, then your opponents will expect you to have models that are WYSIWYG, or very close. Believe me, I know it sucks; my Tyranids are not set up for WYSIWYG at all, and I take my fair share of flak for it. The rule of thumb that I have run into is to at least have the equipment close, and minimize the number of models that are not WYSIWYG. Since you're new, most people will understand and allow you to use what you have until you can get the correct stuff built. Magnetizing can be great, but if you are as craft-inhibited as I am, it can be a real chore, I have destroyed a couple of models trying to do so; I prefer to just get the correct bits and just glue with them.

As far as how to do it; GW would tell you to just buy all the boxes you need and mix and match, as that's how they make the most money. In practice, you can find individual bitz in a lot of different places. I've bought a ton of bits off ebay; as a matter of fact, I bought a whole unit of Hormagaunts as bits rather than a box as it actually came out cheaper - although you cannot usually do this. Also ask some of the guys at the shop, some of them may have some of the bits you need and may either give them to you, sell them to you, or you may be able to trade if you have something they need.

So like for my long fangs because it only came with 1 missile launcher i basically have to buy more if i want them to regularly have all missile launchers

WYSIWYG is great, but takes a lot of effort, especially with space marines due to the tactical squad/devistator loadouts available. As a (former) marine player, WYSIWYG with minimal weapon swaps is really difficult to do unless you have a company of marines or more. Further, doing magnets on space marines can be really bothersome (droopy arms, etc).
I would magnetize "light" weapons (grav gun, flamer, etc) on tactical squads for sure: magnetize at the wrists because all of the light weapons have the same pose.
As for heavy weapons, it can be really difficult, especially if you try to swap backpacks too. My response to that is to get more marines: I had about 20 tacticals with just bolters, 4 or more of every heavy weapon (depending on how much I used them), and a couple of tacticals that I could swap out the light weapons on. This allowed me to field full strength squads(up to 3 tacticals, or 6 devistator squads) with WYSIWYG, while still keeping droopy arms to a minimum.
Magnetize your leaders though: swapping power swords, pistols, etc is useful, considering they are what you most commonly change in a load out.

I like WYSIWYG, but not for the sake of rules -- I'm just lazy, and remembering what something is when it's not what it looks like takes effort.

Even at tournaments, though, my only real concern is that whatever you have that isn't WYSIWYG is clear. Nothing bugs me more than someone saying "This marine with a bolter -- not to be confused with the other ninety marines with bolters on the table -- has a plasma cannon." I'd rather you represent it with a single Dark Eldar or something.

For bigger Tournaments and such WYSIWYG is almost necessary as you are on a very competitive lvl But as far as Smaller Casale Saturday Tournaments and random games people who freak out over the WYSIWYG Just are not fun to play with especially if the player is new to the game. WYSIWYG has its place and if after a year or so you are still proxying 50% of your army it could start to bug your local pool of players but, Warhammer/40k is by no means cheap so investing $200-$300 or more in models that might not work for you just to satisfy someone's pet peeve is, in my mind, unacceptable . If you want to try something new whether you are a new or old player i don't mind proxying just as long as you put it in your army list pay the points for it and don't set 10 IG lasguns troops out on the table and say these 2 guys have this, he has that, and these 5 do this. Im fine with you using rocks to proxy plasma guns as long as it does not blending in with all the rocks that have lasguns.

This game is meant to fun and if you want to take a rock to proxy in some new unit that just came out or want to proxy your army to try out a new army before dropping $2000 on models then i'm fine with that.

I say, learn to do it right from the beginning. WYSIWYG is more important for new players, as it will establish good habits, as well as allowing you to learn the game more easily as you'll learn to recognize the models.

I would not tear apart what you have, but seek to replace stuff as your collection grows.

Magnetization is nice, and getting into it early helps. You can also use sticky tac, like you use to hang posters, to keep bits on. I did this for years.

In addition to buying bits, check with the locals to see if they have spare they are willing to swap. Most of us have bits boxes, and some are deep and chock full of stuff we are willing to trade.

WYSWYG is not a rule, so much as a courtesy. But some tournaments do enforce it, to keep arguments and cheating down. My rule of thumb is I don't care about it if I can use 3 rules to remember about your army. And keep it consistent. If you say "all the heavy weapons in my long fang squad are MLs" I can keep that in mind. If I need to memorize a list of A=B, C=D, E=A (except on this squad, where is is B) then I start getting irritated.

And as a new player, they should cut you some slack. But I can't speak for them, or your local meta. As far as I know, someone horribly abused counts-as minis and left a bad taste at the FLGS, so now they are all WYSWYG hardliners. YMMV.

I would say that if a model is carrying something, he/she/it must have it equipped.

MrCJG wrote:
So like for my long fangs because it only came with 1 missile launcher i basically have to buy more if i want them to regularly have all missile launchers

'

Ebay or other places which sell bits separately is what you need. You can buy more rocket launchers or more other heavy weapons. Or better yet, by cheaper versions that you can use in place of them...

I recently finished a tournament at the local GW store and although they prefer WYSIWYG, they didn't mind your loadout as long as you are clear with your opponents.

In saying that, having loadouts on models that they can't take is bordering on the "it would be best to change them" scenario.

I'm with them, get some magnets, make the effort to change them over, you won't regret it on the end.

I wouldnt bother ripping arms off. Younshould be able to do a good enough job of seperating them as you paint them. For example your thunderwolves, paint one hammer to look like a power weapon, and the other two as unpowered weapons, then they are just ccw

Th0rh4mm3r wrote:
I wouldnt bother ripping arms off. Younshould be able to do a good enough job of seperating them as you paint them. For example your thunderwolves, paint one hammer to look like a power weapon, and the other two as unpowered weapons, then they are just ccw

that makes sense

 sing your life wrote:
I would say that if a model is carrying something, he/she/it must have it equipped.

That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

Super Newb wrote:
That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

It's not really that hard. My Grey Hunters all have pistol holsters.

 insaniak wrote:

Super Newb wrote:
That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

It's not really that hard. My Grey Hunters all have pistol holsters.

Would it be acceptable to make a model holding a pistol in one hand a bolter in the other and a CCW on his side?

 MrCJG wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Super Newb wrote:
That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

It's not really that hard. My Grey Hunters all have pistol holsters.

Would it be acceptable to make a model holding a pistol in one hand a bolter in the other and a CCW on his side?

And the grenades in his belt, but you can model the CCW at his back too. For a example in cool WYSIWYG check at the Veteran Sargent true scale pmlog.

 insaniak wrote:

Super Newb wrote:
That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

It's not really that hard. My Grey Hunters all have pistol holsters.

And your opponent looks at every single one to make sure they all have pistol holsters? Come on now. It's standard equipment, all three of those things don't have to be on the model.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MrCJG wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Super Newb wrote:
That rule is ok in general but needs exceptions. Space Wolves Grey Hunters and I think some Chaos Space Marines have a bolter, bolt pistol and ccw. They have those standard. It would be over the top to demand they have all three of those on the model.

It's not really that hard. My Grey Hunters all have pistol holsters.

Would it be acceptable to make a model holding a pistol in one hand a bolter in the other and a CCW on his side?

Listen, if you tell your opponent you are playing Space Wolves, and tell him you have Grey Hunters, he should know about their 2 CCWs (the pistol counts as one) and therefore their extra attack. If they don't, YOU SHOULD TELL THEM ABOUT IT. A little dinky pistol holster is not going to help them figure it out.

Super Newb wrote:
And your opponent looks at every single one to make sure they all have pistol holsters? Come on now. It's standard equipment, all three of those things don't have to be on the model.

Whether or not my opponent actually bothers to look is irrelevant. If they want to check, they can see that the model has a bolter, a CCW and a pistol. I run Grey Hunters, Blood Claws, Long Fangs and Wolf Guard. Some of those units come standard with pistols, and some don't. I don't expect my opponent to remember which is which, hence the visual clue.


There are way too many armies in this game to expect everyone to be able to remember what every single unit comes with as standard gear.

For the question about long fangs, most space-wolf players convert from this kit. it has a bunch of special weapons.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1060104

also, I had the same dilemma when I was new to the game. I ended up ripping off a bunch of arms but in the end everything turned out fine.

 Largeblastmarker wrote:
For the question about long fangs, most space-wolf players convert from this kit. it has a bunch of special weapons.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1060104.

Actually, most Long Fangs are equipped with Missile Launchers, and you only get one of those in the Dev box. More common to just trade or buy the weapons you want directly.

the earlier a new player gets into having WYSIWYG models, the better.

Ya I am gonna order magnets tomorrow and just put my guys in the freezer then pry their arms off