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Never seem to get any feedback on my lists :( trying again with a 2000 point list for a game at the weekend:

HQ Cost Options
Tigurius 165

Elite
LotD 160 5, plas + plas cannon + combi plas
Sternguard 271 8, 5 combi melta + drop pod
Sternguard 271 8, 5 combi melta + drop pod

Troop
Tactical 180 10, flamer + Drop Pod
Tactical 180 10, flamer + Drop Pod
Tactical 180 10, flamer + Drop Pod
Scout 113 five with heavy bolter, hell fire, storm

Fast
Storm Talon 125 sky hammer
Storm Talon 125 sky hammer

Heavy
Storm Raven 230 MM + hurricane bolters

Fortifications

Total 2000

Is this set up where nothing starts on the board? That way if you go 2nd your opponent has a wasted turn. Mwahaha

I like it

That's one thing I don't like about this list, plus I'm not sure its 100% legal in 6th? As I only play friends we can agree something and house rule it anyway if it isn't.

As I read it, since the lotd and scouts are not in drop pods they have the option to deploy or go in reserves. Since everything else is in either a flier or a drop pod, his army is essentially two units. He has to choose one of those to be deployed and the other can go in reserves.

So there will at least be scouts on the board, or legion.

According to LotD's rules they must start in reserve, so that would leave the scouts?

Those LOTD arent really doing anything considering the sternguard in pods do the same thing, but better.

Also, you can do this yeah. Rulebook says the check for being tabled is at the end of the entire game turn so, since you will have to pod something in first turn cus of the way it works, you'll be fine.

your legion of the damned I think are suppose to be 165 pts.

And yes, your scouts have to deploy by the rule since they are your only unit that is not held by some reserve rule like the drop pods or LotD

I like the list. Not quite a fan of a Tactical Squad having to drop in T1, but I think the list is solid.


As to the rules question. The list is perfectly legal all reserves list so long as Tigerious is in the Storm Raven or the Drop Pod. The LotD must start in Reserves and are not counted. Flyer and Drop Pods including thier occupants are not counted either. So, the only thing that counts as a unit for resreve calculation is the Land Speeder Storm and the Scouts which only count as one. By rules, half rounded up can start in Reserve, 1 divided by 2 rounds to 1. So the list can start with its only unit in reserves.

Be careful though, if your enemy can kill off your three pods and their occupants by the end of T1, they will win the game. Something to keep in mind if you are forced to go First though not likely.

Also, make sure to declare one Storm Talon is escorting the Raven, and the other is Escorting the Land Speeder Storm. Hurricane Bolters may be unnecessary on the Storm Raven and you may be better served to spend those points elsewhere.

Edit: To Clarify the check for tabling happens at the end of the Game turn, not at the end of any Player Turn.

blood lance wrote:
Those LOTD arent really doing anything considering the sternguard in pods do the same thing, but better.

Also, you can do this yeah. Rulebook says the check for being tabled is at the end of the entire game turn so, since you will have to pod something in first turn cus of the way it works, you'll be fine.

I wanted three units of sternguard in pods but couldn't quite squeeze them into the list, I'm not a fan of 5 man Sternguards as they tend to be completely dead the turn after they arrive if I've been aggressive with them whereas with a 8 man squad I might have a few left next turn to chip away at something.

LotD have worked pretty well for me as they ignore cover with S7 AP2 on the turn they arrive from all three plasma, Sternguard can't match both the ignore cover, low AP or high S at the same time so LotD are great at killing dug in, stubborn, stuff. Plus the 3++ means they last a little longer with all the AP2 and AP3 about these days, I can normally get a couple of turns out of them if I can dump out enough threats.

Need to amend the cost of the LotD unit as they should indeed be 165. I'd drop the hell fire rounds as much as I don't like doing that.

zephel wrote:
your legion of the damned I think are suppose to be 165 pts.

And yes, your scouts have to deploy by the rule since they are your only unit that is not held by some reserve rule like the drop pods or LotD

Unless he loads them into the storm Raven.......

 Lemartes12 wrote:

zephel wrote:
your legion of the damned I think are suppose to be 165 pts.

And yes, your scouts have to deploy by the rule since they are your only unit that is not held by some reserve rule like the drop pods or LotD

Unless he loads them into the storm Raven.......

LotD MUST arrive by Deep Strike and always must start the game in Reserve.

 Zagman wrote:
I like the list. Not quite a fan of a Tactical Squad having to drop in T1, but I think the list is solid.


As to the rules question. The list is perfectly legal all reserves list so long as Tigerious is in the Storm Raven or the Drop Pod. The LotD must start in Reserves and are not counted. Flyer and Drop Pods including thier occupants are not counted either. So, the only thing that counts as a unit for resreve calculation is the Land Speeder Storm and the Scouts which only count as one. By rules, half rounded up can start in Reserve, 1 divided by 2 rounds to 1. So the list can start with its only unit in reserves.

Be careful though, if your enemy can kill off your three pods and their occupants by the end of T1, they will win the game. Something to keep in mind if you are forced to go First though not likely.

Also, make sure to declare one Storm Talon is escorting the Raven, and the other is Escorting the Land Speeder Storm. Hurricane Bolters may be unnecessary on the Storm Raven and you may be better served to spend those points elsewhere.

Edit: To Clarify the check for tabling happens at the end of the Game turn, not at the end of any Player Turn.

Noted about the risk, I'll hide the first tactical pod as best I can when it deploys.

I didn't know that the Talon could escort the Speeder, thats very useful and makes things much easier.

I like the Hurricane Bolters a lot, help add to the assault cannons to clear off smaller units in one turn, otherwise I'm really low on mobile units that can clean up infantry that quickly. What would you have instead?

Looky Likey wrote:

 Zagman wrote:
I like the list. Not quite a fan of a Tactical Squad having to drop in T1, but I think the list is solid.


As to the rules question. The list is perfectly legal all reserves list so long as Tigerious is in the Storm Raven or the Drop Pod. The LotD must start in Reserves and are not counted. Flyer and Drop Pods including thier occupants are not counted either. So, the only thing that counts as a unit for resreve calculation is the Land Speeder Storm and the Scouts which only count as one. By rules, half rounded up can start in Reserve, 1 divided by 2 rounds to 1. So the list can start with its only unit in reserves.

Be careful though, if your enemy can kill off your three pods and their occupants by the end of T1, they will win the game. Something to keep in mind if you are forced to go First though not likely.

Also, make sure to declare one Storm Talon is escorting the Raven, and the other is Escorting the Land Speeder Storm. Hurricane Bolters may be unnecessary on the Storm Raven and you may be better served to spend those points elsewhere.

Edit: To Clarify the check for tabling happens at the end of the Game turn, not at the end of any Player Turn.

Noted about the risk, I'll hide the first tactical pod as best I can when it deploys.

I didn't know that the Talon could escort the Speeder, thats very useful and makes things much easier.

I like the Hurricane Bolters a lot, help add to the assault cannons to clear off smaller units in one turn, otherwise I'm really low on mobile units that can clean up infantry that quickly. What would you have instead?

Honestly, I really don't have a better suggestion honestly. Maybe tool out one of the Tactical squads a bit, but you are good on melta and plasma already. I really don't have a good option for those points while keeping to your list style.

Ok, I'll leave it as is then unless anybody else has any other improvements?

Didn't know LotD had to come in reserves, that's handy.

Looks like a fun list that will keep your opponents on their toes!

zephel wrote:
your legion of the damned I think are suppose to be 165 pts.

And yes, your scouts have to deploy by the rule since they are your only unit that is not held by some reserve rule like the drop pods or LotD

The rule states half of your units (in this case, 1 unit) rounded up may start in reserve. Half of one, rounded up, is one. So he may start all of his units (scouts) in reserve assuming he puts Tigurius in a drop pod or the storm raven of course.

Not a bad list. I like it. Very boys-before-toys too.

Thought I'd give a quick update on how this list did over the weekend. Played against an Iyanden list consisting of:

Wraithknight (Warlord)
Wraith Seer
10 Wraithguard + Spirit Seer
10 Wraithguard + Spirit Seer
10 Wraithguard + Spirit Seer
3 Warwalkers, 2 with scatter lasers, 1 with missile launcher with flack

He also had that stone that allows wraiths to regenerate wounds

Mission was four objectives, all but one placed in his corner of the table, the other (placed by him) near the middle of the table, diagonal deployment type. He deployed with good use of the LOS blocking terrain making it impossible to alpha one unit with both units of Sternguard.

I got forced into going first, lost one unit of Sternguard early on (as expected), other survived till final turn. Against his list combi plasma would have been much better, the LotD were far more effective than the Sternguard point for point. I had a few unlucky roles with the reserves rolls for the tacticals so they came on earlier than I'd have liked and the Stormraven & Talon came on a turn later than I'd have liked as well. We drew on objectives and I nearly got the win if he'd failed one more save final turn but lost due to first blood, quite tough to get first blood due to the T of his units.

I think I'd switch out one unit of combi melta for combi plasma otherwise I'd reasonably happy with this list.

I'd go with a Dread in a Pod instead of the LotD but if you like them keep them. Dread probably isn't anymore likely to do damage.
And yeah before I read your game summary all I was going to suggest otherwise was swapping one Sterngaurd squad to Combi-plasmas. Gives you much more versatility.

Did the Tacticals do much damage?
To me they don't look very optimised, and having three ten man squads at 2000 points with limited damage output is a bit iffy. I suppose 9 boltguns and a flamer will do well enough against infantry. But Sternguard and LotD and the scouts and possibly the storm talons (not sure what guns they have, haven't actually played against one/with one yet). Seems pretty light on anti-tank and anti-MC/high toughness?

A dred at around the same would be less damage output than the LotD for the anti elite and be more vulnerable to high S fire. Obviously LotD are more vulnerable to massed small arms fire but that 3++ is pretty damn awesome otherwise. Add in ignoring cover plasma and they are great at killing anything without an invulnerable.

In that game all the flamers, normal bolters and heavy bolters were useless due to the mass of T6 & T8, I think they caused one failed save all game even with the UM bolter drill chapter tactic. Against normal infantry tacticals are fine mopping up in pairs, especially with bolter drill.

Against an army with less high T models the Sternguard are normally fine taking that out with their hellfire rounds, against something with a 3+ they can cause 4.3 wounds with rerolling 1s or nearly 5 wounds with Tiggy's warlord trait.

Against AV14 vehicles I have the sternguard's multi melta and the one on the Storm Raven. Against anything lower I have the assault cannons on the Storm Talons and Storm Raven, all the plasma, S7 missiles on the Storm Talon and S8 missiles on the Storm Raven. Tiggy normally gets something good against Tanks as well as I go for Telekine Dome (didn't get it this game even with 6 rolls on that table, so more bad luck) on the Telekinetic table.

Yeah I thought a Dread probably wouldn't be doing as much damage. But its a different kind of threat so always worth considering imho.
LotD seem better every time I hear/read something about them, didn't know they ignored cover. Obviously their downfall is the small arms fire.

I always forget plasma is actually an ok way of taking out vehicles. I guess you'd struggle against a lot of Vindicators/Preds/Land Raiders. But how often do you see that nowadays?

I do like your list, think its pretty balanced and poses a strong threat, you clearly know what you're doing with it and planned out how to take on various threats.

Same guy has a 4 LR Grey Knight list he likes to run, but that has so few units its easy to avoid and cripple.

Haha yeah I can imagine!!

It'd be interesting to run a 4 Land Raider list, its just going to be so dependent on match up as to wether you even have a chance of winning.

Fancy taking a look at my list? It doesn't look anywhere near as good as yours :/