Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

In another thread, I may have mentioned my DP and I'd said that I was going to take the Axe of Blind Fury...I took this weapon after reading a thread on here about the best CCW to take. Another forum member has just suggested exchanging it for the Black Mace, so I'm trying to find out a general consensus.

The AoBF is +2 Strength, Gives the DP Rage, but reduces his WS & BS by 1, making him WS 8 and therefor allowing all WS 4 to hit on 4's rather than 5's. This means however that on a turn he charges he is 5 attacks as standard, +2 for charging and +D6 for the daemon weapon. A potential of 11 attacks, that on the charge is S8

The Black Mace is the users strength only. The AP is still 2 due to him being an MC, so he will have a potential of 10 attacks at S6 (No Rage). He can of course choose to smash, reducing his attacks characteristic by 2, which is a potential of 8 attacks at S10. It also doesn't reduce his WS and will make all victims and all within 3" take a toughness test. People already hit will be removed from play if they have already suffered an unsaved wound from him and fail their toughness test, all within 3" will suffer a wound with no saves if they fail their test.

I am swinging towards the axe for a few reasons, its cheaper (all be it not by much), its more fluffy for my khorne list, and there is a greater number of attacks at a higher strength. Also, I intend to use him to mostly kill enemy MC's and such, and so toughness tests wont really be important as other DP's are T5, Riptides (his primary lunch) are T6 and Wraithknights are T8. Very rarely will the T5 models fail a toughness test. My primary opponents are Farsight, blood angels, and eldar. The S8 against tau is beautiful, as he is instant death-ing all suits on the charge!

Please help! Am I better off sticking to my axe, or swapping out? (I've already modelled the axe on!!) I think it fits Khorne better. Just so you know, the list has 2 maulerfiends and 2 land raiders for AT, kharn and 2 squads of 10 bezerkers for infantry control, a hell turkey for more horde control, and 5 termies for a bit of both. Just so you can see where he will fit in.

When you smash and halve the attacks, you round up so on the charge the DP with the mace gets up to 9A. Normally (Edit:without smashing) its 4, +1 for charging so he'd have 5+D6 so up to 11.
A toughness test always fails on a 6.
I think a DP with the black mace will survive slightly longer due to being hit on 5+'s.

The most important rule? Choose what you'd like
I've used the axe and that was fun too

Its 5 attacks as standard, so thats 3+1 for charging, and the +D6. Never more than 10!

Thats if you smash - when I said normally, I meant without smashing

Sorry for being confusing

Thats cool, but you would pick the mace no matter what?

On a dp I'd honestly take either, it would depend on the mark being used.

My choices are I that take slaanesh csms so I'd have the BM on my slaanesh DP as fluffyier and the axe is khorne marked.
I've got a juggerlord with an axe and he ruins squads - the DP with the axe of khorne will do it better as he's st8 and I9.
I don't think there is going to be lot left after he attacks so I don't think the WS debuff will matter as much.

Either way, If you roll high on your demon weapon, you're laughing. Just avoid the avatar of khaine and bloodthirsters

I think with what you've got planned, the axe will be more useful to you

I've actually done some list adjusting, and for the first time ever, I'm going to attempt to run a list with allies I'm about to post it in the army list section, check it out dude, I'd love to hear your thoughts, you seem educated in the ways of chaos!

I would actually go for the Black Mace just because of Fleshbane. Wounding a Wraithknight on a 2+ without smashing is great. Plus, you get to keep WS9.

Instant death on crisis suits isn't even worth considering, imo. If you're in combat with them, you're going to wipe the unit. If you really need to instant death them, you can just smash.

At the same time, the axe is slightly cheaper and it's definitely not a "bad" choice. If you've already modeled it with an axe (and you want it to stay WYSIWYG), don't bother re-doing it.

Well, I have just changed my list to add in a Chaos Daemons DP, So he could be the axe wielder and I could maybe squeeze the mace in!

Unfortunately it's not even close.

First of all the black mace actually gives a bigger strng upgrade, as it always wounds on 2's.

Furthermore it is cursed, which is tough to evaluate on paper but really shreds through infantry which will tarpit a blind rage user.

Always ap 2 as listed above, maximum of 12 attacks on the charge. Smashing would be max 9, you smash after the charge is complete. (after you gain the bonus)

The mace just does gross things, doesn't have a drawback like the axe and tango's with other MC's more efficiently.

The axe isn't a BAD choice but I would pick the mace 100% of the time.

Also Khorne daemon princes are laughably bad, go tzeentch or if you really don't want to go slaanesh. Model him red and khorney, I wouldn't consider the color of him WYSIWYG. That's racist.

Unfortunately there aren't a lot of great options for the DP, but the ones that are good truly make him into a beast capable of taking almost every model(s) in the game.

Thanks for the input. The fleshbane I completely forgot about. But I think I will still take him as a Daemon of khorne. I know they are not the best upgrade, But I want a pure Khorne list!

mace is by far better, due to the curse and fleshbane. You have 7-11 attacks +1 on the charge wounding on a 2+ at AP 2. The only reason to use smash is to instant death models with multiple wounds or to take out a tank. Easily wiping out anything he goes against in the first turn. Make him a psycher and roll in biomancy- he'll be unstoppable. I have to say that for 10 points more its completely worth it to get a BM instead of the axe. far more devastating.

+1 to the Black Mace over the Axe of Blind Fury.

I have a friend who plays all Khorne and gives the mace to his DP and the axe to his Juggerlord. The mace is just better with an MC and the axe makes his CL almost as effective in cc. The axe is always secondary to the mace.

Killing machines. I have seen armies spend 3 rounds of shooting trying to take down just these 2 models without success, only to be eaten up quickly when they finally reach their lines.

Ok. I have taken the mace on my CSM Daemon prince. I will use my axe built daemon for my CD Daemon prince with an axe of Khorne.

 Khaine's Wrath wrote:
Its 5 attacks as standard, so thats 3+1 for charging, and the +D6. Never more than 10!

Actually the Daemon weapon can go above the natural 10 limit as it's not modifying the base attack stat. It's why Abbadon can hit up to 13 times in combat on the charge.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:


Actually the Daemon weapon can go above the natural 10 limit as it's not modifying the base attack stat. It's why Abbadon can hit up to 13 times in combat on the charge.

I think he was talking about the amount of smash attacks possible for the DP with the BM

I was indeed.... Up to 10 smash attacks, up to 12 normal! Either way pretty nasty!

I agree with the above that the mace is better but came across this same issue, i have a red cool looking khorne DP with an axe I bought from a guy so he has an axe--its fluffy and keeps it wysiwyg. Plus, for friendly games its not about having the most competitive its about having fun.

Aijec wrote:


Always ap 2 as listed above, maximum of 12 attacks on the charge. Smashing would be max 9, you smash after the charge is complete. (after you gain the bonus)

I'm afraid you are incorrect. You halve the Attack Characteristic rounding up. Then add.


I would take the black mace for even if just for the potential of wasting half a squad even in a challenge. I keep the Axe for my Jugger Lord to put a bit ore AP 2 on the board.

Not long posted a CSM list in the AL section,

How about this CRAZY idea!

3 winged DP's....here's the crazy part,

1 with a mace,
1 with the axe,
And 1 with the murder sword!

*insert evil laugh here*