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Originally from here

 Kanluwen wrote:

Okay, so basically you want to play the game the way YOU want to but without having to play the game with the proper game balance.

There's a word for this; hypocrisy. "Play by our rules please" "No you play by my rules" "It's my server my rules" "I'm gonna report you!" It's nonsense.

You're view would be sensible is leveled character progression didn't exist or was even across ranked and unranked servers but that's not how the game is.

The option for people who prefer their own rulesets is to either play the game in a way that annoys people like you or basically don't play at all. There's a argument that servers with custom rule sets mess up the rankings but the rankings are twisted anyway so that argument falls on its face. The only argument you really have is 'it annoys me and I don't like it." Welcome to the exact reason why players make and play in those servers in the first place and they should be able to do that and still enjoy the fundamentals of the game which they can't because half the player content is hidden behind a progression barrier they can't use in the custom play track.

That you think the games are balanced is hilarious. The whole reason no tube servers even started was because they were far from balanced. I haven't seen a balanced FPS in over a decade and none of them were BF games. Dice wouldn't know balance if it slapped them across the face.

You're using the example of "no tube servers" for Call of Duty: Modern Warfare(where "tubes" like the SMAW or RPG had no real use except versus killstreaks like the Attack Chopper or Harrier) versus the nonsense in Battlefield where privately owned servers try to get away with cutting out whole swathes of weapons and gadgets because they're "OP".

Battlefield has set it up so that you can have a "Custom" server and play the way you want to. The fact that it keeps you from ranking up and from getting players via quick match or "ranked" matchmaking should be brutally obvious as you're trying to game the system.

Whether you think ranks are bad or not, it should be really obvious why having things like "No Stingers or IGLAs or C4 or Javelins/Lasers or Semi-Auto Snipers" are just examples of poor sportsmanship and refusing to understand how the game you are playing works.

If you want my absolute, amazing opinion?
For games like Modern Warfare--the launchers never should have been added outside of the underslung grenade launchers.
For games like MW2, Black Ops, or Battlefield there is enough present in the game which actively requires those heavier weapons to counter. Things like helicopters, tanks, jets, etc.

 Kanluwen wrote:
You're using the example of "no tube servers" for Call of Duty: Modern Warfare and Modern Warfare 2(where "tubes" like the SMAW or RPG had no real use except versus killstreaks like the Attack Chopper or Harrier) versus the nonsense in Battlefield where privately owned servers try to get away with cutting out whole swathes of weapons and gadgets because they're "OP".

That's because I've been speaking in more general terms, not just in relation to Battlefield. Battlefield is a game where custom rules are trickier in general because when your server can be as big as 64 players (or bigger) the idea that you can enforce a complex custom rule set without a mod to back you is gonna destroy any benefit you might get from said restrictions. You'd have to have 24/7 police admins to maintain the rules. Something simple like "don't shoot rockets at players not in vehicles' isn't that hard of a rule to back up. A massive sweep of weapon restrictions, you're gonna be busy playing 'is this guy following the rules' all the time.

The fact that it keeps you from ranking up and from getting players via quick match or "ranked" matchmaking should be brutally obvious as you're trying to game the system.

Game the system? To what end? The point of a game is to have fun. We're not all pro players with money and reputation on the line. In the past there have been servers used to game the system in some games. The 'quick level' servers in CoD4 basically spawned the current trend of 'ranked' and 'unranked' along side other practical considerations. But since we can't really mod a server anymore it seems redundant. Restrictions can be placed on servers to maintain integrity of the developers intended form of play without ruining the experience for those who want to make their own.

Whether you think ranks are bad or not, it should be really obvious why having things like "No Stingers or IGLAs or C4 or Javelins/Lasers or Semi-Auto Snipers" are just examples of poor sportsmanship and refusing to understand how the game you are playing works.

I've been distracted by other stuff but yes. There are custom rules that are stupid. Really stupid. I mean its one thing to say "I enjoy knifing, how fun would it be to have a giant knife battle?" That can be fun even for people who just want to play a round or two and then go do something else. Then there's stuff like "no tanks" in a Battlefield server and yeah I've been in servers like that and it is really stupid. Why even bother playing Battlefield at all if you aren't going to use tanks? And some rules are stupid. The answer to servers that do that is to not play in them not marginalize everyone who has server rules because some of those rules my be legitimately born of concerns with balance or just wanting to have a more controlled and varied game environment.

There's setting rules to make something that you enjoy happen and to make it uniform across the server and there's 'why are you playing this game at all?" But there's a lot of in between in there and there should be room for those people in a game and its not like its a monumental task to give them the venue to play the game the way they want to.

 LordofHats wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
You're using the example of "no tube servers" for Call of Duty: Modern Warfare and Modern Warfare 2(where "tubes" like the SMAW or RPG had no real use except versus killstreaks like the Attack Chopper or Harrier) versus the nonsense in Battlefield where privately owned servers try to get away with cutting out whole swathes of weapons and gadgets because they're "OP".

That's because I've been speaking in more general terms, not just in relation to Battlefield. Battlefield is a game where custom rules are trickier in general because when your server can be as big as 64 players (or bigger) the idea that you can enforce a complex custom rule set without a mod to back you is gonna destroy any benefit you might get from said restrictions. You'd have to have 24/7 police admins to maintain the rules. Something simple like "don't shoot rockets at players not in vehicles' isn't that hard of a rule to back up. A massive sweep of weapon restrictions, you're gonna be busy playing 'is this guy following the rules' all the time.

You do not have a single admin on Battlefield though. You can set other players/friends to be admins as well and the only thing they are not able to do is ban/kick other admins.

And with the killfeed it is not really hard to figure out "is this guy following my ridiculous rules"?

The fact that it keeps you from ranking up and from getting players via quick match or "ranked" matchmaking should be brutally obvious as you're trying to game the system.

Game the system? To what end? The point of a game is to have fun. We're not all pro players with money and reputation on the line. In the past there have been servers used to game the system in some games. The 'quick level' servers in CoD4 basically spawned the current trend of 'ranked' and 'unranked' along side other practical considerations. But since we can't really mod a server anymore it seems redundant. Restrictions can be placed on servers to maintain integrity of the developers intended form of play without ruining the experience for those who want to make their own.

Get a ranked server. Kick/ban anyone using IGLAs/Stingers or other combinations of things that can shoot down helicopters.

Congratulations, you have created your own little fiefdom where you are unopposed as there are some maps which have helicopters but not jets.

Whether you think ranks are bad or not, it should be really obvious why having things like "No Stingers or IGLAs or C4 or Javelins/Lasers or Semi-Auto Snipers" are just examples of poor sportsmanship and refusing to understand how the game you are playing works.

I've been distracted by other stuff but yes. There are custom rules that are stupid. Really stupid. I mean its one thing to say "I enjoy knifing, how fun would it be to have a giant knife battle?" That can be fun even for people who just want to play a round or two and then go do something else. Then there's stuff like "no tanks" in a Battlefield server and yeah I've been in servers like that and it is really stupid. Why even bother playing Battlefield at all if you aren't going to use tanks? And some rules are stupid. The answer to servers that do that is to not play in them not marginalize everyone who has server rules because some of those rules my be legitimately born of concerns with balance or just wanting to have a more controlled and varied game environment.

There's setting rules to make something that you enjoy happen and to make it uniform across the server and there's 'why are you playing this game at all?" But there's a lot of in between in there and there should be room for those people in a game and its not like its a monumental task to give them the venue to play the game the way they want to.

But once again, if you want to have rules?

There's a reason that DICE requires you to set "CUSTOM" rules and actually restrict the weapons/vehicles instead of just the nonsense of "I'll kick you if you use X".

 Kanluwen wrote:


And with the killfeed it is not really hard to figure out "is this guy following my ridiculous rules"?

As someone who has admined servers upwards of 32 people it is practically a full time job. I can't imagine having real fun doing it with 64 or more. That's just insane.

But once again, if you want to have rules?

There's a reason that DICE requires you to set "CUSTOM" rules and actually restrict the weapons/vehicles instead of just the nonsense of "I'll kick you if you use X".

DICE requires it because people complain about stumbling into servers where custom rules are present which is in part DICE's fault. That's the real nonsense. if people could progress in unranked, even if it didn't translate over into ranked servers or vice versa, a lot of those servers would probably disappear. Instead they're forced to either put themselves in ranked and do it the hard way or play half a game. Granted people with crazy rules like 'ban everything that can shoot down my heli' will probably not do that cause their interest is more than apparently not having a fun server as much as having fun for themselves and that'll likely never go away. The world is full of aholes and they're never going to disappear. I just question why things have to be harder for nonaholes (this is kind of the same argument I have against DRM).

 Kanluwen wrote:

Battlefield has set it up so that you can have a "Custom" server and play the way you want to. The fact that it keeps you from ranking up and from getting players via quick match or "ranked" matchmaking should be brutally obvious as you're trying to game the system.

I'm playing exclusively on Custom servers in BF4 and ranking up just fine.

Well. Apparently part of this conversation has been woefully misinformed XD Was BF3 like that too (yeah still not remembering jack about that game save the map with the carrier and being annoyed I couldn't get off the boat)?

Dunno. I only play Custom in BF4 because Hardcore's bugged, and there aren't any servers available for it. So, guys who want to run Hardcore-esque servers need to run Custom ones with Hardcore damage rules. There's a lot of variation - some have minimaps, some don't. Some have spotting, some don't. Some have hit markers, some don't. All are ranked.

 Seaward wrote:
Dunno. I only play Custom in BF4 because Hardcore's bugged, and there aren't any servers available for it. So, guys who want to run Hardcore-esque servers need to run Custom ones with Hardcore damage rules. There's a lot of variation - some have minimaps, some don't. Some have spotting, some don't. Some have hit markers, some don't. All are ranked.

Having "Hardcore" enabled does not turn the game "Custom".

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Seaward wrote:
Dunno. I only play Custom in BF4 because Hardcore's bugged, and there aren't any servers available for it. So, guys who want to run Hardcore-esque servers need to run Custom ones with Hardcore damage rules. There's a lot of variation - some have minimaps, some don't. Some have spotting, some don't. Some have hit markers, some don't. All are ranked.

Having "Hardcore" enabled does not turn the game "Custom".

hes saying that's because the actual hardcore is bugged he's forced into custom games replicating hardcore

 Kanluwen wrote:
Having "Hardcore" enabled does not turn the game "Custom".

No. Having "Custom" enabled turns the game Custom. It's what I've been playing on since launch, exclusively.

All I know is its their server, their rules. If I don't like a certain server it takes all of 30 seconds to leave and find another game.

I miss the days when I used to play on iinet (I think that was its name) for bf1942 or some of the other custom servers for other games that I've forgotten the names of. I love the communities you get with a well run server, even if it can be hard to join them at times.

 The Dark Apostle wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Seaward wrote:
Dunno. I only play Custom in BF4 because Hardcore's bugged, and there aren't any servers available for it. So, guys who want to run Hardcore-esque servers need to run Custom ones with Hardcore damage rules. There's a lot of variation - some have minimaps, some don't. Some have spotting, some don't. Some have hit markers, some don't. All are ranked.

Having "Hardcore" enabled does not turn the game "Custom".

hes saying that's because the actual hardcore is bugged he's forced into custom games replicating hardcore

"Hardcore" is an actual game setting you can choose.

Enabling Hardcore should not be turning a server into showing as "Custom".

 Kanluwen wrote:
"Hardcore" is an actual game setting you can choose.

Enabling Hardcore should not be turning a server into showing as "Custom".

I'm not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse or what, but I'll say it again:

Hardcore mode was bugged at launch. It did not work. People made Custom servers replicating Hardcore rulesets as a workaround. These servers were ranked. They remain ranked now that Hardcore is up and running.

I promise you that you can find Custom ranked servers in BF4. It's not difficult. There are many, many, many of them.