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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 07:37:07
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant
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I hope this doesn't come off as silly, but can anyone give me a quick rundown of the Fantasy universe and what is currently going on?
I know there's wikis and other info stashes, but I like to ask questions directly and hear it from the players themselves.
I'm not very familiar with Fantasy since I only play 40k (for now...) and I hope some backstory can get me pumped for some fantasy goodness.
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Only in Death does Duty end
3rd Company
Bravo Two Seven "Ironhides" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 08:23:44
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Sniping Hexa
Dublin
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Ancients come through portals
Ancients create Slanns as gifted students and Lizardmen as workhorses
Ancients play around and create Elfsies, Stunties, Humies, Ogres, Orcs 'n other stuff
Ancients have a party and die of delirium tremens (my interpretation)
Portals go BOOM and Daemons go apeshit on the world
super duper battles Lizzies vs Daemons & Elfsies vs Daemons
World is saved, yay! Portals continue vomiting chaos stuff, booh hiss
Old humies from the sands are kicked in the face by Nagash the ubber necromancer
Nagash cleans house, including supra-sexy vampire chicks
Nagash gets killed by a plot from the superior and brilliant (and modest) Skavens, but he's undead, he doesn't care that much
Elfsies and Stunties fight because they're all super arrogant
Elfsies leave the Old World
Elfisies enjoy themselves too much, hello dark elfsies
Sigmar the ubber-Humie kicks ass and becomes friend of the stunties
Humies grow up and become strong'n sh*t
Humies fight off Nagash who's coming back
There's other humies a bit around (Empire=Holy Roman Empire c.1500, Bretonnia=French Kingdom c.1300, Tilea=Italian Merchant Cities c.1450, Estalia= Spain c.1400)
Chaos comes and go a few times, always gets kicked back at the last minute
Orcs come and go, mostly kicked out after terrible plunder
Stunties are a dying race, Rats and Gobbos everywhere
Ogres are somewhere in the East, eating merchants, or being hired as mercs
Oh and there's wood elves in a forest that no one cares about, somewhere in a useless corner of the old world
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:11:50
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Terrifying Doombull
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TanKoL wrote:Ancients come through portals
Ancients create Slanns as gifted students and Lizardmen as workhorses
Ancients play around and create Elfsies, Stunties, Humies, Ogres, Orcs 'n other stuff
Ancients have a party and die of delirium tremens (my interpretation)
Portals go BOOM and Daemons go apeshit on the world
super duper battles Lizzies vs Daemons & Elfsies vs Daemons
World is saved, yay! Portals continue vomiting chaos stuff, booh hiss
Old humies from the sands are kicked in the face by Nagash the ubber necromancer
Nagash cleans house, including supra-sexy vampire chicks
Nagash gets killed by a plot from the superior and brilliant (and modest) Skavens, but he's undead, he doesn't care that much
Elfsies and Stunties fight because they're all super arrogant
Elfsies leave the Old World
Elfisies enjoy themselves too much, hello dark elfsies
Sigmar the ubber-Humie kicks ass and becomes friend of the stunties
Humies grow up and become strong'n sh*t
Humies fight off Nagash who's coming back
There's other humies a bit around (Empire=Holy Roman Empire c.1500, Bretonnia=French Kingdom c.1300, Tilea=Italian Merchant Cities c.1450, Estalia= Spain c.1400)
Chaos comes and go a few times, always gets kicked back at the last minute
Orcs come and go, mostly kicked out after terrible plunder
Stunties are a dying race, Rats and Gobbos everywhere
Ogres are somewhere in the East, eating merchants, or being hired as mercs
Oh and there's wood elves in a forest that no one cares about, somewhere in a useless corner of the old world
This sums it really up if a somewhat shortend, its all a real meatgrinder really
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:24:52
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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does it have the same morale ambiguity of 40k, or are there "good guys" and "bad guys" respectively lol.
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Wyzilla wrote:
Because Plague Marines have the evasion abilities of a drunk elephant.
Burn the Heretic
Kill the mutant
Purge the Unclean |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:29:35
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Terrifying Doombull
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raiden wrote:does it have the same morale ambiguity of 40k, or are there "good guys" and "bad guys" respectively lol.
Well you have those like The Empire whom is more or less the good guys alongside High Elfs, Dwarfs and Bretonnia to a certain degree. They all oppose evil and figth to keep it in check/ win so yes, they can be considerd good guys. While the bad guys like Skaven, Chaos( both mortals & daemons are 100% evil) and the Ogres whom just eats anything. Then you have the likes of the undead and Dark Elfs alongside Chaos dwarfs whom is only capabel of being evil. being compasinate dose not excists in theri vocabulary let alone emotinal aspect.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:34:54
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Servoarm Flailing Magos
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Technically there is, like Trondheim says, a light side and a dark side.
But... come on. These guys belong to the "light side"
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:37:08
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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yay for the french king Arthur! lol
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Wyzilla wrote:
Because Plague Marines have the evasion abilities of a drunk elephant.
Burn the Heretic
Kill the mutant
Purge the Unclean |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:45:00
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Annoying Groin Biter
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Hey! The ogres aren't evil, just hungry. We are a neutral race who will work with or for anyone so long as they can pay with either food or gold.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:52:06
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Terrifying Doombull
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Well yes, faith can make some people behave in a strange manner. The different army books & the BRB helps flesh out the world a s whole if one should happen to read the fluff in them all.
And as for the ligth/dark side, it should be noted that all the factions in WHFB are far from innocent when it comes to atrotices to those around them. I mean just look at the Empire, where they have witch hunters that do a important but still horrid job in rooting out all sorts of things, but also have the ability to judge anyone as aheretic or deviant by their word alone. Then you have the High Elfs whom would rather sacrifice anyone to save a single High Elf most of the time
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 16:55:59
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Agile Revenant Titan
In the Casualty section of a Blood Bowl dugout
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I think there's more clear-cut good vs bad in WHFB than in 40k. I know there's been some (very interesting) threads an arguments about how there's no "good" race in 40k, or how Nids are actually the most moral race. Which is true in a way, since every faction in 40k wants the galaxy for themselves, whereas in WHFB it's more that the good guys don't want the world to be covered in chaos/war, and the bad guys do.
But even in the "good side", there's a lot of potential infighting. As a few examples: Wood Elves are generally untrustworthy of everyone, and will attack any intruder. There's a lot of tension between HE and Dwarves, thanks to a certain war in the past. And I think there's a fair bit of tension/warmongering between The Empire and Bretonnia, or even just in The Empire itself.
As for what's going on? WAR!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/28 17:01:38
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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Long live bretonnia! For the lady! :3.
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Wyzilla wrote:
Because Plague Marines have the evasion abilities of a drunk elephant.
Burn the Heretic
Kill the mutant
Purge the Unclean |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/30 14:24:04
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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That's a pretty good description above. Though to help I think you should have used the real names since he's new. If you called the 40K emperor dead guy all the time it wouldn't help someone who didn't know the game.
My take.
-Before everything there were dragons, dragon ogres, and a handful of other races.
-Old Ones are star-faring race and they come to "fix" the planet. They literally move the planet in it's orbit. Dragons go to sleep because of change in temperature.
-Old Ones create a bunch of different races, Lizardmen as their right hands (mostly Slann, super-intelligent mages they created to help them), Elves, Dwarves, Humans. As the Old Ones fear chaos rising, they create Halflings and Ogres. Some say those were done in haste.
-The Old Ones ordered mass exterminations of some of the pre-existing races on the world, using the Lizardmen Saurus to do this.
-No one knows (I think) where orcs come from. No, it's not fungus, that's 40K.
-No one knows why/how but the portals that brought he Old Ones here collapse. One portal becomes an entire moon in the sky made out of warpstone.
-The explosions blew a whole straight into the Realm of Chaos (warp) and a bazillion daemons pour out.
-Daemons are eventually fought back and the holes to the Realm of Chaos are somewhat weakened, but the wind of chaos flows over the land like it had never done before.
From there the other are "races" created in more mundane ways.
-Humans split into Empire (kinda like guard/space marine culture, grimdark); bretonians (king arthur lameness); Warriors of Chaos, who live in the north and worship the chaos gods and get mutated.
-Beastmen are some animals/human/whatevers that were born due to the increase of chaos in the world. The chaos moon and such. Generally humanoid.
-Skaven are mutated ratmen who maybe worship a daemon, but certainly have a lot to do with chaos. They use warpstone (the stuff of the chaos moon) to power their creations.
-Elves split into wood elves, high elves, dark elves. Which are at least somewhat self explanatory.
-Dwarfs split into normal and Chaos dwarfs. Which are at least somewhat self explanatory.
-Humans to the south had an "old" (though still pretty new) empire, got turned into skeletons by the first necromancer Nagash. Those are Tomb Kings based on Egyptian lore.
-Other humans get turned into vampires.
There is good/evil/neutral. Generally anything chaosy is evil. And dark elves. And vampires. But really the prime shaker is chaos. When you have immortals trying to destroy your planet, they, and anything that works with them, are easy to pin as the bad guys. If you're not trying to destroy the planet, you get a lot of leeway. Ogres raid villages and massacre people all the time, eating them whole. They are considered neutral...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/30 19:16:01
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Infiltrating Hawwa'
Through the looking glass
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A little perspective on ogres. Also note this all comes from the last book, not the new one, so some of the finer details are a bit sketchy to me.
You have ogres, herding animals and all that good stuff. Acting pretty much like normal humans, if a bit on the ogrish side. One day, this comet hits the planet, only it's not quite a comet. Whatever it is, it hit the world and kept going until it got through to the other side. On one side in an area of particular desolation is a massive ringed maw. Kind of like the worm things from star wars that take forever to eat you. On the other side of the world is this giant whirlpool (it popped out in an ocean) that is known to consume just about everything it can grab.
Somehow, the maw began to exert control over the ogres. I recall a large group of them set forth to investigate it, and all but one of them died. The survivor became the chief prophet of the maw or some such. Anyways, as it took control of the ogres, the maw began to pass on a particular trait of itself to them, being eternal hunger. So now, all the ogres live in a perpetual state of starvation, and with their bodies the way they are, they can eat practically anything, but prefer flesh and such to rocks and swords and such.
When they're hired as mercs, they're paid in food. When they ransack villages, it's because their starving. The reason ogres are migrating, and thus coming into contact with the empire and all manner of other armies, is because they're running out of food. Greasus Goldtooth, the current overtyrant (big boss) of the ogres, is a big greedy ogre who understand rudimentary economics and is morbidly obese, even by ogre standards. He's all about expanding his empire (which isn't terribly evil), so that's another reason the ogres march.
Ogres have no inherent urge to burn and slaughter for the sake of it. It even talks about how they really don't care much for the chaos gods. The only real reason they do what they do is because they are very very hungry. That doesn't scream evil to me, and it's not exactly righteous either. Labeling them neutral was a good decision.
As for vampire counts, an interesting thing to note that is talked about in the Gortrek and Felix novels is that for the most part vampires do not want to conquer the world and bury it's inhabitants in seas of blood and undead. Quite the contrary, most are happy to just be left alone. and be happy with the little pocket kingdoms they keep in secret. Sadly, if the latest book is anything to go by, vampires consist of Carstiens and Strigoi ghoul kings, which is a bit sad.
Carstiens - Basically Dracula rip offs. The bloodline is known to carry madness.
Strigoi - Arrogant vamps who had their home kingdon destroyed by orcs. Shunned by other vampires because of their earlier arrogance. Had to feed on corpses and ghouls to survive. Lost their minds and because hulking horrific beasts that lurk in graveyards.
Lahmians - Mostly female vamps that use subtlety and charm abilities to get what they want.
Necrarchs - Basically liches. Vampires that spend all their time researching necromancy, hate living things, etc. etc.
Vampires are most assuredly evil, but I find it saddening how...dumbed down they made them in the army book.
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“Sometimes I can hear my bones straining under the weight of all the lives I'm not living.”
― Jonathan Safran Foer |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/30 19:17:06
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Gavin Thorpe
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The explanations already listed are perfectly valid. I'll throw in some more specific origins:
Elves-
Created by the Old Ones and taught magic by the Slaan, created one of the first empires alongside Dwarfs and Lizardmen. When the polar gates collapsed, it was these 3 empires who defended the world from Chaos since mankind was still at a tribal level. The Elves arguably 'won' the war by creating a magic vortex to drain the polar gates and effectively starve the Daemons of magic. With the disappearance of the Old Ones, they took to exploring the world.
They forged good friendship with the Dwarfs and established colonies far away from home. However upon the death of their King, they denied the throne to his son due to his aggressive manner and wanted a more peaceful king. The Prince accepted this but held onto the insult and over the course of centuries, planned to take his throne back. This led to the Dark Elves and subsequent civil war, with the DE following the 'true' king and the HE following the one elected in his place. Ultimately the HE win and after a failed attempt to destroy the Elven home continent, the DE retreat. Cue long, long years of war between the 2 nations.
The Wood Elves would not be created until after the wars with the Dwarfs.
Dwarfs-
One of the 3 initial empires, based in the Old World. Fought against the Daemons and used to have a good friendship with the Elves. However due to the distance from the Elven homeland, they were not aware that the Elves had a civil war. The Dark Elves launched raids against Dwarf caravans which the Dwarfs assumed to be the High Elves betraying them. When the Dwarfs demanded an apology, Elven pride led to a perceived war-crime against the Dwarfs and subsequently launched the War of Vengeance / War of the Beard.
The Dwarfs absolutely wrecked the Elves. Many of the Old World colonies were destroyed and when the Elven King intervened directly, he was killed and his crown stolen as a trophy. After losing the King the Elves were forced to abandon the colonies and return home to defend against the Dark Elves, leading to the formation of the Wood Elves as settlers who refused to leave.
The Dwarf empire was largely shattered by earthquakes and geological alteration by the Lizardmen, allowing hordes of Greenskins to pour forth into the Old World. They are now on the decline, trapped between the Skaven and the Greenskins.
Humans-
Created by the Old Ones but not mature enough to fight against the Daemons. During this war the tribes of men were hunted and generally prey to the Daemons. Following their defeat, the tribes of men grew strong with the first human empire arising in Nehekhara (Egypt). Obsessed with defeating death, this empire invested a huge amount of effort into immortality through the Mortuary Cult of Liche Priests. One of this order would come to master death and went to war against Nehekhara, leading legions of the undead. Though he was defeated, he later returned and effectively killed off the entire region. This then led to the revival of the Tomb Kings.
Further north, the human tribes eventually produced heroes like Gilles le Breton and Sigmar Heldenhammer, who would fight off neighbouring Beastmen and Orcs to start raising cities. These then grew into Bretonnia and the Empire respectively, though other nations exist such as Cathay, Tilea, Estalia and Araby.
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WarOne wrote:
At the very peak of his power, Mat Ward stood at the top echelons of the GW hierarchy, second only to Satan in terms of personal power within the company. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/11/30 22:07:46
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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TanKoL wrote:Ancients come through portals
Ancients create Slanns as gifted students and Lizardmen as workhorses
Ancients play around and create Elfsies, Stunties, Humies, Ogres, Orcs 'n other stuff
Ancients have a party and die of delirium tremens (my interpretation)
Portals go BOOM and Daemons go apeshit on the world
super duper battles Lizzies vs Daemons & Elfsies vs Daemons
World is saved, yay! Portals continue vomiting chaos stuff, booh hiss
Old humies from the sands are kicked in the face by Nagash the ubber necromancer
Nagash cleans house, including supra-sexy vampire chicks
Nagash gets killed by a plot from the superior and brilliant (and modest) Skavens, but he's undead, he doesn't care that much
Elfsies and Stunties fight because they're all super arrogant
Elfsies leave the Old World
Elfisies enjoy themselves too much, hello dark elfsies
Sigmar the ubber-Humie kicks ass and becomes friend of the stunties
Humies grow up and become strong'n sh*t
Humies fight off Nagash who's coming back
There's other humies a bit around (Empire=Holy Roman Empire c.1500, Bretonnia=French Kingdom c.1300, Tilea=Italian Merchant Cities c.1450, Estalia= Spain c.1400)
Chaos comes and go a few times, always gets kicked back at the last minute
Orcs come and go, mostly kicked out after terrible plunder
Stunties are a dying race, Rats and Gobbos everywhere
Ogres are somewhere in the East, eating merchants, or being hired as mercs
Oh and there's wood elves in a forest that no one cares about, somewhere in a useless corner of the old world
for some reason, I could hear this in that girl's voice who did the 'get you up to date" spiel between several of the seasons of Lost.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/01 00:22:25
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Ogres weren't nice. They started invading Cathay and eating Cathayans. That MYSTERIOUSLY led to the maw comet descending and killing like 2/3rds of them and giving them perpetual hunger-belly.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/03 01:32:03
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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The Conquerer
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
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And nobody claimed they were nice. Just not evil. And they were only raiding Cathey because they were running out of food on the steppes, it wasn't because they were greedy. They were simply running out of food. They weren't even cannibalistic before the Maw came.
They're really just hungry, and will do whatever gets them a good meal.
They are practical in that quest too. If they'll get more food by demanding tribute from a village than just eating it they'll just demand tribute. And only eat the villagers if they don't pay up.
At worst, ogres are just a bunch of single minded bullies that want one thing. And they'll sell out to the highest bidder to get that one thing.
At the moment, there is fixing to be another great migration for Ogres as the mountains are approaching the limit of how many ogres can be supported. So tribes have begun migrating out into the rest of the world in greater numbers, aided by maneaters which have returned from the wide world with knowledge of where good food is.
Neutral is the perfect description of Ogres. Just give them food, preferably red meat. And if you screw them over in the deal they'll be just as happy to eat you instead.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/03 01:35:21
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
MURICA!!! IN SPESS!!! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/03 02:52:02
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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No, it doesn't say the poor ogres only left the steppes cuz they were hungry. It says it was only a matter of time. Couple this with the line that some of them "acquired a preference for Cathayan flesh." You could say it was only a matter of time because they didn't have food or...it was simply an easy food source. Walking over and grabbing a lot of weedy little humans to eat sure is a lot less time consuming (and boring) than herding.
I mean our own history has a lot of barbarian invaders who COULD have become miners and herders and farmers and artisans, but they found it was easier to invade and steal from the cultures that did those things.
Neutral is the perfect description of Ogres. Just give them food, preferably red meat.
Really, it's not a good description. Because at the rear of their mercenary nature is the fact that they will eat YOU if you don't pay. Neutral is looking out for yourself. But Ogres are by nature malevolent. A mercenary will work for whomever pays him. But they stop being mercenaries if they walk into a city and say if you don't pay me, we'll kill you all, then they're just invaders. And invaders aren't neutral, they aren't passive, they're active. That's O&G. You could call WoC neutral if your only criteria is that they're ultimately looking out for themselves and you don't take into consideration the consequences they have on others. It's just that Ogres are far less evil than the true evil races. But if your village was raided by Beastmen, Ogres, O&G, or WoC, maybe there would be more torture with Beastmen/ WoC, but you'd still end up just as dead in every case.
I mean, think of it in modern terms. If you ran a store and the mob came to you and said you had to pay protection money every month, that's not neutral. It's pretty aggressively criminal. If they said you had to pay protection money every month or they would eat you and your family, that's REALLY not neutral.
For TK, you generally had to have done something for them to invade you. That is a passive/reactive aggression. And far more neutral.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/04 15:19:19
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Annoying Groin Biter
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I think that you have to take into account that the Warhammer split is not really good vs evil. Its Order vs Destruction, which is quite different. The forces of destruction really do (for the most part) want the world as a smoldering ruin whereas the forces of Order want to prevent that from happeneing and build something of lasting worth.
When you look at it from that way, the Ogre's neutrality makes a lot more sense. The ogres do not want the world in ruins, as that would completely destroy their food supply. But they also don't really have any interest in building anything of lasting worth so Order isnt really a good fit either.
Add to that their willingness to work for anyone, and you have a pretty solidly neutral race as Warhammer defines the conflict.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 06:35:40
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Well, the one I don't get along those lines is orks. Ogres being a race devoted to what basically amounts to organized crime betrays the ability to possess malice. Or at least the ability to do evil on others for your own benefit on purpose. Which still sounds evil to me.
Orcs, on the other hand, are merely pre-programmed to fight. They fight humans and elves, but more often than not, they're fighting amongst themselves. It's just an instinct that they're carrying out. And it's not to be confused with the desire to inflict violence on others either, because once their opponents give up and stop fighting, the orcs stop attacking them.
You could say that orcs and ogres are merely slaking their instincts. The difference, though, is one of method and purpose.
I mean, if orcs are evil then tornadoes or landslides are evil. They're forces of nature unencumbered by moralism.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 07:59:44
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Sniping Hexa
Dublin
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Orcs won't stop fighting if you don't give them a good fight, they will still pillage, burn and generally wreak havoc, they will merely murder all your loved ones on the way to the next big fight
Also Orcs can't be bought as easily as Ogres. If they are, it's only "cuz it's a cunnin' plan of Da Boss!" to backstab (with a huge choppa) their erstwhile employers
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 09:58:16
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Tornados aren't intelligent. If you could have a playable race of hurricanes, typhoons, gusts, blizzards, landslides, they would be pure evil/destruction. But you can't.
You can't sit Orcs down on a psychoanalysts's couch and ask why he barshes. A lesser daemon is even less in control than any Orc. It's basically just a mindless fragment from its lord. There will never be Bloodletters running a gift shop at Disneyland.
But yeah Order and Destruction is a better view. I can't see it ever coming into Ogres' minds to actually destroy everything. I mean, why? They did knock down the sky titan castles, but they were at war. You just don't see them, after they raid a village, putting it to the torch. Everyone still might be dead, but why burn it down?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 10:00:27
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Regular Dakkanaut
Cardiff, South Wales
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I've had this debate before and I think that the Orcs (of the warhammer world) are not evil. They are merely following their nature and are no more evil than a crocodile. Like the crocodile they are aggressive and will attack should the need arrise. I'm sure I heard somewhere (thinking about it, this fact might come from an Adam Sandler film so may not be entirely accurate) that crocodiles are aggressive because they have a small medula oblongata. My theory is that Orcs have a smaller medula oblongata than even crocs hence their extremely aggressive nature. Couple that aggressive nature with low intelligence and you have a couple of people I went to school with. I wouldn't call them evil so cannot call Orcs evil. (Also, the medula Oblongata controls the need to vomit which might explain troll behaviour).
They are a force of Destruction rather than order and so fit in that bracket perfectly.
However, Goblins are evil as they are sneaky and want an under empire. By that logic, if skaven are evil so too are Goblins.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 16:21:23
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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The Conquerer
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
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Crocs aren't aggressive persay. Its just that anything and everything that moves is on their menu. This could be read as aggression but its not. its simply hunting. Being ambush predators their instinct is to grab anything that moves within striking distance.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/05 16:21:41
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
MURICA!!! IN SPESS!!! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/05 23:00:16
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos
Lake Forest, California, South Orange County
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TanKoL wrote:Ancients come through portals
Ancients create Slanns as gifted students and Lizardmen as workhorses
Ancients play around and create Elfsies, Stunties, Humies, Ogres, Orcs 'n other stuff
Ancients have a party and die of delirium tremens (my interpretation)
Portals go BOOM and Daemons go apeshit on the world
super duper battles Lizzies vs Daemons & Elfsies vs Daemons
World is saved, yay! Portals continue vomiting chaos stuff, booh hiss
Old humies from the sands are kicked in the face by Nagash the ubber necromancer
Nagash cleans house, including supra-sexy vampire chicks
Nagash gets killed by a plot from the superior and brilliant (and modest) Skavens, but he's undead, he doesn't care that much
Elfsies and Stunties fight because they're all super arrogant
Elfsies leave the Old World
Elfisies enjoy themselves too much, hello dark elfsies
Sigmar the ubber-Humie kicks ass and becomes friend of the stunties
Humies grow up and become strong'n sh*t
Humies fight off Nagash who's coming back
There's other humies a bit around (Empire=Holy Roman Empire c.1500, Bretonnia=French Kingdom c.1300, Tilea=Italian Merchant Cities c.1450, Estalia= Spain c.1400)
Chaos comes and go a few times, always gets kicked back at the last minute
Orcs come and go, mostly kicked out after terrible plunder
Stunties are a dying race, Rats and Gobbos everywhere
Ogres are somewhere in the East, eating merchants, or being hired as mercs
Oh and there's wood elves in a forest that no one cares about, somewhere in a useless corner of the old world
This made me smile. Although Dark Elves showed up before the stuntie wars, as Malekith is the one who incited that nonsense through deception.
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"Bryan always said that if the studio ever had to mix with the manufacturing and sales part of the business it would destroy the studio. And I have to say – he wasn’t wrong there! ... It’s become the promotions department of a toy company." -- Rick Priestly
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/06 08:23:40
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Sniping Hexa
Dublin
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It's not "nonsense"! The pointy-eared finally got kicked from the Old World, "US Go Home" and all that! :p
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/06 17:46:03
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Excellent Exalted Champion of Chaos
Lake Forest, California, South Orange County
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Let's not forget the last decade of events though!
Chaos attacked the Humies, an Orc somehow won that fight and wandered off when there was nothing left to win.
A goblin stole a crown and no one knows what happened to it.
GW retconned both of these events out of the updated army books!
This is great news!
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"Bryan always said that if the studio ever had to mix with the manufacturing and sales part of the business it would destroy the studio. And I have to say – he wasn’t wrong there! ... It’s become the promotions department of a toy company." -- Rick Priestly
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/13 21:14:35
Subject: Re:Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Silver_skates wrote:I've had this debate before and I think that the Orcs (of the warhammer world) are not evil.
No one in any game is evil. Evil is an absurd term that has no place in psychology. That's what annoys me when politicians call a country evil or things evil. No one wakes up and says, "I'm going to do some evil today," unless they are literally insane. In which case they probably won't be doing much evil because they are nuts and won't be able to function properly in a non-insane world; they'll be too busy running into walls and swatting away phantom pterodactyls. That's the level of legal insanity in the US: the inability to distinguish right from wrong. Like, chopping off a random little old lady's head in front of everyone is no different from walking across the street. It's doubtful any but the most truly disturbed people in history have ever qualified for that classification. Most serial killers are "merely" sociopaths. I.e., they don't care about others but they know what they are doing is considered wrong by the rest of society so they try and cover their actions so as not to get caught. Even Jack the Ripper did that. Someone like Ed Gein (Psycho) may have been.
Evil in terms of game terms and anything practical, however, for intelligent life is them knowing they are hurting others and don't care. That's almost the definition of Dark Elves, Orks, Dark Dwarfs, etc. Sociopaths who are also sadistic. Like a whole race of serial killers who have the freedom, because they are an entire race, of not doing their actions in disguise. They aren't truly evil, because again, no one is evil--at least in terms of modern day earth psychology terms. Maybe in fantasy worlds beings really do wake up and think what evil they will do today, but that's still pretty much a sadistic sociopath who has the luxury of being open about it.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/13 22:12:16
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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If you kill for pleasure you are evil in my book.
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Wyzilla wrote:
Because Plague Marines have the evasion abilities of a drunk elephant.
Burn the Heretic
Kill the mutant
Purge the Unclean |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/12/14 12:39:54
Subject: Alright, What's Going on in the WHFB World?
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Cosmic Joe
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TanKoL wrote:Ancients come through portals
Ancients create Slanns as gifted students and Lizardmen as workhorses
Ancients play around and create Elfsies, Stunties, Humies, Ogres, Orcs 'n other stuff
Ancients have a party and die of delirium tremens (my interpretation)
Portals go BOOM and Daemons go apeshit on the world
super duper battles Lizzies vs Daemons & Elfsies vs Daemons
World is saved, yay! Portals continue vomiting chaos stuff, booh hiss
Old humies from the sands are kicked in the face by Nagash the ubber necromancer
Nagash cleans house, including supra-sexy vampire chicks
Nagash gets killed by a plot from the superior and brilliant (and modest) Skavens, but he's undead, he doesn't care that much
Elfsies and Stunties fight because they're all super arrogant
Elfsies leave the Old World
Elfisies enjoy themselves too much, hello dark elfsies
Sigmar the ubber-Humie kicks ass and becomes friend of the stunties
Humies grow up and become strong'n sh*t
Humies fight off Nagash who's coming back
There's other humies a bit around (Empire=Holy Roman Empire c.1500, Bretonnia=French Kingdom c.1300, Tilea=Italian Merchant Cities c.1450, Estalia= Spain c.1400)
Chaos comes and go a few times, always gets kicked back at the last minute
Orcs come and go, mostly kicked out after terrible plunder
Stunties are a dying race, Rats and Gobbos everywhere
Ogres are somewhere in the East, eating merchants, or being hired as mercs
Oh and there's wood elves in a forest that no one cares about, somewhere in a useless corner of the old world
That's pretty much right except for the orcs part.
They weren't created by the old ones, orcs where native to the warhammer world before they arrived, one of the few races to still be around from back then on account of them being so incredibly resilient the lizardmen couldn't exterminate them a task the saurus accomplished successfully many other times.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/14 12:41:45
Nosebiter wrote:Codex Space Marine is renamed as Codex Counts As Because I Dont Like To Loose And Gw Hates My Army. |
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