Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Okay, this is frustrating. Everytime I think I have it figured out it backfires. I finally have a matt varnish that gives good results and then suddenly "frosting".

I've used almost every brand possible, spraycan, airbrush, vallejo, testors, gw, etc.

I've painted when it was hot & humid, hot & dry, cold & dry, cold & wet, normal weather, etc. No consistancy whatsoever!

The only consistancy that I could find is that almost every spraycan paint or varnish will become rippled or cloudy when applying on a rainy day.

Anyone that can help?

(ps. I have found that I can also achieve that nice glossy/matt effect by airbrushing a layer of 50/50 airbrush cleaner/flow improver on my models, but offcourse this does not provide the protection varnish provides.)

Testors dullcoat. Only. Ever. Always.

Dullcote doesn't have much in the way of protection though. It's great at making things look...dull though

I can recommend krylon or rustoleum matte coats, never had frosting issues with those. I use the krylon exclusively now and its very good.

Follow it up with some dullcote to get the best matte finish. You could also try a satin varnish and chase it with dullcote.

Good to know. I spent a week painting a squad of Destroyers to a high standard and threw on the protective gloss coats and finalized it with Army Painter Matt spray. Yeah. I chunked the matt spray after all my guys are now frosted with a light frost.

Figure Flat from testors works pretty good too. Havent tried the krylon yet.

I would stay away from anything with Army Painter on it. I used to use their white primer all the time and not only was it horribly overpriced, but always produced a chalky, gunky, nasty finish no matter what weather conditions I used or how long I shook the can for, and also scraped off very easily.

That's just me though.

So here is how I do it with great results that protects.

1. Gloss Coat.
2. Gloss Coat
3. Matte Varnish
4. Matte Varnish if needed.

I use testors and its the best stuff ever.

 Cave_Dweller wrote:
Dullcote doesn't have much in the way of protection though.

From chainsaws, yeah, it's a bit lacking. As far as matte varnishes and reasonable wear go, though, conventional wisdom and my own experience suggest that it's firmly on the resilient side of the spectrum. Are you speaking from personal experience? I could see forming that opinion if, due to the effectiveness of the matting agent, you ended up applying much less of the product than you would of an equivalent matte acrylic. With the same final thickness, I've found pure Dullcote to be every bit as beefy as acrylic gloss dusted with Dullcote.

I tend to restrict it to a final, thin coat, as well, but because it's expensive, not because it's weak.

 oadie wrote:

 Cave_Dweller wrote:
Dullcote doesn't have much in the way of protection though.

From chainsaws, yeah, it's a bit lacking. As far as matte varnishes and reasonable wear go, though, conventional wisdom and my own experience suggest that it's firmly on the resilient side of the spectrum. Are you speaking from personal experience? I could see forming that opinion if, due to the effectiveness of the matting agent, you ended up applying much less of the product than you would of an equivalent matte acrylic. With the same final thickness, I've found pure Dullcote to be every bit as beefy as acrylic gloss dusted with Dullcote.

I tend to restrict it to a final, thin coat, as well, but because it's expensive, not because it's weak.

Yeah I use dullcote constantly and it doesn't match up to a good matte varnish IMO. And it's not really designed to be a protective varnish, it's meant to bring the shine down on whatever you use. And it's expensive for a small can, for that price you can buy 2x as much matte.

Well, that's my 2 cents and your milage may vary

I love Dullcoat, but cant stand the smell, and it tends to be a bit too flat for my taste.

These days I use Liquitex Matte and Gloss varnishes through the airbrush.
The Matte goes on very well and I have never had any frosting issues regardless of weather.

The gloss goes on smooth, and by controlling the spray, I can use it as a semi-gloss as well

Frosting can happen for causes other than temperature and humidity. The biggest fault I have that causes it is spraying a second coat before the first is fully dry. Usually it happens to me when spraying from multiple angles, the overspray from the second angle gets on the surface I just hit with the first pass.

Liquidtex matte.
Future floor polish. Most resilient stuff I've ever seen. I did 2 coats of the stuff on a test model after painting it and the only way I found I could scratch it was with a knife.

I will never use Vallejo again as it stuffed up a imperial guard basilisk. That I spent about 15 hours on for a commission.

Regards



James

MillertimeRC wrote:
Frosting can happen for causes other than temperature and humidity. The biggest fault I have that causes it is spraying a second coat before the first is fully dry. Usually it happens to me when spraying from multiple angles, the overspray from the second angle gets on the surface I just hit with the first pass.

This! Also use thin coats. Be careful about slathering the stuff on.

I also always gloss coat it first for protection. I also seem to get less frosting this way. Shake the can for no less than 2 mins. You also might be holding the can too far away. It can partially dry in the air and cause the frosting effect.

MillertimeRC wrote:
Frosting can happen for causes other than temperature and humidity. The biggest fault I have that causes it is spraying a second coat before the first is fully dry. Usually it happens to me when spraying from multiple angles, the overspray from the second angle gets on the surface I just hit with the first pass.

Interesting, ill pay attention to that!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Rabid Ferret wrote:

MillertimeRC wrote:
Frosting can happen for causes other than temperature and humidity. The biggest fault I have that causes it is spraying a second coat before the first is fully dry. Usually it happens to me when spraying from multiple angles, the overspray from the second angle gets on the surface I just hit with the first pass.

This! Also use thin coats. Be careful about slathering the stuff on.

I also always gloss coat it first for protection. I also seem to get less frosting this way. Shake the can for no less than 2 mins. You also might be holding the can too far away. It can partially dry in the air and cause the frosting effect.

I would assume the gloss coat creates a smoother surface for the dull coat to settle on. Shaking the can for 2 minutes and distance, stuff i'll take into account!

Everything said above plus. If you are applying decals. Always put gloss before and after the decal before applying matt varnish or it will frost.
I always use Tamya TS-80 matt spray. The only time I get frosting is when I put too much on in one spot.

Cheers Vim

I've never had a problem with Dullcote, in terms of frosting nor poor protection.

I have had a matte disaster when I sprayed in a basement with some other brand. I was able to fix it will brush on dullcote.

Worst comes to worst, you could always just use brush on.

For protection, gloss cote.

Dullcote to take the shine away.

How I've done it since the 80s. Dullcote is fine for static models that don't get played with, but gaming pieces get a lot more wear and tear on the paint than a static model EVER will.

I use the anti shine varnish and found it frosts often.

If you put the can (assuming aerosol) in warm water for 30-45 seconds (should be slightly warm to the touch) I found it doesn't frost at all.

Just be careful that the water isn't boiling or you leave it in too long.

Is it humid in France now? You will see frosting in times of high humidity as well or if there's even a hint of moisture left in the paint. And yes. Gloss. Decal. Gloss. Dull coat. In that order, allowing plenty of dry time.