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2013/12/22 23:14:54
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
I've been thinking for a while about creating a themed IG army, that of probably just a rebellious force in control of just part of a planet, if not an entire planet. I think playing 40k we sometimes lose sense of scale, and get caught up in the exceptional and arrogant lives of space marines etc. An IG force doesn't have to represent a sector, or an entire planet, or even a whole continent.
Given the behaviour of the impirium, there must be regular rebellions arising from all the discontent, but the only ones I've come across have had something to do with chaos. After my first nid army, I decided to start a space marine army and read through a bunch of the fluff; there were very few space marine chapters who I could stand. I went with Space Wolves, who seem to treat people honourably, but they still couldn't do anything about the aftermath on Armageddon. All the people they had fought alongside with on Armageddon were either killed or got sterilised and sent to forced labour camps by the administratum. I want to create a force that represent the tragedy of the lives of the average human in the 40k universe.
I realise that any rebellion is going to be short lived, as it'll be either crushed by the impirium or at best go undetected and eventually destroyed by some other faction. But that's what I want to represent, I think the notion of a hopeful but ultimately doomed rebellion is quite a romantic one, it'd be a force I could actually sympathise with, it's entirely likely within the setting, and it's inevitable destruction is totally grimdark.
My question is: Is there any precedent for this in the lore anywhere? I can't remember reading about any rebellions which had innocent motivations (i.e. not psykers going mental, or daemonic possession, or a genestealer cult). Has anyone got any links to similar things people have done? Short stories, pictures, anything really.
Any input, criticism, ideas on background/list/painting, anything relevant is greatly appreciated.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/23 00:22:09
2013/12/23 00:21:09
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Empire
Personally I think if you are going for a sympathetic but doomed rebellion that could be shoe horned into the 40k world you cannot do any better than the Hungarian revolution:
I don't think it'd be that possible however. Nearly every single rebellion I've read about in the fluff either is spawned by Chaos or eventually is associated with Chaos. The only time I found otherwise was in Death of Antagonis, only the rebels had their faith in the Emperor restored by the Black Dragons and a Canoness.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
2013/12/25 17:22:40
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
Wyzilla wrote: I don't think it'd be that possible however. Nearly every single rebellion I've read about in the fluff either is spawned by Chaos or eventually is associated with Chaos. The only time I found otherwise was in Death of Antagonis, only the rebels had their faith in the Emperor restored by the Black Dragons and a Canoness.
Not true, the Age of Apostasy was on of the biggest rebellion/civil wars fought in the history of the IOM and it had no direct connection with chaos. In fact you could argue the rebellion was led by the emperor. Also the older Tau codexes made reference to Tau sponsored rebellions.
The entire backstory of the Death Korps of Krieg is about a rebellion where the planet's rulers renounced their faith in the Imperium and without later carving an eight-point star in their foreheads.
Secular (as in not to do with Imperial/Chaos alignment) rebellions are very feasible. They're just not known for lasting too long, due to the Imperial war assets being guaranteed to outnumber the rebels usually at a ratio of 1,000,000,000:1.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/25 18:27:38
The Kasrkin were just men. It made their actions all the more astonishing. Six white blurs, they fell upon the cultists, lasguns barking at close range. They wasted no shots. One shot, one kill. - Eisenhorn: Malleus
2013/12/25 18:41:37
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
Non-chaos rebellion happens so often that it's a non-issue. It's so common that there's no real reason to make mention of it. Usually it's something either the local PDF can handle or at most a regiment or two of Imperial Guard are requested. If the rebellion is against the local government and the new regime is willing to maintain the tithes, than the Imperium doesn't even bother.
Your best sources for this would be the Only War books as one of the primary enemies in that region is a large-scale non-chaos rebellion called the Severan Dominate.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/25 21:42:47
2013/12/26 02:08:34
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
The early stages of the vraksian rebellion could also fall under this umbrella - while the planet later fell to chaos, the initial heresy was merely commited by a power-hungry man of the Ecclesiarchy.
Currently not in posession of any armies - I merely theorycraft and discuss background,
Waiting for HH Book 6 so I can start an Imperial Army army.
2013/12/26 02:17:24
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
Deadeight wrote: Any input, criticism, ideas on background/list/painting, anything relevant is greatly appreciated.
The Badad War was for the most part completely non-Chaos. Huron only turned to the Dark Gods when his side started losing badly. Even so, he was far from a fully corrupted Chaos Lord. I believe he truly fell to Chaos only after he entered the Maelstrom.
There's fluff in the Fantasy Flight RPG books about the Severan Dominate, a non-Chaos secessionist movement
Zookie wrote: Not true, the Age of Apostasy was on of the biggest rebellion/civil wars fought in the history of the IOM and it had no direct connection with chaos. In fact you could argue the rebellion was led by the emperor. Also the older Tau codexes made reference to Tau sponsored rebellions.
Indeed, Goge Vandire's attempt to reign as sole dictator of the Imperium caused the second biggest civil war in Imperial history, second only to the Horus Heresy
Your best sources for this would be the Only War books as one of the primary enemies in that region is a large-scale non-chaos rebellion called the Severan Dominate.
Yup, this is what I'd point you toward - there's a bunch of copy/pasted fluff here. The Dominate's hardly what I'd call "innocent", but the Imperium's not exactly on the side of the angels either (except the sort that wear power armor and shoot people in the face). Particularly interesting is the discussion of their allies and battle strategy. Duke Severus is gradually compromising more and more of his principles (those that he had, anyway) to win aid from Dark Eldar pirates and other assorted mercenaries, and has adopted an almost entirely defensive doctrine since he lacks the bottomless resources of the Imperium. He's basically having to give it everything he's got just to stay afloat, what with the Ork Waaaagh! and seriously upset former overlords and half his troops not even being aware that they're actually rebels.
If you can get ahold of it, the Final Testament adventure book has a great deal of Severan Dominate characters and paints one or two in a fairly sympathetic light, although the PCs are still supposed to shoot them.
Spoiler:
Especially after they manipulate them into attacking Imperial targets...
EDIT: Ninja'd on the link!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/26 02:24:23
2013/12/26 16:46:42
Subject: Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
I can't remember in which of the several BL books it was but, these type of conflicts can also be Dark Eldar inspired. I know though that the Ultramarines Omnibus mentions this in it's contents at least somewhere.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/26 16:58:26
Rebel Winter, by Steve Parker, may be what you are looking for. This is the interesting part:
Spoiler:
“Secession — let a single rebel world go unpunished and countless more will rise up, all clamouring for those religious and economic freedoms better known to loyal citizens of the Imperium as heresy and ingratitude.
On Danik’s World, the seeds of rebellion were planted in the deep snows of an ice age that ravaged the planet for two thousand years. It began when volcanic eruptions on the southern continent filled the atmosphere with debris and plunged the land into darkness. The sudden climatic change wiped out over half the human population and reduced planetary productivity to almost nothing. On countless occasions in the years that followed, one loyalist governor after another begged the Administratum for aid. Eventually, the Administratum approved the deferment of Imperial tributes, but more direct aid in the form of food and technologies was repeatedly denied. Imperial coffers, the Danikkin were told, were being drained by anti-xenos campaigns throughout the segmentum.
When Danikkin scientists finally announced the beginning of a slow return to warmer temperatures, the population had climbed to two-thirds of its pre-catastrophe figure. An estimated ninety-three per cent of that population supported open revolt against the Imperium. The central figure behind this movement was Lord General Graush Vanandrasse, High Commander of the Danikkin Planetary Defense Force.
Vanadrasse had spent his life rising through the ranks of the PDF, finally attaining absolute command at the age of sixty-one. Mere months after his accession, he led his forces in a bloody coup against troops loyal to the Planetary Governor. He celebrated victory by renaming his force the Danikkin Independence Army. To ensure absolute loyalty to his vision of planetary independence, he established a brutal organization of elite officers called the Special Patriotic Service.
Agents of this so-called Special Patriotic Service publicly executed the legitimate Planetary Governor and his family, and sent a formal notice of secession to the Administratum.
‘Your warriors will stand down and withdraw, Curze. That is an order, not a request. (…) When this campaign is won, you and I will have words’
Rogal Dorn, just before taking the beating of his life.
from The Dark King, by Graham McNeill.
2013/12/26 19:00:19
Subject: Re:Requesting any reference material on non-chaos rebellions in the Impirium
da001 wrote: Rebel Winter, by Steve Parker, may be what you are looking for. This is the interesting part:
Spoiler:
“Secession — let a single rebel world go unpunished and countless more will rise up, all clamouring for those religious and economic freedoms better known to loyal citizens of the Imperium as heresy and ingratitude.
....heh.
To be fair to the Imperium, most rebellions end up in a regime that's just as bad or worse (like this case or the case of the Severan Dominate. ....just like the real world!)
