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2013/12/29 05:25:31
Subject: W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
The pistol thing is just recycle from the pancake hoax.
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2013/12/29 09:43:50
Subject: W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
I've hardly played 6th, but the rules are a mess and the factions out of balance to the nth degree. I'd welcome a much improved, better tested 7th edition, but I'm not holding my breath it'll be worth the price tag I know will be on the book.
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2013/12/29 14:00:05
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
I've hardly played 6th, but the rules are a mess and the factions out of balance to the nth degree. I'd welcome a much improved, better tested 7th edition, but I'm not holding my breath it'll be worth the price tag I know will be on the book.
Probably £75 base for 7th ed core rulebook, £150 for limited edition version, £200+ for super-platinum-uber-gold-special-limited-edition BRB.
£150 for a starter set that includes a paperback rulebook, and about £75 worth of models. With a total production cost of ~£25.
2013/12/29 14:33:41
Subject: W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
DarthSpader wrote: new edition should get rid of allies, and fix the vehicle rules. modifers to hit moving vehicles should be the biggest one. leave everything else the same.. but get rid of this broken gak allies.
What the new edition needs is real and indepth playtesting. rather than whatever utterly hopeless mehod that they use now. Ever since 3rd edition the basic rules have stayed the same aside from tiny little 'fixes' and modifications; none of which have improved the game to any meaningful degree and result in certain elements becoming dominiant (currently its flyers). The game is stale and it has some fundamental flaws that have been there ever since the demise of 2nd ed, GW has also never been very good at producing a balanced ruleset, no more so than now.
40K's real problem as a wargame is that its rules are loose, badly worded and freqently broken, rigourous play testing would remove all that. Ideally GW would release a public alpha and then a beta version before a finalised release version in order to reach the largest player base that they can. Of course this isn't going to happen.
I wouldn't be that suprised if this rumour turns out to be true, GW has made enough strange decisions in the past and 40k is a far larger seller than fantasy (although its current edition is terrible).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/29 14:35:33
RegalPhantom wrote: If your fluff doesn't fit, change your fluff until it does
The prefect example of someone missing the point.
Do not underestimate the Squats. They survived for millenia cut off from the Imperium and assailed on all sides. Their determination and resilience is an example to us all.
-Leman Russ, Meditations on Imperial Command book XVI (AKA the RT era White Dwarf Commpendium).
Its just a shame that they couldn't fight off Andy Chambers.
Warzone Plog
2013/12/29 15:29:46
Subject: W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
40K's real problem as a wargame is that its rules are loose, badly worded and freqently broken, rigourous play testing would remove all that. Ideally GW would release a public alpha and then a beta version before a finalised release version in order to reach the largest player base that they can. Of course this isn't going to happen.
Just to underline this point, I was reading through the new SM book earlier, and I noticed that Pedro Kantor's rules refer specifically to Crimson Fists. The issue being that Crimson Fists don't exist as an entity in the rules (they use Imperial Fists CT) which means that, while there is an obvious interpretation (your blue marines with red bits) there is no strict RAW definition of what consists of a Crimson Fist.
Not going to break the game, but a good example of the sort of needless nonsense that blurs the rules and could be easily be fixed with a little more thought and effort without re-writing the whole game from the ground up.
It's stupid and a waste of Dakka dakka resources. There is no 7th in 2014. It is a consolidated rulebook, that's all.
Source?
Or are you just ranting again because you don't agree?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/29 15:30:20
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
7th Edition... LOL... I cant even afford 6th Edition or find players!
I personally am not sure I want to spend anymore on GW. Been doing it since 1990. I find Bolt Action, X-wing, warmachine, and more importantly spending time with my family a lot more worthwhile than 40k and Fantasy. The cost of the rules alone (Rule set, all the codex... one for every army you have, and supplements) are keeping me from really getting into 6th edition 40k aside from the rules from Dark Vengence and my Chaos Marine Codex... i really dont want to spend 50 bucks a pop on a codex even if hard back or digital. I have far too many armies for 40k and fantasy and I have the rules for the previous editions... some editions i never got to play that much... cause of real life.
I enjoy Bolt Action because you dont have to constantly refer to codex, rules, look for erata (although i know they do have it like GW stuff). It seems more time on table than with nose in book type thing at least so far and X-wing is the same. I am new to warmachine and not sure i really want to get into it that much but i do have some interest in it mainly cause it is most popular in my area at local game store.... and having a army in it good for a pick up game.
On side note i am having fun with Star Wars Edge of the Empire and some of the new 40kRPGs and WFB RPG systems are pretty cool by Fantasy Flight Games. Maybe GW should let Fantasy Flight do 40k and Fantasy rules and they just stick with their model making....
With all that being said... I am thinking of staying 5th Edition with my armies and use Chaos Marines for any 6th Edition games i might have to play... but i really dont see a point in paying 500 dollars plus or minus to get rules, codex, supplements just to possibly play my 40k and fantasy armies. I can put that money towards a lot better things.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/29 15:35:57
"Raise your shield!"
2013/12/29 15:33:20
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
All I know is that it's gonna be one hell of an expensive rulebook, just so you can get one that's not a mess of additional Eratta and FAQ's..
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/29 15:33:49
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should."
2013/12/29 15:41:14
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
AegisGrimm wrote: All I know is that it's gonna be one hell of an expensive rulebook, just so you can get one that's not a mess of additional Eratta and FAQ's..
I agree
"Raise your shield!"
2013/12/29 16:07:32
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Spacewolfoddballz wrote: The cost of the rules alone (Rule set, all the codex... one for every army you have, and supplements) are keeping me from really getting into 6th edition 40k aside from the rules from Dark Vengence and my Chaos Marine Codex... i really dont want to spend 50 bucks a pop on a codex even if hard back or digital.
Most serious gamers no longer buy all of the GW rules. Core rulebook and codex only, basically what you need for a tournament.
And yet these gamers have all of the GW rules, including all FW books. It is a glorious thing, and a great way to give thanks back to GW.
2013/12/29 16:10:52
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Spacewolfoddballz wrote: The cost of the rules alone (Rule set, all the codex... one for every army you have, and supplements) are keeping me from really getting into 6th edition 40k aside from the rules from Dark Vengence and my Chaos Marine Codex... i really dont want to spend 50 bucks a pop on a codex even if hard back or digital.
Most serious gamers no longer buy all of the GW rules. Core rulebook and codex only, basically what you need for a tournament.
And yet these gamers have all of the GW rules, including all FW books. It is a glorious thing, and a great way to give thanks back to GW.
What? You contradicted yourself there.
2013/12/29 16:14:35
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Could this tie into the rumors of GW overhauling their website next year as well? Rumors have already been floating around of GW discontinuing Finecast, moving that production to Forgeworld, and fully incorporating Forgeworld into the GW main website with a complete redo of the online store around Q2 in 2014.
Given GW's increased focus on digital releases (along with the iPad version containing a list builder), could it be that GW's new website will make a big push for digital releases, giving us all the codices and all the rules for digital release (much like WotC did with D&D's online tools). I can easily see GW trying to create a sort of "master app" for mobile devices that allows you to buy various plugins like the rulebook, individual codices, supplements, and even a list builder (and such an app would give them even greater control over the digital distribution of their publications).
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2013/12/29 16:14:58
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Spacewolfoddballz wrote: The cost of the rules alone (Rule set, all the codex... one for every army you have, and supplements) are keeping me from really getting into 6th edition 40k aside from the rules from Dark Vengence and my Chaos Marine Codex... i really dont want to spend 50 bucks a pop on a codex even if hard back or digital.
Most serious gamers no longer buy all of the GW rules. Core rulebook and codex only, basically what you need for a tournament.
And yet these gamers have all of the GW rules, including all FW books. It is a glorious thing, and a great way to give thanks back to GW.
What? You contradicted yourself there.
I could be wrong, but I suspect that he may be talking about the thing that mods don't like us to talk about. That seems to be the most logical explanation.
What I have
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2013/12/29 16:27:44
Subject: Re:W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Tannhauser42 wrote: Could this tie into the rumors of GW overhauling their website next year as well? Rumors have already been floating around of GW discontinuing Finecast, moving that production to Forgeworld, and fully incorporating Forgeworld into the GW main website with a complete redo of the online store around Q2 in 2014.
Given GW's increased focus on digital releases (along with the iPad version containing a list builder), could it be that GW's new website will make a big push for digital releases, giving us all the codices and all the rules for digital release (much like WotC did with D&D's online tools). I can easily see GW trying to create a sort of "master app" for mobile devices that allows you to buy various plugins like the rulebook, individual codices, supplements, and even a list builder (and such an app would give them even greater control over the digital distribution of their publications).
I think that might be beyond rumour now, as much as I acknowledge the fact that Red Shirts are often poorly informed, I mentioned the website thing to our local guy, and far from denying it or pleading ignorance, he seemed quite excited about it, as it means he will be able to sell Forgeworld in store (through the terminal, but it's an option he doesn't have now)
The guy he replaced went on to Nottingham as part of the web team, and I'm fairly sure they have communication still, in some form or another, so this one does have some pedigree behind it.
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
I've hardly played 6th, but the rules are a mess and the factions out of balance to the nth degree. I'd welcome a much improved, better tested 7th edition, but I'm not holding my breath it'll be worth the price tag I know will be on the book.
Probably £75 base for 7th ed core rulebook, £150 for limited edition version, £200+ for super-platinum-uber-gold-special-limited-edition BRB.
£150 for a starter set that includes a paperback rulebook, and about £75 worth of models. With a total production cost of ~£25.
This!
Don't forget the rule changes which require to adjust army lists (at least for competitive play).
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pretre wrote: The pistol thing is just recycle from the pancake hoax.
You could fire pistols in hth prior to 3rd edition. I wouldn't go so far to imply it was original to pancake. I could see it happening, but I am seriously doubtful they will update 40k until 2016.
Palindrome wrote: The game is stale and it has some fundamental flaws that have been there ever since the demise of 2nd ed, GW has also never been very good at producing a balanced ruleset, no more so than now.
It still amazes me GW has stuck with the moronic AP system for so long, it's an inherently unbalanced save system which they've persisted with generation after generation.
2013/12/29 19:06:07
Subject: W40k : rumor of 7th edition for 2014 summer ! How on Earth ?!?
Palindrome wrote: The game is stale and it has some fundamental flaws that have been there ever since the demise of 2nd ed, GW has also never been very good at producing a balanced ruleset, no more so than now.
It still amazes me GW has stuck with the moronic AP system for so long, it's an inherently unbalanced save system which they've persisted with generation after generation.
The issue with armour is that save modifiers don't really work well in a d6 system either (as a veteran of 2nd, everything but TDA was largely irrelevant a lot of the time)
The only fix I've been able to conceive is allowing some sort of immunity, so for instance Terminator's ignore wounds from AP5 or worse weapons, AP4 forces a save, AP2 ignores the armour save, but in an already bloated and over complicated system, I haven't been able to refine it into something I'd consider elegant enough to work well.
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
The issue with armour is that save modifiers don't really work well in a d6 system either (as a veteran of 2nd, everything but TDA was largely irrelevant a lot of the time)
I remember that, but it would work if modifiers were kept small enough.
AP -, 6 and 5 --> 0 AP 4-------------> -1 AP 3 and 2----> -2 AP 1 ------------> -3
(Then terminators could have 1+ save, unmodified, it would work like 2+, but allow 4+ re-roll on a failure.)
You're crediting GW with the ability to show restraint in the face of "Waaagh, 'splosions, Die, Die, Die!!1!" there Crimson, I just can't see that happening, sadly...
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
Mordian Iron Guard - Major Overhaul in Progress 
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