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Hi guys
here is my list for 1000 points of Daemons.Could use the help on correcting the list

Take fateweaver instead of the lord of change. He is much better psykrr has a 4+invulnerable save and his warlord trait is gold.

 necronspurs2012 wrote:
Take fateweaver instead of the lord of change. He is much better psykrr has a 4+invulnerable save and his warlord trait is gold.

ooh,How do you play him anyway? Im new to daemons and its kindda weird to play them

I second taking fateweaver instead of the LoC

Also the soul grinder is best with the Daemon of Nurgle upgrade, and stick him in cover for a 2+cover save

Fateweaver is taken for the 1 reroll a turn, and his guaranteed warlord trait. His 1 reroll is only worth it if you take the grimoire.. He also gets lost in the mix when he has 3-4 other deamon princes on the board.

In this list Lord of change is much better. Faty only gets 1 roll on divination. And no rolls on greater rewards.

lord of Change getting 2 rolls on greater + up to 3 spells from Divination is awesome. I run LOC in my 1850 and pass on faty. The problem is if you see a 2-3 land raider list of big vehicles. Faty has 1 attack... ws 1 /blah. Lord Of change has four smashing attacks on a charge. plus those divination spells to buff himself and surrounding units. I never used a soul-grinder so i can't comment. But more hounds if you can fit them in.

Also, i know screamers are a good choice. But consider dropping them down and picking up a lvl 3 herald of tzeentch with an exalted reward , locus of conjuration for 150 points. Then combine your pink horror squad into 1 15 man unit. Take those extra points and a get a few more hounds.
For the Heralds exalted gift take the Portalglyph and just create units of pink horrors. But Here is what the herald brings.
1) Creates more troops
2) 2 rolls on divination (always want presience) 1 roll on Tzeentch, take flicker fire.
3) Him and his squad get the buffs from prescience
4) The unit or horrors now has 3d6 Str SIX (conjuration locus) shots (reroll misses)
5) the herald does 2d6 str 6 shots as well, unless your other divination spell is useless, then he puts 2 charges into flicker fire and does 3d6 str 6 shots. (reroll misses)
Now of coarse this is 5d6 str 6 shots at one unit, but use this volume of fire to pop Armor 11-12 vehicles, snap shoot at flyers, or focus big squads.

Good luck man, again im not saying fateweaver is a bad idea. Just in this list he doesnt seem to fit.

Fateweaver is the competitive daemons HQ of choice, However in smaller games a LoC can be a better choice.

Fateweaver benefits greatly from the gimoire, as he will get a 2++ save and can use his re roll to make sure it goes off.

However he is terrible in cc, not as durable as a LoC without the grmoire, and does not couter opposing MC's like wraithknights or Riptides as well.

I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I am new to demons as well and interested in playing them.

A cursory search of the nets and the screamerstar pops up.

My question is, how does one achieve the infamous 2++ rerollable with these guys? I know it involves the grimoire for +2 to their invuln and that Tzeench reroll 1's but, that still seems to leave them with a 3++. So what am I missing?

You are missing a power from the divination table which grants a unit a 4++ save. This is why a screamer star needs many heralds, to increase the chance that they roll the power they need.

Also fateweaver has 4++ as base.

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Fateweaver is the competitive daemons HQ of choice, However in smaller games a LoC can be a better choice.

Fateweaver benefits greatly from the gimoire, as he will get a 2++ save and can use his re roll to make sure it goes off.

However he is terrible in cc, not as durable as a LoC without the grmoire, and does not couter opposing MC's like wraithknights or Riptides as well.

A barebones lord of change is generally not much cheaper than fateweaver, and usually the lord of change gets upgraded to the same price as fateweaver. Smaller games have zero relevance on taking a LOC over fatey. Inclusion the correct answer is to ALWAYS take fateweaver over a LOC

astro_nomicon wrote:
I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I am new to demons as well and interested in playing them.

A cursory search of the nets and the screamerstar pops up.

My question is, how does one achieve the infamous 2++ rerollable with these guys? I know it involves the grimoire for +2 to their invuln and that Tzeench reroll 1's but, that still seems to leave them with a 3++. So what am I missing?

You take 2-4 heralds on discs all level 3 so you get 2 rolls on divination for forwarning for a 4++ invun then the grimoire from another the increase to a 2++ re-rollable. The another herald with exalted loci for +1 to thheralds. Then fateweaver using his re-roll per turn to insure the grimoire. Aswell as his ability to roll on all but telekinesis. Take unit of 9 screamers.

Big Blind Bill wrote:You are missing a power from the divination table which grants a unit a 4++ save. This is why a screamer star needs many heralds, to increase the chance that they roll the power they need.

Also fateweaver has 4++ as base.

He does, but a Lord of Change has a 5++ base, with a good chance of either getting +1 wound IWND, 4+ FNP, reroll invuls....

Django_Unchained wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Fateweaver is the competitive daemons HQ of choice, However in smaller games a LoC can be a better choice.

Fateweaver benefits greatly from the gimoire, as he will get a 2++ save and can use his re roll to make sure it goes off.

However he is terrible in cc, not as durable as a LoC without the grmoire, and does not couter opposing MC's like wraithknights or Riptides as well.

A barebones lord of change is generally not much cheaper than fateweaver, and usually the lord of change gets upgraded to the same price as fateweaver. Smaller games have zero relevance on taking a LOC over fatey. Inclusion the correct answer is to ALWAYS take fateweaver over a LOC

Well of coarse you upgrade, but the for same points he is still better, with 2 greater rolls, 3 spells from divination is 295... He also has more attacks, great rewards (see the three i listed above). In small game faty is not that good sorry... He needs a lot of power full units to draw attention away from him... INCLUSION: the correct answer is Lord of Change.. See i can just declare something is right also

Trust me OP, Lord of change is awesome. Faty is great when he has 3-4 other Dp's, you have something with the Grimoire so faty can reroll the dice if you F yourself, and if you really think the warp storm table can truly hurt your army and cost you the game. HINT: it really cant...

Django_Unchained wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Fateweaver is the competitive daemons HQ of choice, However in smaller games a LoC can be a better choice.

Fateweaver benefits greatly from the gimoire, as he will get a 2++ save and can use his re roll to make sure it goes off.

However he is terrible in cc, not as durable as a LoC without the grmoire, and does not couter opposing MC's like wraithknights or Riptides as well.

A barebones lord of change is generally not much cheaper than fateweaver, and usually the lord of change gets upgraded to the same price as fateweaver. Smaller games have zero relevance on taking a LOC over fatey. Inclusion the correct answer is to ALWAYS take fateweaver over a LOC

Lower points games have every relevance. Fatey is aweful without support. He is like a weak, expensive DP. In a low points list where you need your MCs to do the heavy lifting, a LoC is a good pick.

astro_nomicon wrote:
I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I am new to demons as well and interested in playing them.

A cursory search of the nets and the screamerstar pops up.

My question is, how does one achieve the infamous 2++ rerollable with these guys? I know it involves the grimoire for +2 to their invuln and that Tzeench reroll 1's but, that still seems to leave them with a 3++. So what am I missing?

Divination spell + grimoire = 2+ invul, Tzeentch rerolls 1's on saving throws.

Its kind of moot though as most tournaments seem to be taking on the rule any 2+ rerollable save now suffers minus 2 on its reroll so 2+ / 4+

Tsilber wrote:

astro_nomicon wrote:
I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I am new to demons as well and interested in playing them.

A cursory search of the nets and the screamerstar pops up.

My question is, how does one achieve the infamous 2++ rerollable with these guys? I know it involves the grimoire for +2 to their invuln and that Tzeench reroll 1's but, that still seems to leave them with a 3++. So what am I missing?

Divination spell + grimoire = 2+ invul, Tzeentch rerolls 1's on saving throws.

Its kind of moot though as most tournaments seem to be taking on the rule any 2+ rerollable save now suffers minus 2 on its reroll so 2+ / 4+

Well thats wrong because thats how the codex works when things are combined. So basicly ruining tzeentchs specific rule.

Play against a Seer council with a farseer with Baron attached and trust me you will gladly make the trade... I play Deamons and don't mind the rule 1 bit.

And not really, they still can get a 3+ invul rerolling 1's...

astro_nomicon wrote:I don't want to de-rail this thread, but I am new to demons as well and interested in playing them.

A cursory search of the nets and the screamerstar pops up.

My question is, how does one achieve the infamous 2++ rerollable with these guys? I know it involves the grimoire for +2 to their invuln and that Tzeench reroll 1's but, that still seems to leave them with a 3++. So what am I missing?

It's Ok dude,Lets learn together!

Big Blind Bill wrote:

Django_Unchained wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Fateweaver is the competitive daemons HQ of choice, However in smaller games a LoC can be a better choice.

Fateweaver benefits greatly from the gimoire, as he will get a 2++ save and can use his re roll to make sure it goes off.

However he is terrible in cc, not as durable as a LoC without the grmoire, and does not couter opposing MC's like wraithknights or Riptides as well.

well in 1000 points game,he will surely be the one targeted by the enemy so toughness 5 aint helping at all.

A barebones lord of change is generally not much cheaper than fateweaver, and usually the lord of change gets upgraded to the same price as fateweaver. Smaller games have zero relevance on taking a LOC over fatey. Inclusion the correct answer is to ALWAYS take fateweaver over a LOC

Lower points games have every relevance. Fatey is aweful without support. He is like a weak, expensive DP. In a low points list where you need your MCs to do the heavy lifting, a LoC is a good pick.

true,the MC here gotta be enough to handle the rest

changerofways wrote:I second taking fateweaver instead of the LoC

Also the soul grinder is best with the Daemon of Nurgle upgrade, and stick him in cover for a 2+cover save

I think the soul grinder should deep strike and wrack the units in close combat,he's really good at opening tanks


Anyway What about the troops section? should I go for Horros or Daemonettes?

Horrors are overall the most popular choice for daemons troops. They shoot and are fairly durable if they go to ground in the right place. Plague bearers are more durable vs small arms fire, but they are just as weak vs str 6 cover ignoring weapons (waveserpents, heldrakes. Tau), and also put out no ranged damage.

Overall I take horrors, normally in squads off 11 if I am not making a star out of them of them, just to get that exta d6 of shots.

At the same time, the other competitive daemons choice is daemonettes. Whilst not durable, they hit pretty hard, and are quite fast. When using the portal glyph daemonettes are a common choice for me, as with fleet and +3 run speed they are the best option to quickly contest/hold that objective.
Daemonettes also provide some counter to heavy MC outside of your own MCs. Their rending attacks can quite effectively drag down wraith knights and riptides if you can catch them. (Very often the opposition will run his wraith knight away from a squad of daemonettes).

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Horrors are overall the most popular choice for daemons troops. They shoot and are fairly durable if they go to ground in the right place. Plague bearers are more durable vs small arms fire, but they are just as weak vs str 6 cover ignoring weapons (waveserpents, heldrakes. Tau), and also put out no ranged damage.

Overall I take horrors, normally in squads off 11 if I am not making a star out of them of them, just to get that exta d6 of shots.

At the same time, the other competitive daemons choice is daemonettes. Whilst not durable, they hit pretty hard, and are quite fast. When using the portal glyph daemonettes are a common choice for me, as with fleet and +3 run speed they are the best option to quickly contest/hold that objective.
Daemonettes also provide some counter to heavy MC outside of your own MCs. Their rending attacks can quite effectively drag down wraith knights and riptides if you can catch them. (Very often the opposition will run his wraith knight away from a squad of daemonettes).

daemonettes are the best troops in the codex.

Django_Unchained wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
Horrors are overall the most popular choice for daemons troops. They shoot and are fairly durable if they go to ground in the right place. Plague bearers are more durable vs small arms fire, but they are just as weak vs str 6 cover ignoring weapons (waveserpents, heldrakes. Tau), and also put out no ranged damage.

Overall I take horrors, normally in squads off 11 if I am not making a star out of them of them, just to get that exta d6 of shots.

At the same time, the other competitive daemons choice is daemonettes. Whilst not durable, they hit pretty hard, and are quite fast. When using the portal glyph daemonettes are a common choice for me, as with fleet and +3 run speed they are the best option to quickly contest/hold that objective.
Daemonettes also provide some counter to heavy MC outside of your own MCs. Their rending attacks can quite effectively drag down wraith knights and riptides if you can catch them. (Very often the opposition will run his wraith knight away from a squad of daemonettes).

daemonettes are the best troops in the codex.

This is not a fact. They each have their own advantages.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/558623.page
Here is a poll I made a while ago. Horrors are ahead.