Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Unfortunately liber heresius doesnt allow outflank as the scout roll happens after deployment but before 1st turn. If outflanking they would need to make the ld test the turn they arrive to grant scout (as it happens after deployment but the unit has only just deployed), which would be after 1st turn so the rules would forbid it. Still well worth the 15pts for the basic scout, counter attack, fear then hatred (in no particular order apart from scout).

iirc the Scout Ld check happens before game start (with an addendum specifically for this in the entry for the Liber).

That's what I mean - it says it happens after deployment but BEFORE first turn. If outflanking the unit has not deployed so it cannot possibly happen AFTER deployment but BEFORE first turn, as deployment will happen AFTER first turn. That is how I read it raw wise anyhow.
P.s. not meaning to be rude with the caps, just emphasising the point of the wording.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It depends I suppose on whether you read it as deployment of the army or deployment of the unit.

I see your point. An argument may perhaps be made for choosing to hold the unit in reserves during deployment, making the Ld check for the reserved unit, and thus granting Sout and declaring it Outflanking. Maybe? Sounds like a stretch.

That should definitely be the gentlemans agreement of the wording I reckon.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or a 4+ you can 3- you can't as ld10 will mean it will work 11/12 times anyway.

 obsidiankatana wrote:

Dekken442 wrote:

Actually ther are scoring units if you take Coteaz due to his special rule Lord Of Fomorsa, which reads "If an Inquistorial detachment includes Inquisitor Coteaz, all units of Inquisitorial Henchmen Warbands in the same detachment are
scoring units, even if they are not from your primary detachment." So you may want to consider taking some warbands intended for scoring. They have some survivable options that can sit in cover all day.

Henchmen are scoring as long as the detachment is your primary. Reference page 126 of C:=][=.

Where are you getting this from? In the Inquisition Oline Codex it says word for word “If an Inquistorial detachment includes Inquisitor Coteaz, all units of Inquisitorial Henchmen Warbands in the same detachment are scoring units, even if they are not from your primary detachment.” It seems pretty clear to me that this was intented.

Not too mention, it even states that this is the case if the Inquisition is taken as an Inquistorial detachment which means the Inquisitors are being taken as allies. Further rienforcing the point that they do not have to be in your primary detachment to be scoring.

Dekken442 wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:

Henchmen are scoring as long as the detachment is your primary. Reference page 126 of C:=][=.

Where are you getting this from? In the Inquisition Oline Codex it says word for word “If an Inquistorial detachment includes Inquisitor Coteaz, all units of Inquisitorial Henchmen Warbands in the same detachment are scoring units, even if they are not from your primary detachment.” It seems pretty clear to me that this was intented.

Not too mention, it even states that this is the case if the Inquisition is taken as an Inquistorial detachment which means the Inquisitors are being taken as allies. Further rienforcing the point that they do not have to be in your primary detachment to be scoring.

Getting this from page 126 of the Inquisition Codex, as I said. Coteaz makes Inquisitorial Detachment Henchmen scoring, but Primary Detachment Henchmen are scoring anyway. It's bolded font. Look at the page just before the Inquisitorial Force Org.

I think you are both saying the same thing.

 obsidiankatana wrote:

Dekken442 wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:

Henchmen are scoring as long as the detachment is your primary. Reference page 126 of C:=][=.

Where are you getting this from? In the Inquisition Oline Codex it says word for word “If an Inquistorial detachment includes Inquisitor Coteaz, all units of Inquisitorial Henchmen Warbands in the same detachment are scoring units, even if they are not from your primary detachment.” It seems pretty clear to me that this was intented.

Not too mention, it even states that this is the case if the Inquisition is taken as an Inquistorial detachment which means the Inquisitors are being taken as allies. Further rienforcing the point that they do not have to be in your primary detachment to be scoring.

Getting this from page 126 of the Inquisition Codex, as I said. Coteaz makes Inquisitorial Detachment Henchmen scoring, but Primary Detachment Henchmen are scoring anyway. It's bolded font. Look at the page just before the Inquisitorial Force Org.

The Codex Inquisition as far I know is only 22 PDF pages long. Are you references the latest digital version of Codex Inquisition? But I didn't realize what you were saying with the primary thing. I was planning on taking them as allies and my post had o do with them being scoring as allies, not primary. So I think you may have taken what I said out of context or maybe I just thought your post was argueing mine in saying they are ONLY scoring if they are primary. Reading back more carefully, yes we are both correct in each of our cases. I think we may have just misunderstood eachother.

Dekken442 wrote:

The Codex Inquisition as far I know is only 22 PDF pages long. Are you references the latest digital version of Codex Inquisition? But I didn't realize what you were saying with the primary thing. I was planning on taking them as allies and my post had o do with them being scoring as allies, not primary. So I think you may have taken what I said out of context or maybe I just thought your post was argueing mine in saying they are ONLY scoring if they are primary. Reading back more carefully, yes we are both correct in each of our cases. I think we may have just misunderstood eachother.

It's possible the copy I'm looking at is just poorly organized. But I wasn't trying to argue your point - merely add to it. Coteaz makes allies scoring, Primary Inquisition is always scoring. A shame Primary Inquisition can't go past 3x Elites, but I suppose that's what C:GK is for.

taking a few double Heavy bolter chimeras with psybolts is really really awesome! You are able to put alot of Str6 firepower down field for a relatively cheap cost, plus you can load up your primary group (the one with the IC) with servitors with PC or HBs for even more dakka madness!

You're right - the dakka chimera with psybolts 2 hb and 3 hb servitors and a prescience inquisitor is silly cheap for what it brings. Throw in 3 psykers and you have 6 st6 ap4, 9 st5 ap4, and 1 st5 ap4 large blast all prescienced for just 175pts. Thats ridiculous anti horde firepower!
Without the psykers, and a non psychic inquisitor with hell rifle, it is just 130pts for 6 st6 ap4, 9 st5 ap4 and 1 st6 ap3 rending shots. Take off the hellrifle shot if wanting to be truely poinys efficient for a 115pt unit.

I've taken giant blobs of guardsmen with Inquisitors stuck in them to good effect before. Hammerhand plus Rad grenades, and Colonel Straken behind them with a banner, means 50-man blobs of effectively str 6 troops on the charge that will never run away. Throw in Al'Rahem and outflank one of the blobs. Scout the other one with the Inquisitor book. Throw cheap rhinos in front of them as mobile cover full of flamer henchmen.

Poly Ranger wrote:
You're right - the dakka chimera with psybolts 2 hb and 3 hb servitors and a prescience inquisitor is silly cheap for what it brings. Throw in 3 psykers and you have 6 st6 ap4, 9 st5 ap4, and 1 st5 ap4 large blast all prescienced for just 175pts. Thats ridiculous anti horde firepower!
Without the psykers, and a non psychic inquisitor with hell rifle, it is just 130pts for 6 st6 ap4, 9 st5 ap4 and 1 st6 ap3 rending shots. Take off the hellrifle shot if wanting to be truely poinys efficient for a 115pt unit.

If an Inquisitor is with the group, I'd give those Servitors Plasma Cannons over the bolters (if it's going to be a fairly immobile squad). Spreading out, die to the Chimera bolters. Stacking up, die to cannons.

Though expensive i like giving inquisitors the psycollium. pretty much never scatter if a unit has a pysker.