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so I've noticed that there "Theme" lists with reduced unit option whats the benefit of these?

If you look in the 'forces of' books or on the warroom app, you will see that for each tier you go up, you get something else. It might make something cheaper or you might get advanced deployment. Depending on whose tier it is, it may or may not be worth it.

 Commander_Nightflier wrote:
so I've noticed that there "Theme" lists with reduced unit option whats the benefit of these?

Depends on the theme. Generally speaking, you suffer a bunch of restrictions, but get some advantages (increased unit caps, bigger deployment zone, faster units on turn 1 etc etc) in trade.

It's like farsight enclave rules in ways. Less available 'parent' options but more/different alternative options.

Another thing to keep in mind that a theme list may or may not fit said Caster/Lock's playstyle at all.

Big example being Amon Ad'Raza's theme list.....

Talk to gdaybloke from Lost Hemisphere before you totally dis Amon's theme list.

Tier lists are basically optional restrictions you can place on yourself to get some benefits, all of which are cumulative.

Now, you should know that tier lists are not given the same balance considerations as the rest of the game. So some are great while others stink. None are broken, but many are crap or anti synergistic.

Mostly they are just a fluffy combination of stuff together that you can use if you want.

If you are new, stay away from them. This game is tough to learn enough without adding extra optional stuff to totally confuse you. Otherwise you may think some models have certain abilities when they normally don't.



As for reading tier list composition it usually goes like this.

You may only use a certain list of models.

Tier one: you gain X benefit simply by following the restricted list.

Tier two: in exchange for using X models, you gain X benefit.

Tier three: in exchange for using X models you gain X benefit.

Tier four: in exchange for using X models you gain X benefit.

All tier benefits and requirements are cumulative.

 yastobaal wrote:
Talk to gdaybloke from Lost Hemisphere before you totally dis Amon's theme list.

I am kind of curious how he makes it work. Because he is a jack caster, not an infantry caster, and his theme list forces you to take Idrian Skirmishers (and while he was one in the fluff before being converted to the Menite faith), which does not work with his Jack caster play style. Also, the lack of taking Choir often makes Menite jacks mediocre to below average without them, which is also detrimental to Amon.

Idrians aren't bad, they are moderately self-sufficient with their UA. They do like Def buffs but they can operate without them.

Not the best but its not detrimental.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Idrians aren't bad, they are moderately self-sufficient with their UA. They do like Def buffs but they can operate without them.

Not the best but its not detrimental.

I know, under the right caster (and in some forest and that), they can be quite effect. And as you said Grey Templar, they can be effective on their own. Even so with their UA. But with Amon? Idrians are expensive pointswise, and I rather have Jacks or jack support, and the only unit I would take Infantry wise is Zealots for jamming/recycle focus with the Reclaimer. Then again that is how I see this issue.

Yes, there are better options in existence. But its not a horrible tier requirement.

Still, his tier is mostly a fluffy list and not super hardcore competitive.

Which is fair enough. I am thinking in a slightly competitive mindset so I do not want to seem I am coming off as a dick, but how I view it. For a fluffy, fun list I say that it might be cool (potentially win games if the player is skilled), but if we are talking competitively, then Amon's theme list is almost the last thing one would have in mind.

 Tanakosyke22 wrote:
Which is fair enough. I am thinking in a slightly competitive mindset so I do not want to seem I am coming off as a dick, but how I view it. For a fluffy, fun list I say that it might be cool (potentially win games if the player is skilled), but if we are talking competitively, then Amon's theme list is almost the last thing one would have in mind.

The thing I love about Warmachine is that it is pretty much balanced well enough that you can pull the "I'm bringing the 100% best list I can" approach and still expect to find a balanced game most of the time. The game is just that tight. Plus you aren't usually sacrificing any kind of fluff to do it.

Of course I do agree that some of the theme lists are kinda...not that great...

I have found that many theme lists fail the fluff test too. Or seem to have been deliberately constructed to make a poor list.