Post Midterm elections and the general political consequences

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**Co'tor Shas**

whembly wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
whembly wrote:
dogma wrote:
whembly wrote:

In what way?

529 funds are not taxable when applied to room and board. As such a kid given money from his parent's 529 could use it as he saw fit; tax free.

I wouldn't call that abuse per se...

But room & board on college campuses (not to mention tuition itself) is fething insane.

Defintly. It's often more than the tuition.

I just looked up the expenses for my college.
For a full tiime student it's:
$3,085 per semester for tuition (for NY residents)
$625 per semester for various fees
$3,518 per semester for a room (double)
$2,100 per semester for food
For a total of $9,328 foe semester, or $18,656 per year.

^ that right there is criminal.

Hence I need to find where ScooterPuffy lives... I want him to inspire my boys to blue-collar jobs. (I'll still support them if they want to go to academia, but I want them cognizant of all options).

Yep. And this is a SUNY college, the least expensive colleges in New York state. In some private colleges you pay like 18K per semester.

Our whole higher education system needs and overhaul. Not everyone needs to go to college, we should have stuff in high school to give people opportunities to get a job without going to college, farming, logging, production related jobs, ect. Colleges cost way to much. I'm getting a CS degree, and those types of jobs are in high demand right now, especially if they have anything to do with computer security, but I doubt I'll have my loans payed off for a long while, especially if I go on to get a masters (which cost about twice as much).

**Frazzled**

dogma wrote:
Frazzled wrote:

Not at all. Giving your children money to live inside and eat is not money laundering - thats not even a remotely sane argument-AND ITS SPECIFIALLY PERMITTED UNDER THE 529.

That isn't anything like the argument I made.

Please make your argument. You just said it was money laundering. Support your unique claim strongly or its not fit for even base consideration.

**d-usa**

Frazzled wrote:
dogma wrote:
whembly wrote:

I wouldn't call that abuse per se...

What I just described is money laundering.

Not at all. Giving your children money to live inside and eat is not money laundering - thats not even a remotely sane argument-AND ITS SPECIFIALLY PERMITTED UNDER THE 529.

However, while I won't debate I look forward to your view on why it is.

One way it may be considered money laundering:

- Put lots of money in a 529, let it grow tax-free.
- Send kid to college
- Kid decides to rent a room and pay landlord for food
- Landlord is me
- Get my original investment back, plus earnings, don't pay taxes.

Just a thought.

**dogma**

Frazzled wrote:

Please make your argument. You just said it was money laundering. Support your unique claim strongly or its not fit for even base consideration.

Actually I said this...

529 funds are not taxable when applied to room and board. As such, a kid given money from his parents' 529 could use it as he saw fit; tax free.

...and then said this...

What I just described is money laundering.

**Frazzled**

One way it may be considered money laundering:

- Put lots of money in a 529, let it grow tax-free.
- Send kid to college
- Kid decides to rent a room and pay landlord for food
- Landlord is me
- Get my original investment back, plus earnings, don't pay taxes.

Just a thought.

Thats interesting. on the flipside, if its an arm's length transaction its still legitimate. They would have to rent from some place and you're under no obligation to keep the little buggers (I installed an ejection seat attached to their beds with a time release set for 12.01 AM on their 18th birthday). If its market rate rent then there wouldn't be an issue.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

dogma wrote:
Frazzled wrote:

Please make your argument. You just said it was money laundering. Support your unique claim strongly or its not fit for even base consideration.

Actually I said this...

529 funds are not taxable when applied to room and board. As such, a kid given money from his parents' 529 could use it as he saw fit; tax free.

...and then said this...

What I just described is money laundering.

Make an affirmative argument, not double quoting someone else.

**Grey Templar**

Frazzled wrote:
yet she held her own quite well in the debates with Biden. That surprised me.

Not that that is particlarily impressive. Biden is basically a monkey in a suit.

**Frazzled**

You but he's a FUN monkey in a suit. I bet he knows at least two good bars in every state in the union.

**dogma**

Frazzled wrote:

Make an affirmative argument, not double quoting someone else.

I quoted myself and, in so doing, affirmed the affirmative argument I initially made.

**Frazzled**

dogma wrote:
Frazzled wrote:

Make an affirmative argument, not double quoting someone else.

I quoted myself and, in so doing, affirmed the affirmative argument I initially made.

Dogma wins Dakka's secret "most affirmatives in one sentence" competition for January.

**whembly**

d-usa wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
dogma wrote:
whembly wrote:

I wouldn't call that abuse per se...

What I just described is money laundering.

Not at all. Giving your children money to live inside and eat is not money laundering - thats not even a remotely sane argument-AND ITS SPECIFIALLY PERMITTED UNDER THE 529.

However, while I won't debate I look forward to your view on why it is.

One way it may be considered money laundering:

- Put lots of money in a 529, let it grow tax-free.
- Send kid to college
- Kid decides to rent a room and pay landlord for food
- Landlord is me
- Get my original investment back, plus earnings, don't pay taxes.

Just a thought.

That would be illegal as any expeditures must be an eligible educational institution, as defined by IRS rules.
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p970.pdf (see page 10)

**Frazzled**

Clearly, someone has already thought of this trick. Sneaky....

**d-usa**

The educational institution says how much it would cost to room and board there, the room and board expenses do not have to be paid to the institution however.

**Dreadclaw69**

d-usa wrote:

One way it may be considered money laundering:

- Put lots of money in a 529, let it grow tax-free.
- Send kid to college
- Kid decides to rent a room and pay landlord for food
- Landlord is me
- Get my original investment back, plus earnings, don't pay taxes.

Just a thought.

I thought that money laundering was the process of sanitizing money gained from an illegal revenue source

Also your plan may not work; http://www.bankrate.com/finance/college-finance/tap-529-plan-to-pay-graduate-school-rent.aspx

Within certain limitations, you can use 529 plan funds to pay the rent as long as the student is enrolled at least half time. IRS Publication 970, Tax Benefits for Education, spells it out:

The expense for room and board qualifies only to the extent that it is not more than the greater of the following two amounts:
The allowance for room and board, as determined by the eligible educational institution, that was included in the cost of attendance (for federal financial aid purposes) for a particular academic period and living arrangement of the student.
The actual amount charged if the student is residing in housing owned or operated by the eligible educational institution.
You should contact the school to learn about qualified room and board costs. One rule of thumb pertains here: It's important to take the distribution from the 529 plan in the same tax year that you pay the qualified expense.

The 529 plan may also be used for utilities as long as the total expense is below the total established by the school.

**d-usa**

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
d-usa wrote:

One way it may be considered money laundering:

- Put lots of money in a 529, let it grow tax-free.
- Send kid to college
- Kid decides to rent a room and pay landlord for food
- Landlord is me
- Get my original investment back, plus earnings, don't pay taxes.

Just a thought.

I thought that money laundering was the process of sanitizing money gained from an illegal revenue source

Also your plan may not work; http://www.bankrate.com/finance/college-finance/tap-529-plan-to-pay-graduate-school-rent.aspx

Within certain limitations, you can use 529 plan funds to pay the rent as long as the student is enrolled at least half time. IRS Publication 970, Tax Benefits for Education, spells it out:

The expense for room and board qualifies only to the extent that it is not more than the greater of the following two amounts:
The allowance for room and board, as determined by the eligible educational institution, that was included in the cost of attendance (for federal financial aid purposes) for a particular academic period and living arrangement of the student.
The actual amount charged if the student is residing in housing owned or operated by the eligible educational institution.
You should contact the school to learn about qualified room and board costs. One rule of thumb pertains here: It's important to take the distribution from the 529 plan in the same tax year that you pay the qualified expense.

The 529 plan may also be used for utilities as long as the total expense is below the total established by the school.

A university calculates "cost of attendance" using either on-campus housing, which is what you highlighted, or if you plan on living off-campus they do a survey of expenses paid by students living in private housing and calculate that average and add it to all the other expenses that you will likely incur as your "cost of attendance".

"Cost of attendance" =/= "money paid to school".
"Eligible Education Expense" = "money paid to be able to attend the educational program" =/= "money paid to school".

That's why my textbooks are an eligible expense. It doesn't matter if I purchased them from the University, Amazon.com, or my parents who purchased them from Amazon and are "selling" them to me for twice the price and keeping the difference tax free.
That's why my pencils are an eligible expense. It doesn't matter if I purchased them at the University Bookstore, Walmart, or paid my parents twice what they paid for them.
That's why off-campus living expenses, up to the limit calculated by the university, are an eligible expense. It doesn't matter if I live in a hotel room 4 days a week and go home on the weekend, it doesn't matter if I rent a room for $200 a month even though the university calculated an allowance of $900, or if I rent my old bedroom at my parents house for $900.

Edit:

**dogma**

Dreadclaw69 wrote:

I thought that money laundering was the process of sanitizing money gained from an illegal revenue source.

It doesn't have to be illegal. Money received from legal sources can also be laundered, particularly in order to evade taxes.

**Frazzled**

dogma wrote:
Dreadclaw69 wrote:

I thought that money laundering was the process of sanitizing money gained from an illegal revenue source.

It doesn't have to be illegal. Money received from legal sources can also be laundered, particularly in order to evade taxes.

Thats called developing effiicent tax structures.

**dogma**

Frazzled wrote:

Thats called developing effiicent tax structures.

No, I think its called developing a tax structure voters will like.

**Jihadin**

dogma wrote:
Frazzled wrote:

Thats called developing effiicent tax structures.

edited?

edited

Edited 1

Think we need to see how the 529's are to be taxed. Which to me sounds like Obama doing the "Raistlin Model Approach"

**dogma**

Jihadin wrote:

You actually had to inject race into this eh......

It already was, as were gender and sexuality. I also edited my post to remove those concepts.

**Jihadin**

Obama dropped the plan to tax 529's

**ScootyPuffJunior**

whembly wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:

I just looked up the expenses for my college.
For a full tiime student it's:
$3,085 per semester for tuition (for NY residents)
$625 per semester for various fees
$3,518 per semester for a room (double)
$2,100 per semester for food
For a total of $9,328 foe semester, or $18,656 per year.

^ that right there is criminal.

Hence I need to find where ScooterPuffy lives... I want him to inspire my boys to blue-collar jobs. (I'll still support them if they want to go to academia, but I want them cognizant of all options).

Thanks! It's not every day I get a shout out!

Send them on over to the DC area (Northern Virginia specifically) and I can get going on the right path!

**dogma**

Jihadin wrote:
Obama dropped the plan to tax 529's

I was referring to this thread.

**Jihadin**

dogma wrote:
Jihadin wrote:
Obama dropped the plan to tax 529's

I was referring to this thread.

and I was updating on the 529 situation.

**whembly**

Maybe Obama should target the Colleges Foundations?

Huge revenue stream possibilities.

**dogma**

whembly wrote:
Maybe Obama should target the Colleges Foundations?

Huge revenue stream possibilities.

Indeed, especially if he goes after the ones associated with for profits.

**Easy E**

Frazzled wrote:
yet she held her own quite well in the debates with Biden. That surprised me.

She did? I think your Alzheimer's is showing.

I believe the term "Mavericky" came from that debate.

**whembly**

Easy E wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
yet she held her own quite well in the debates with Biden. That surprised me.

She did? I think your Alzheimer's is showing.

I believe the term "Mavericky" came from that debate.

She was good during debates...

She got bamboozled during media interviews.

**Co'tor Shas**

As stated by the great John Cleese, she's a "nice looking parrot". She's not half bad at giving speeches or stuff if she has one written/time to get answers, but she tends to be generally clueless when put on the spot.

**whembly**

Wut?
Hey, Guys: Posting a Lot of Selfies Doesn’t Send a Good Message

COLUMBUS, Ohio – The picture isn’t pretty for guys who post a lot of selfies on social media sites like Facebook and Instagram.

A new study showed that men who posted more online photos of themselves than others scored higher on measures of narcissism and psychopathy.

In addition, men who were more likely to edit their selfies before posting scored higher in narcissism and self-objectification, which measures how much they prioritize their appearance.

“It’s not surprising that men who post a lot of selfies and spend more time editing them are more narcissistic, but this is the first time it has actually been confirmed in a study,” said Jesse Fox, lead author of the study and assistant professor of communication at The Ohio State University.

“The more interesting finding is that they also score higher on this other anti-social personality trait, psychopathy, and are more prone to self-objectification.”

Fox conducted the study with Margaret Rooney, a graduate student at Ohio State. Their results are published online in the journal Personality and Individual Differences.

Fox emphasized that the results don’t mean that men who post a lot of selfies are necessarily narcissists or psychopaths. The men in the study all scored within the normal range of behavior – but with higher than average levels of these anti-social traits.

Narcissism is marked by a belief that you’re smarter, more attractive and better than others, but with some underlying insecurity. Psychopathy involves a lack of empathy and regard for others and a tendency toward impulsive behavior.

The sample included 800 men from age 18 to 40 who completed an online survey asking about their photo posting behavior on social media. The participants also completed standard questionnaires for anti-social behaviors and for self-objectification. (This study doesn’t include women because the dataset, which Fox received from a magazine, did not have comparable data for women.)

In addition to asking how often they posted photos, the survey inquired about whether the men edited their photos before posting, including cropping photos, using filters and using picture-editing software.

“Most people don’t think that men even do that sort of thing, but they definitely do,” Fox said.

Results showed that posting more photos was related to narcissism and psychopathy, but psychopathy was not related to editing photos.

“That makes sense because psychopathy is characterized by impulsivity. They are going to snap the photos and put them online right away. They want to see themselves. They don’t want to spend time editing,” she said.

Editing photos was also related to higher levels of self-objectification, which has been rarely studied in heterosexual men, Fox said.

Self-objectification involves valuing yourself mainly for your appearance, rather than for other positive traits.

“We know that self-objectification leads to a lot of terrible things, like depression and eating disorders in women,” Fox said.

“With the growing use of social networks, everyone is more concerned with their appearance. That means self-objectification may become a bigger problem for men, as well as for women.”

While this study didn’t include women, Fox said she is currently conducting follow-up work that suggests the same findings found in this research also apply to women. Women who post more selfies also show higher levels of narcissism and psychopathy.

However, self-objectification plays a larger role with women, as would be expected.

Fox said she believes there is a self-reinforcing cycle when it comes to self-objectification. People who score higher on self-objectification post more selfies, which leads to more feedback from friends online, which encourages them to post even more photos of themselves.

“It may make people objectify themselves even more,” she said. “We are running a study on that now.”

Overall, Fox said this and other studies suggest our personality traits may influence how we present ourselves online.

“We are all concerned with our self-presentation online, but how we do that may reveal something about our personality.”

Hmmm... they may be on to something here:

Spoiler:

**dogma**

whembly wrote:

She was good during debates...

She got bamboozled during media interviews.

She lost a debate to Joe Biden. That's like striking out in tee-ball.

whembly wrote:
Wut?
Hey, Guys: Posting a Lot of Selfies Doesn’t Send a Good Message

Nor does opening with an inflammatory headline.