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shauni55 wrote: I honestly wish that the community was more open to the idea of home grown rules. If a group of people got together and put together a supplement. Play tested. Took community feedback. And then posted it up as a off I would be thrilled. (Done well that is) however I realize that even outside of the GW stops this wouldn't fly. Let alone the retaliation from GW, even if it.was free for downloadm
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
shauni55 wrote: I honestly wish that the community was more open to the idea of home grown rules. If a group of people got together and put together a supplement. Play tested. Took community feedback. And then posted it up as a off I would be thrilled. (Done well that is) however I realize that even outside of the GW stops this wouldn't fly. Let alone the retaliation from GW, even if it.was free for downloadm
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
shauni55 wrote: I honestly wish that the community was more open to the idea of home grown rules. If a group of people got together and put together a supplement. Play tested. Took community feedback. And then posted it up as a off I would be thrilled. (Done well that is) however I realize that even outside of the GW stops this wouldn't fly. Let alone the retaliation from GW, even if it.was free for downloadm
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
I've always been one to collaborate. I believe that people from different backgrounds and beliefs form a more coherant final product than just one person. If I were to do it, I would want to find people who already are into the hobby but who are also;
Painter/graphic designer (for the cover)
Photographer/editor
At least 2 lore writers
At least 2 people to work out special rules/stats
Not that this isn't possible, people in this community are into other things and I'm sure could do it
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, I'd want it to be a COMMUNITY driven thing. Not just 1 person sitting alone
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/20 19:29:14
shauni55 wrote: I honestly wish that the community was more open to the idea of home grown rules. If a group of people got together and put together a supplement. Play tested. Took community feedback. And then posted it up as a off I would be thrilled. (Done well that is) however I realize that even outside of the GW stops this wouldn't fly. Let alone the retaliation from GW, even if it.was free for downloadm
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
I've always been one to collaborate. I believe that people from different backgrounds and beliefs form a more coherant final product than just one person. If I were to do it, I would want to find people who already are into the hobby but who are also;
Painter/graphic designer (for the cover)
Photographer/editor
At least 2 lore writers
At least 2 people to work out special rules/stats
Not that this isn't possible, people in this community are into other things and I'm sure could do it
Painter/graphic designer could be pics of the web, nobody cares xD
Photographer/editor - Not sure why you need a photographer? Editor could be anybody.
Lore writers - It's not hard to write lore about pre-established fluff
Special rules/stats - Just write it yourself and put it up on Dakkadakka
shauni55 wrote: I honestly wish that the community was more open to the idea of home grown rules. If a group of people got together and put together a supplement. Play tested. Took community feedback. And then posted it up as a off I would be thrilled. (Done well that is) however I realize that even outside of the GW stops this wouldn't fly. Let alone the retaliation from GW, even if it.was free for downloadm
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
I've always been one to collaborate. I believe that people from different backgrounds and beliefs form a more coherant final product than just one person. If I were to do it, I would want to find people who already are into the hobby but who are also;
Painter/graphic designer (for the cover)
Photographer/editor
At least 2 lore writers
At least 2 people to work out special rules/stats
Not that this isn't possible, people in this community are into other things and I'm sure could do it
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, I'd want it to be a COMMUNITY driven thing. Not just 1 person sitting alone
If you'd be willing to play the game online, there's a 40K community I'm apart of that plays the game on Roll20. We have a skype room and the Roll20 site itself where we communicate, hang-out, play games and create tournaments, house rules and the like.
I'm against Chapter Tacics, or at least if they were implemented the same way as they have been for Marines. The whole point of CSM isn't that the Legions are broken, nor is it that they are still operating in Legions all the time. The whole point is that they are a mix, and that for every Legionary 'splinter' there will be a mixed Warband. Applying an army-wide brush is simply going the other way in saying that Warbands don't exist any more.
I can totally get behind Legionary upgrades in a similar way to Marks, and even allow them to be combined. For instance, upgrading your guys to use Night Lord geneseed grants Night Vision and Stealth for a modest cost increase, paid-per-squad. Alternatively you could take Iron Warriors for some heavier firepower access or rules related to Fortifications, or you could take Tzeentchian Alpha Legionaires if you have points to burn.
You could then build 'pure' lists on top of these, with the acceptance that they are inherently weaker in exchange for playing to your strengths. IE- A Night Lord army might require everyone to have the upgrade paid for, and might have limits on Allies or Mark access. In exchange you can force Night Fight and so the Vision you just paid for is guaranteed to be useful. After all, the reasons Warbands are the norm in 40k is because they are more flexible and more adaptable, and quite frankly should be more common than pure splinters.
Of course this is a completely separate issue to things like Berzerker upgrades for everyone in the army, Sonic Terminators etc. that I think should be in the army regardless, and their current removal is wholly unnacceptable. There is no justification for a World Eaters Chosen to be WS4, not-Fearless and without Furious Charge baked in.
WarOne wrote:
At the very peak of his power, Mat Ward stood at the top echelons of the GW hierarchy, second only to Satan in terms of personal power within the company.
I can see how blending marks and legion tactics could become confusing and not make much sense. IE if I'm running Alpha Legion then Typhus should not be in my primary detachment, nor should Korne Beserkers.
hobojebus wrote: Except IW,AL,NL dont use marks they do not worship the chaos gods so it makes no sense to use them.
The system in no way represents non chaos worshipping legions.
Admittedly there's nothing for AL, but IW get Vindis, Oblits and whatever else. NL get Warp Talons and Raptors
Vindicators "represent" Iron Warriors? >_> Warp Talons and Raptors?
This logic is equivalent to Games Workshop removing White Scars chapter tactics, removing the ability to take bikes as troops, and saying "What? You still have bikes in the FA slot, there's your White Scars!"
"Imperial Fist chapter tactics? Bah, you don't need those. Tech-Marines give you bolster defenses, and you have TFC's! There's your Imperial Fists!"
"You guys didn't need those Raven Guard chapter tactics. Just use the assault marines in your fast attack slot!"
"Black Templars don't need their own codex, they don't need chapter tactics either. Just take a whole bunch of tactical squads and scout squads, give them power weapons and boom! Black Templars!"
Come on, man.
^This.
Saying that you can represent, say, the World Eaters with the current Codex, is just saying that you don´t know the background of the World Eaters. And the same goes for most of the Legions. It is like saying that Space Wolves do not need a Codex, not even a chapter trait: just do not use flyers, try to get into close combat asap and that will be enough.
To put it bluntly: if you think you can represent the World Eaters with the current Codex it is perhaps because the only World Eater unit you have ever heard of is the Khorne Berserker.
Spoiler:
What do you know about Slaughterfiends? Tally Keepers? Teeth of Khorne? Bloodslaughterers? Deathdealers, Brass Scorpions, Doom Blasters, Cauldrons of Blood, Apothecaries (lots of them!), Brazen Knights, Rampagers, Destroyers, Triarii, Assault Marines that do not belong to Raptor cults, Red Butchers, Devourers, marked vehicles.... And of course the daemon allies: Bloodletters, Heralds, Flesh Hounds, Bloodcrushers, Bloodthirsters...
You can easily make a 40-unit Codex with a single Legion.... or take one single unit and "imagine" the rest.
Anyway, the trait system can be used to benefit most armies: Eldar Craftworlds / Cabals, Ork Clans, Guard Doctrines, Necron Dinasties... it is just a good way to give your armies a cool theme. But most of the Codexes they are publishing nowadays have less units & options than before, at twice the price. The only clear exception is the SM army. It is a glaring unbalance.
‘Your warriors will stand down and withdraw, Curze. That is an order, not a request. (…) When this campaign is won, you and I will have words’
Rogal Dorn, just before taking the beating of his life.
from The Dark King, by Graham McNeill.
@Shaun. That could be corrected in the 'Splinter' rules though. As mentioned I think that they should be limitations for the most part and encourage Warbands, unless your army is specifically designed to be composed entirely of one Legion, in which case it's a slight benefit. Everyone wins: Warbands are still the most common way to play, every Legion gets a little twist and fluff recognition, and there is a reason *not* to slap the Mark of Nurgle on everything.
For example: Warband- Use the Codex as written. Nothing changes, all Special Characters are available. Legacy of the Warmaster- Paid-per-model. Preferred Enemy (Warlord), Stubborn. May reroll Scatter when Deep Striking. Legion Splinter: Black Legion- Everyone must be a VotLW with Legacy of the Warmaster upgrade. No other Legacy may be taken. The only special characters available are Abaddon and Fabius. In exchange, Chosen become Troops. Terminators may also become Troops if they forfeit their Deep Strike special rule. Units will not Scatter from Deep Strike if attempting to land within 6" of an Icon.
And repeat for all of the Legions. You could get the upgrades on a single page, and the 'Splinter' rules across a double-spread at most.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/20 20:01:44
WarOne wrote:
At the very peak of his power, Mat Ward stood at the top echelons of the GW hierarchy, second only to Satan in terms of personal power within the company.
BlaxicanX wrote: (...) If you'd be willing to play the game online, there's a 40K community I'm apart of that plays the game on Roll20. We have a skype room and the Roll20 site itself where we communicate, hang-out, play games and create tournaments, house rules and the like.
A little thing here: I am interested, but the only thing I get from your link is a "Not Authorized" empty page.
‘Your warriors will stand down and withdraw, Curze. That is an order, not a request. (…) When this campaign is won, you and I will have words’
Rogal Dorn, just before taking the beating of his life.
from The Dark King, by Graham McNeill.
Mozzamanx wrote: I'm against Chapter Tacics, or at least if they were implemented the same way as they have been for Marines. The whole point of CSM isn't that the Legions are broken, nor is it that they are still operating in Legions all the time. The whole point is that they are a mix, and that for every Legionary 'splinter' there will be a mixed Warband. Applying an army-wide brush is simply going the other way in saying that Warbands don't exist any more.
You mean like how chapter tactics basically say that individual chapters don't exist anymore.
BlaxicanX wrote: (...) If you'd be willing to play the game online, there's a 40K community I'm apart of that plays the game on Roll20. We have a skype room and the Roll20 site itself where we communicate, hang-out, play games and create tournaments, house rules and the like.
A little thing here: I am interested, but the only thing I get from your link is a "Not Authorized" empty page.
Too bad the Codex Project is kaput. It was a great forum for the development of fan rules. Not surprisingly Chaos Marines had a fair bit of representation on it.
‘Your warriors will stand down and withdraw, Curze. That is an order, not a request. (…) When this campaign is won, you and I will have words’
Rogal Dorn, just before taking the beating of his life.
from The Dark King, by Graham McNeill.
I'd love to have decent chapter tactics for the Chaos Legions, especially the non-cult ones. Alphas, Night Lords, Iron Warriors should feel distinctly different (No Demons, lots of loyalist supplies - few demons, lots of shock troops and fear - tons of demonic engines and big guns, more of a mechanized feel).
We'll se that probably after GW has released a supplement for every last loyalist chapter ever mentioned...
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
I don't know where the game is played like that , but in general any rule , which is not legal will get big fat no from any opposing player. A lot of people don't accept formations and escalation , and those are codex and GW unlike FW .
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
I don't know where the game is played like that , but in general any rule , which is not legal will get big fat no from any opposing player. A lot of people don't accept formations and escalation , and those are codex and GW unlike FW .
At my FLGS one of the guys runs a custom-made codex called the Varks (Lizardmen in space) and we let him play it because it's a lot of variation. I also used to use my LatD custom codex, too, and one of my friends uses an Exorcists dex.
GW actually encourage fan-made content. People are also fine with it, too, as long as you ask before and let them read it I'm sure many people would be cool with it, and maybe welcome it.
I don't know where the game is played like that , but in general any rule , which is not legal will get big fat no from any opposing player. A lot of people don't accept formations and escalation , and those are codex and GW unlike FW .
Funny, my experience has been that, barring events or tournaments, most people are perfectly fine with non-GW stuff, if only for a bit of variation.
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
No one will play the game ,with rules you made up . Even if the the rules were realy bad and somehow made it easier for opponents to win , they wouldn't want to play , because it is a waste of time. They already knew it was bad and it doesn't help them learn the game better or train for other games or train to play against armies from the same codex , because they just played something made up.
Funny, my experience has been that, barring events or tournaments, most people are perfectly fine with non-GW stuff, if only for a bit of variation
Last week I was told here that the way to flexible gaming is asking people. I asked in 3 stores , if I can use my medusa and in every one it was a no , because it is FW only now . Then I asked about let me play with old codex, got the same anwser and old IG , is technicly weaker then the new one , if someone has the money to order primaris psykers and priests from GW.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/20 22:51:16
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
No one will play the game ,with rules you made up . Even if the the rules were realy bad and somehow made it easier for opponents to win , they wouldn't want to play , because it is a waste of time. They already knew it was bad and it doesn't help them learn the game better or train for other games or train to play against armies from the same codex , because they just played something made up.
Funny, my experience has been that, barring events or tournaments, most people are perfectly fine with non-GW stuff, if only for a bit of variation
Last week I was told here that the way to flexible gaming is asking people. I asked in 3 stores , if I can use my medusa and in every one it was a no , because it is FW only now . Then I asked about let me play with old codex, got the same anwser and old IG , is technicly weaker then the new one , if someone has the money to order primaris psykers and priests from GW.
Mozzamanx wrote: I'm against Chapter Tacics, or at least if they were implemented the same way as they have been for Marines. The whole point of CSM isn't that the Legions are broken, nor is it that they are still operating in Legions all the time. The whole point is that they are a mix, and that for every Legionary 'splinter' there will be a mixed Warband. Applying an army-wide brush is simply going the other way in saying that Warbands don't exist any more.
I can totally get behind Legionary upgrades in a similar way to Marks, and even allow them to be combined. For instance, upgrading your guys to use Night Lord geneseed grants Night Vision and Stealth for a modest cost increase, paid-per-squad. Alternatively you could take Iron Warriors for some heavier firepower access or rules related to Fortifications, or you could take Tzeentchian Alpha Legionaires if you have points to burn.
You could then build 'pure' lists on top of these, with the acceptance that they are inherently weaker in exchange for playing to your strengths. IE- A Night Lord army might require everyone to have the upgrade paid for, and might have limits on Allies or Mark access. In exchange you can force Night Fight and so the Vision you just paid for is guaranteed to be useful. After all, the reasons Warbands are the norm in 40k is because they are more flexible and more adaptable, and quite frankly should be more common than pure splinters.
Of course this is a completely separate issue to things like Berzerker upgrades for everyone in the army, Sonic Terminators etc. that I think should be in the army regardless, and their current removal is wholly unnacceptable. There is no justification for a World Eaters Chosen to be WS4, not-Fearless and without Furious Charge baked in.
Why not represent mixed factions by allying though? It's what SM can do and would represent mixed warbands quite fine.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
No one will play the game ,with rules you made up . Even if the the rules were realy bad and somehow made it easier for opponents to win , they wouldn't want to play , because it is a waste of time. They already knew it was bad and it doesn't help them learn the game better or train for other games or train to play against armies from the same codex , because they just played something made up.
Funny, my experience has been that, barring events or tournaments, most people are perfectly fine with non-GW stuff, if only for a bit of variation
Last week I was told here that the way to flexible gaming is asking people. I asked in 3 stores , if I can use my medusa and in every one it was a no , because it is FW only now . Then I asked about let me play with old codex, got the same anwser and old IG , is technicly weaker then the new one , if someone has the money to order primaris psykers and priests from GW.
Were these GW stores?
Tip. Makumba basically plays at the worst shop in existence. Honestly, I've wanted to make rules but it always comes down to the fact that well, trying to make them balanced isn't quite easy. Sure, the codex makers aren't that great, but it's always more awkward when you broke a model.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/21 02:25:34
I'm against Chapter Tacics, or at least if they were implemented the same way as they have been for Marines. The whole point of CSM isn't that the Legions are broken, nor is it that they are still operating in Legions all the time. The whole point is that they are a mix, and that for every Legionary 'splinter' there will be a mixed Warband. Applying an army-wide brush is simply going the other way in saying that Warbands don't exist any more.
I can totally get behind Legionary upgrades in a similar way to Marks, and even allow them to be combined. For instance, upgrading your guys to use Night Lord geneseed grants Night Vision and Stealth for a modest cost increase, paid-per-squad. Alternatively you could take Iron Warriors for some heavier firepower access or rules related to Fortifications, or you could take Tzeentchian Alpha Legionaires if you have points to burn.
You could then build 'pure' lists on top of these, with the acceptance that they are inherently weaker in exchange for playing to your strengths. IE- A Night Lord army might require everyone to have the upgrade paid for, and might have limits on Allies or Mark access. In exchange you can force Night Fight and so the Vision you just paid for is guaranteed to be useful. After all, the reasons Warbands are the norm in 40k is because they are more flexible and more adaptable, and quite frankly should be more common than pure splinters.
Of course this is a completely separate issue to things like Berzerker upgrades for everyone in the army, Sonic Terminators etc. that I think should be in the army regardless, and their current removal is wholly unnacceptable. There is no justification for a World Eaters Chosen to be WS4, not-Fearless and without Furious Charge baked in.
Why not represent mixed factions by allying though? It's what SM can do and would represent mixed warbands quite fine.
Boy I sure wish i could play with THOSE people. The group I play with are my best friends from high school and they aren't even down with any home grown content. Mainly because they're all idiots and don't even bother to paint their models, let alone be creative with any other aspects. A major hub website for it to be great, but I would want to do it right, IE; have lore, army photos (use different players own armies for the pictures), a really well done cover, etc etc so far and so forth
What's stopping you?
No one will play the game ,with rules you made up . Even if the the rules were realy bad and somehow made it easier for opponents to win , they wouldn't want to play , because it is a waste of time. They already knew it was bad and it doesn't help them learn the game better or train for other games or train to play against armies from the same codex , because they just played something made up.
Funny, my experience has been that, barring events or tournaments, most people are perfectly fine with non-GW stuff, if only for a bit of variation
Last week I was told here that the way to flexible gaming is asking people. I asked in 3 stores , if I can use my medusa and in every one it was a no , because it is FW only now . Then I asked about let me play with old codex, got the same anwser and old IG , is technicly weaker then the new one , if someone has the money to order primaris psykers and priests from GW.
Were these GW stores?
Tip. Makumba basically plays at the worst shop in existence. Honestly, I've wanted to make rules but it always comes down to the fact that well, trying to make them balanced isn't quite easy. Sure, the codex makers aren't that great, but it's always more awkward when you broke a model.
Right that makes sense to me. And that's why I recommended putting it up to the good people here on Dakka who could probably make a very balanced, fluffy unit if you gave them the chance.
Waaagh an' a 'alf
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