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Hi all,

A lot of people seem to field SH now, i have seen more than few imperial knights last few weeks, what tactics does the eldar have to utilize versus a SH unit?

Field your own. A lynx or rev titan will even the odds pretty quickly.

Otherwise, your looking at the various heavy AT options. Wraithcannons(standard and heavy), fire dragons, bright lances a la carte, even swooping hawks can assault and inflict some damage, possibly wrecking it if your lucky.

To kill a Imperial Knight i need a bunch of penetrating hits, and a lot of 6 to make it loose HP.

Swooping Hawks only need to survive 1 round to wreck things w/ Haywire grenades they all have them. That is why I always give them a Exarch w/ a sunrifle. A no scatter DS then fire so the Sungun gets the blind chance then use battle focus to move so they aren't bunched up, can get in terrain, or are behind a wall and

 Mythra wrote:
A no scatter DS then fire so the Sungun gets the blind chance then use battle focus to move so they aren't bunched up, can get in terrain, or are behind a wall and...................................

THE SUSPENSE

All joking aside, eldar can deal with super heavies pretty easily, as you can find great tank hunters all throughout the force org.

I know I bang on about this, but you'd need about 12-13 hawks to reliably kill that thing.

But yes, it shouldn't prove a major problem. Lances, Haywire, Psychic powers, Serpents and Dark Reapers with SS missiles will all make that Knights life hell.

Wraithknights kill em pretty easily as well.


beat em in melee easily and can chunk off potentially 8 hull points a turn from their shooting as well (only 3 on average).


Even if the knights D blast scatters onto your knight it'll only average 3 wounds. Hell even if the blast kills the knight, you traded 200+pts for a 350+ point model.

Doesn't blind affect anything w/ an Init score? So Superheavy walkers could be blinded too right?

Wraith guard with S10 guns jumping out of a wave serpent

Or fire dragons doing the same.

Wraith knights shooting them in the face with S10.

Warp spyders blasting their side/rear AV12 armor.

Hmm. Haywire granades vs SH need to roll a 6 so i'm not so sure about the Hawks.

Why? It states in the Knight Codex that they still lose hull points to glancing hits.

Hawks need 2+ to remove a hull point with Haywire. A 6 just lets them roll on the damage table.

You could also do War Walkers with double Bright Lance and Guide. That should average 5-6 hits, and the Lance rule treats the front armour as AV12.
Should take down half its HP on average, and with a decent chance to get Explode results thanks to AP2.

Overall, the best thing you can do is have at least two units able to shoot it from different angles so the directional shield can't protect against both.

Don't forget Wraithknights will go first in combat with a tonne of S10 hits and a S10 Hammer of Wrath too

Avatar too should do it pretty easily.

 phantommaster wrote:
Don't forget Wraithknights will go first in combat with a tonne of S10 hits and a S10 Hammer of Wrath too

Avatar too should do it pretty easily.

Why the avatar, unless smashing his only str 6?

The Avatar gets 5 Smash attacks on the charge at Init 10. More importantly...

a) He is WS10, so hits on 3+ and gets hit on 5+
b) He can take Disarming Strike to disable the Knight's Str D melee weapon.

 xttz wrote:
The Avatar gets 5 Smash attacks on the charge at Init 10. More importantly...

a) He is WS10, so hits on 3+ and gets hit on 5+
b) He can take Disarming Strike to disable the Knight's Str D melee weapon.

God I didn't think of disarm, most likely because I did in think it would work on a walker.
Cool

 hiveof_chimera wrote:

 xttz wrote:
The Avatar gets 5 Smash attacks on the charge at Init 10. More importantly...

a) He is WS10, so hits on 3+ and gets hit on 5+
b) He can take Disarming Strike to disable the Knight's Str D melee weapon.

God I didn't think of disarm, most likely because I did in think it would work on a walker.
Cool

Yeah sorry should have explained, it also has the Wailing Doom and can take Fast Shot...

With only 6 HP, the Knights won't be too tough to handle for the many awesome reasons already stated. For points efficiency, it does sound like loads of Haywire Grenades may be the best option, though a Wraithknight or two also would be plenty, and they can take on many other units as well. Many armies will be able to just give it a 4+ invul save period with Forewarning now (thinking Primaris psykers in the new AM, or Dark Angels power field thingie, etc.) which will mitigate damage pretty well in combat.

Though actually, a bunch of Wave Serpents zipping around to avoid the Ion Shield should be able to do some glancing with the Serpent Shield, and possibly Scatter Lasers on the sides, no?

Just remember though, if you don't kill the Knight before Initiative 1, the Stomp attacks could prove the end of anything in combat with them. There's a reasonable chance of getting a 6 for those, and SPLAT! So shoot first, then if needed, run something into combat to finish it off before Init step 4.

Killing Daemon Lords like Angraath could be a teensie bit more complicated unless you have Str D in your arsenal (which would also take care of Knights and other SH units). You could pretty easily ground him or the Slayer of Souls, but they get really good saves with high toughness, plus FNP. So yeah, see about getting a Revenant or a Scorpion/Cobra or whatever those giant Eldar tanks are called.

I hear they are weak to fliers?
MVP for my last few Eldar games has been the Crimson Hunter exarch. Maybe spam 3 of those?

I played in a 2000 point event that allowed everything last weekend. I got first turn against a Reaver Titan. 9 War Walkers with Brightlances and then my Revenant Titan dropped it on turn 1.

However, I struggled against an FMC Demon army.

Crimson Hunter is good, but it'll take probably 2 turns to kill it.
With Vector Dancer, it can be the other side, leaving at least 1 side unshielded.

Farseer Anath'lan wrote:
I know I bang on about this, but you'd need about 12-13 hawks to reliably kill that thing.

But yes, it shouldn't prove a major problem. Lances, Haywire, Psychic powers, Serpents and Dark Reapers with SS missiles will all make that Knights life hell.

11 haywire grenades assuming everyone's BS4. You'll never hit him in the armour flank with ion shields if you take baharroth.

Yeah, a 0.55% chance of taking a Hp off throwing one, then a 0.41666% chance in combat. 1 attack per model, 6HP. 6/0.41666=14. Allowing for the throwing+possible explosions, 11-13 haywires, so about 12 models with them.

And thats enough math hammer.

zerosignal wrote:
I hear they are weak to fliers?
MVP for my last few Eldar games has been the Crimson Hunter exarch. Maybe spam 3 of those?

Cant have 3 crimson hunter exarches

Farseer Anath'lan wrote:
Yeah, a 0.55% chance of taking a Hp off throwing one, then a 0.41666% chance in combat. 1 attack per model, 6HP. 6/0.41666=14. Allowing for the throwing+possible explosions, 11-13 haywires, so about 12 models with them.

And thats enough math hammer.

Sorry mate, I forgot you could only throw one.

Most of the suggestions dont seem reliable to me, specially the fire dragon and wraithguard. The knight or any sh walker can wreck the transport and attack the contents.

WK seem like a decent counter yes but you need to be sure to not charge through terrain, if you drop to I 1 then d weapon hits will surely wreck you.

And as a final note, although i like the swooping hawks potential , but they need to be averagely 18" away after they ds to the sh and even if they are behind the wall the sh can outrun them or move in a position to obliterate them.

The reliable yet not the most efficient way i think is the crimson hunter wk combination. 3x crimson hunter can flank imperial knights for example and take a few hull points out while the wk removes hp more reliably then the crimson hunter against most superheavies.

 Dr. Serling wrote:
Field your own. A lynx or rev titan will even the odds pretty quickly.

Otherwise, your looking at the various heavy AT options. Wraithcannons(standard and heavy), fire dragons, bright lances a la carte, even swooping hawks can assault and inflict some damage, possibly wrecking it if your lucky.

Word, the first things that pop into my head is Haywire, and Lances. OK, maybe Fire Dragons...