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I'm a power armor player through and through. But I recently started acquiring some Tau and Eldar models to build a small army to mix it up. I've always been interested in Dark Eldar as their models are amazing looking but knew nothing about them. I just purchased a codex off of ebay to give them a look but I have some questions before my codex comes in. Are there some units I should definitelyl get? Some units to really stay away from? I've never had a hand to hand oriented army. Is this possible with DE? I've heard and read that they're a very difficult army to play well and I'm looking for a good challenge. What do the competitive army lists contain? Any kind of knowledge for a new coming DE player would be most appreciated. Thanks all!

I am a new DE player but have a few games under my belt and put in alot of time finding the best units etc.

Venoms
Beastpacks with Baron Sathonyx
Ravagers
Wyches with haywire in venoms
Trueborn with blasters in venoms

There are more but they're the most common talked about strengths of DE.

I always liked the way the Kabalite Warriors preformed in my games. If you get them they will need a Raider or Venom. Emphasis on the need them. The only unit that stuck out to me as bad would be the Mandrakes, they are cool models but dont preform well.
As far as must haves I would look at:
Archons
Haemonculi
Kabalite Warriors and Trueborn
Incubi

I like to play with coven units - wracks in venom with liquifiers, 2x talos 1 x cronos and also a nice boat of grots!

But i do have a lot of the other stuff.

There are a number of good builds for DE

Venon Spam is one you will be directed to, but please dont - its so boring and expected.

Hellions can be good in a large blob squad with the Baron, as can beast packs.

While you can build a combat DE army i would advise its not a case of rush in and mash face, its still the same tactic as using a shooty DE. You have to isolate sections of an oppenants army, using speed, guile and skill, and then completly obilterate it before quickly redeploying before the opponent can respond.


DE have a steep learning curve, but for any wanna be DE player I would advise going to the darkcity.net and take a look around there.

I've read a lot about venom spam and I was curious as to what constitutes spamming them. I play In a friendly group and don't want to piss anyone off too bad. It also sounds like lists I've seen have a balance of shooting and hand to hand. Is this the best approach to take?

I see it less shooty and assualt for DE and more about speed and application of force -wether that is shooting or combat. as DE you need to be able to apply superior force against a small portion of you opponents army. Units work in synergy not isolation, or as groups of individuals.

Absolutely stay away from Mandrakes, they are totally useless on the battlefield ... unless you just want a set because they are awesome looking. Bloodbrides also fall into this category simply because they have the same problems regular wyches do but cost more.

Things I'm tepid about are hellions. I bought a box of them once. After a few games I turned them into beast masters and a converted baron. Seemed like the best thing. Some people like them, I'm not in that crowd.

Interesting note, on thedarkcity.net someone started a thread titled "What did your mandrakes kill today?" You absolutely have to read the only response: http://www.thedarkcity.net/t8844-what-did-your-mandrakes-kill-today

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From a CC perspective, there are a few "standard" options.

First up is a tooled up Archon. Add a unit of Incubi, Grots or Wracks and give them a Raider. Personally I prefer Incubi but will use Wracks if I still want this option and am struggling for points. A tooled up archon and 9 incubi will cut through just about everything out there..

Second is Baron and beasts.

You should know that Wyches are only good for tank hunting.( note: I'm talking 6th ed, and am not making a statement about 7th). Take a unit of 5, give them haywire and a venom. Then point them at the biggest, baddest vehicle your enemy has. Enjoy the lulz as that vehicle, and your wyches all go up in a puff of smoke.

If you like killing stuff in the movement phase then take Reavers. Groups of 9 with the caltrops upgrades make entire marine squads go poof. However these are NOT for close combat. Pick a target, fly over it, have opponent remove models. I like 2 units of 9. However, even when I just take a single unit they are often a fire magnet as everyone hates them. Note that they were the original unit with move/shoot/move capabilities.

From a general buff perspective, Haemi's are great. They start with a pain token and are ICs. Meaning you can give a pain token to a unit at the very beginning of the game. They also make Wracks scoring. I always take at least one. If I'm not running an archon, I use a haemi as my warlord and hide him in the backfield with same wracks on an objective. Easy points.

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Venom spam means that you pretty much only take units in order to get more venoms. Trueborn, warriors, wyches, incubi, etc. You're goal here is to put 6 or so venoms on the table. Speaking of which, always give your venoms the extra splinter cannon. I usually field 3 or 4 of these in a 1500 point game.

Regarding competitive lists: Most of these feature DE as an ally. Specifically Baron and beasts. The primary army is usually Eldar. Baron has some great rules that work well in a combo.

DE are fragile; however, they do have access to lots of poison (negating high T) and have lance based weapons (negating armor above 12). They are a total spoiler army ... but... you have to be careful. This is not a marine army that you can just drop out in the open and take the punishment. Line of sight blocking terrain in the midfield is your friend.

Finally, I really love talos/cronos. Unlike every other DE model, these guys can take a lot of punishment and dish it out in return. Beware that they don't have EW so they are still subject to instant death. That said, it usually takes about 60 to 80 bolter shots to drop one.

The above advise is fairly good, although for Hellions to work you want a squad of 20 and the baron.

Also with reavers i prefer to use them as tank hunters as to get points worht out of the caltrops you have to be blade vaning every turn to be effective, where as blade vaning to get a few nice extra kills on the way to poppoing the rear of a tank with heat lances seems to be more effective for me.

Bloodbrides peopel say are uselss ( i never use them) however some top table DE armies have used them to great effect so dont discount then entirely.

Heamonculi are great for making wracks scoring and getting the extra pain token which you can then leave behind with a unit.

Talos are grea - i loke them and run them a lot, but be aware they are slow and a fire magnet so you have to plan your army around them to get the most effect. Unless you play on a 4x4 board in whcih case they are amazing


for choppy choppy and archon and incubi are great - but cost a good amount of points, but normally will get into combat and do a lot of damage.

One word: transports
For DE armies, almost everything needs to be in a raider or venom. Everything is too fragile to walk up the board for a turn or 2 (baring the talos and chronos). I have been building my DE army slowly over the past couple months, and every time I get a new unit I also need a transport it to get it into the right position. When you picture DE armies, pictures transports everywhere delivering pain and hurt to the enemy (or dying in a fireball of what used to be their cardboard armored transport).

One thing most people haven't mentioned yet (probably because it's pretty obvious) is warrior squads in raiders. With splinter racks, these squads can fly around and pump out some serious damage to pretty much anything.

Warriors in a raider with splinter racks, night shields and the duke.

3+ poison with rerolls to hit on a boat that can just keep a tactical squad out of range can make for good fun, though you need to plan your manoeuvres carefully.

Grotesques are cool, if you decide on using them get the vampire counts crypt ghoul / vargheist box and kit bash with talos parts, save some cash.

I run my archon with a blaster and 3 or 4 blasterborn in a venom with extra splinter cannon.

Also remember you can get 6 haemies in a single force org, giving access to those much needed pain tokens early on.

My biggest tip is expect to lose for a while, it takes a lot to get used to them, especially if you're coming from marines. Overall though have fun as that's what they are.

ps, I usually get hate for saying this, but a small squad of mandrakes can prove an excellent distraction vs xv88s etc, leaving your more critical units free to approach for a turn (or more if you can get them in to combat, don't expect them to kill anything, though from experience they do an excellent job of tying things up early on)

Bloodbrides and Mandrakes are probably the two units to avoid. Neither of them is completely unusable though. (Mandrakes almost are.)

My top 5 picks from the codex:

5. Grotesques with Urien Rakarth
4. Duke Sliscus with Kabalite Warriors (Raider with Splinter Racks recommended)
3. Talos Pain Engine
2. Reavers
1. Ravagers

4 Trueborn with blasters in a dual-Splinter Cannon Venom gets a lot of good press, but I don't have enough experience with them to say.

Bottom 5:

5. Asdrubael Vect, Lady Malys, and Kheradruakh
4. Wyches (Except for 5 haywire grenade wielding wyches in a Venom.)
3. Cronos Parasite Engine
2. Bloodbrides
1. Mandrakes

Thanks all for the replies. Can't wait for my codex to come in. And I guess I better start working some overtime!

At least in 6th, normally taking a single flyer is a good idea as you will have no other options for shooting at opposing flyers in a pure DE force. Which is unfortunate as Ravagers (DL) are your best unit in the codex imo.

I'm a big fan of the kabalite warriors in raiders. They perform fairly well for me. I love incubi as well. Ravagers are a pretty popular anti tank but I prefer razorwings. They're another unit that always performs well for me. Ravagers never seem to work out for me.

Warriors in Raiders with splinter racks and shields are my preference. I like the little bit of anti-AV that Raiders bring...of course my dark lances hate me so they always fail me.

 Dracos wrote:
At least in 6th, normally taking a single flyer is a good idea as you will have no other options for shooting at opposing flyers in a pure DE force. Which is unfortunate as Ravagers (DL) are your best unit in the codex imo.

I'm really really hoping that when they decide to update the DE dex that they move the razorwing and bomber into the FA slot. Having those compete with Ravager/Talos makes for an extremely hard decision. I only want the razorwing if I'm going to face another flier. Ravagers are better at killing tanks, and dissie ravagers are better at killing infantry but you either have to take an aegis line or a razorwing to have an effective way of countering other fliers....and I'm not keen on having a unit sitting still to man a quad gun. Just doesn't fit the DE MO.

The DE battle force set seems like it falls in line with what everyone is suggesting. Would that be a smart purchase to grab a couple of those? That's 40 troops, 2 transports, and 6 jetbikes. A couple more transports would protect all of the troops. If the jetbikes don't seem strong enough then I could ebay em and get some other goodies. Sorry about all of the questions but we have no DE players in our group so I know zero about that army.

I'd say at least one DE battleforce is mandatory when starting a DE army. If I was trying to get to 1500 then I'd buy two or three. Then add the other things you want.

It's like buying a box of warriors, a raider and a box of reavers while getting a box of wyches for free. So even if you weren't planning on doing wyches, you may as well get the BF as those are basically given to you.

Bear in mind that DE is one of the most (if not THE most) "convertible" army out there.

NOTE: Raider kits typically come with several interestingly posed warriors. Some people glue those on, I converted mine to be dynamically posed trueborn. Same with the venoms, those come with 2 extra wyches to build to taste.

 RavenGuard55 wrote:
The DE battle force set seems like it falls in line with what everyone is suggesting. Would that be a smart purchase to grab a couple of those? That's 40 troops, 2 transports, and 6 jetbikes. A couple more transports would protect all of the troops. If the jetbikes don't seem strong enough then I could ebay em and get some other goodies. Sorry about all of the questions but we have no DE players in our group so I know zero about that army.

The jetbikes are a great unit. They are not an auto-take for DE, but they can be very effective and fun to use. Typically they are either used as tank hunters or to shred infantry.

clively wrote:
I'd say at least one DE battleforce is mandatory when starting a DE army. If I was trying to get to 1500 then I'd buy two or three. Then add the other things you want.

It's like buying a box of warriors, a raider and a box of reavers while getting a box of wyches for free. So even if you weren't planning on doing wyches, you may as well get the BF as those are basically given to you.

Bear in mind that DE is one of the most (if not THE most) "convertible" army out there.

NOTE: Raider kits typically come with several interestingly posed warriors. Some people glue those on, I converted mine to be dynamically posed trueborn. Same with the venoms, those come with 2 extra wyches to build to taste.

Great information on those kits. Most appreciated.