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Hi guys! I recently entered world of WH40k with some sweet eldar army that I bought.
For start I've got:
HQ - Farseer
3 x Warlock
2 x Wave Serpent
1 unit of 5x Dire Avengers
1 Vyper Jetbike
10 Eldar Guardians with Support Weapon

Soon I will face my friend's Chaos Marines army of 500 pkt. I want to make the best setup from what I've got, but I lack experience to do so.
Could you guys suggest me what I can build and which upgrades/weapons I should use to maximize efectivenes of my models?
Also I would like to know what I need to make from this base nice 1000-1200 pts army.
Thanks in advance.

Hokay, sounds like you have a good foundation for an eldar army. First off, I have a couple of questions.

What do your units have on the model? It's difficult to make a list without knowing what the models you have are. Mostly the Wave Serpents and Guardians, as they will probably make the core of your list. Second, what units do you feel like using? Try writing up a basic list and we can go from there.

My models are WIP, so I can actually mount any equipment available (I think), but if I would have to make my first attempt let it be sth like this:

HQ - Farseer (I dont really know what upgrades are best for him, started with Runes of Warding, Singing spear)
TROOPS
5x Dire Avenger
in Wave Serpent with Shuriken cannon, twin-linked scatter laser and serpent shield.
5x Eldar Guardians
in Wave Serpent with Shuriken cannon and Serpent Shield

But this setup is kinda expensive and have really low squad count so I dont really know.

Also I would really like to use my Warlocks because I like the idea of buffing/casting spells in my eldars.
Any help with that?

Guardians are a minimum unit size of 10, but you can fit 12 models in a WS (so you can add the Warlock. The grav platform fills a spot as well).
The optimal load out for a WS is Twin-Linked Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon upgrade and Holo-Fields. The Holo's (and, to some extent, the cannon upgrade) are optional depending on points.
For the Vyper, either a Scatter Laser and upgrade the catapults to a Shuriken Cannon for anti-infantry, OR a Bright Lance and un-upgraded catapults for zooming anti-tank.

But unless your opponent is hyper-competitive your proposed list will stomp all over him. Is that what you want? Would you rather min-max to get the most competitive list available, or get a good all-rounded force for painting and fun? Does your answer to this question match what your opponent's answer to the same question would be?

The two wave serpents alone in a 500 point list will likely win you the game. They are incredibly strong. If you want a closer match I'd go with something like this.


If you don't care about fun and just want to roflstomp him use:


of if you don't mind proxying:


The Reason Wave Serpents are so good is because:
- Twin Linked Scatter Lasers make all of their other weapons able to re-roll to hit.
- Shuriken Cannons instead of Catapults provide 3 extra S6 bladestorm shots (twin linked from scatter lasers)
- The Serpent Shield, when fired, gives D6+1 S7 AP- ignores cover shots with pinning (twin linked from scatter lasers)
- The Serpent Shields, when not fired, allow you to turn a penetrating hit into a glancing hit on a 2+ making them extremely survivable.
- The Holo Fields give +1 to cover save, which means if you've moved at all you get a 4+ cover save (from the jink special rule, +1 from holo fields)
So the low model count really doesn't matter a whole lot since your enemy won't likely have much in a 500 point list that can hurt armour 12, let alone glance TWO of them to death before you shoot them to oblivion.

Where to go for 1000 points is really up to you. The Heavy Support Slots are some of the best units the Eldar codex has to offer. War Walkers, Fire Prisms, and Wraithknights are the most popular, while pairs of Wraithlords can be competitive as well. Support batteries and Dark reapers are less commonly used (but can still be viable). For the Fast attack slot Warp Spiders are the fan favourite, though Swooping Hawks will perform very well against lightly armoured enemies. The only thing you should avoid in the elites section are howling banshees as they are too lightly armoured to make it into combat before they are shot and killed most of the time. For 1000 points I would probably stick with generic HQs, and worry about getting the more expensive named characters later on. For now stick with Farseers, Spirit Seers, or Autarchs. I should note that Jetbikes are VERY good. in Squads of 3 you can keep them away from the battle all game, and then they can hit pretty much any spot on the board on the last turn to contest an enemy objective and win you the game. As squads of 6 or 9 they can put out a surprising amount of firepower. Hopefully that's a good overview of the codex for you, and will help you make your own decisions as to where you want to go with your army! Happy Wargaming!

Very good advice from above poster above.

But as far as your army goes, what is your crafworld or theme?

So as far as my game want from above advices - its really easy to roflstomp enemy with only Wave Serpents, you were right. I lost only due to lucky last rolls that lost me 1 objective in 4th turn against Chaos, when I cleared whole board and he scored my warlord, then Rolled end of game. (Game was controll the relic). My inexperience if you would ask me.
So my craftworld of choice would be Ulthwe and I would like to make my first army in their theme if possible.
After this first game I can see that too much hard armored wehicles could be bad for balance and I would like to make my 500 pkt army more fluffy then competetive.
But my 1250 pts army have to be Best, so continue with your advices if you want guys. I'm really grateful for everything. :-) Thanks for your help and I'm open for every piece of knowlage from you, about my favourites - Eldars.
Thanks again.

Sorry to hear about your loss! The dice gods are fickle beings indeed. You've actually chosen an awkward time to choose Ulthwé as your craftworld of choice because the new edition of 40k is being released this weekend (24th) and psykers are being overhauled. Any advice we give you for lists now may not be relevant or correct a week from now. For now if you are really set on an Ulthwe themed Fluffy army then there are a couple models you're going to want to buy for sure:

- Eldrad Ulthran. The most famous Ulthwe farseer, and one of the strongest psykers in the universe. Definitely belongs in a fluffy Ulthwe army.
- Guardians. Ulthwe armies have very few aspect warriors and focus on Guardians for the bulk of their force, relying on psyker support to buff them.
- Warlocks. Ulthwe is famous for having Seer councils. It is unknown how effective these will be in game in the new edition though, so perhaps hold off on this one.

Yeah, any advice now will be pointless in a week.

As for a ulthwe themed army,

Ground version

Hq-eldrad-210

Hq-farseer-100

Troops-guardians (10) with BL platform and warlock*6-140*6=840

Fast-hemlock is your only option as it fits the theme though I don't recommend it now, in 7th ed though it may be good!

Heavy-support batteries vibros/shadow weavers each with warlocks-125*3=375

Aegis defense line with quad gun-100

Total of 1625

Your points are off, Arbiter.
Eldrad is 205
The guardians with warlocks end up being 870
Total points for that list: 1835

My bad on the guardians, I thought platforms were 15 each not 20.

In that case the list is 1650 exactly.

Thx for advices and lists guys
1650 is a ltl too much for my fluffy list, I would like to have smaller for-fun well painted army - sth like 500-750pts for fast games.
I would use:
HQ Eldrad - great character - I love his lore and also really nice model tbh. 205
3x Guardians(10) with BL platform and warlock each (110 + 35)*3

Thats 640pts.
Lack of aspect warriors for Ulthwe makes it hard to choose Elites for it and I would like to add 1 elite/fast unit for fun.
What would you suggest? (Wanna be as near of 750 pts as possible)

So 1500 pts would be nice price for my competetive list.
Any suggestions for it having in mind next weekend's changes?
Do we know how hard eldars will be hit by nerfs in 7th?
Jetbike council is no more afaik? Also Serpents will be nerfed as well?
What you think can make new (after 7th) Eldars Army Core? I want to prepare for competetive play in future, so what I should focus on?

No one can answer any questions on 7th ed right now, we must wait till the book is released.

As for now yeah, that's a good core though I would spend the last 110pts on support batteries or shadow weavers (magnitize for any option), that comes to 90pts and 20pts for upgrades/more bodies.

Try to take everything you've been hearing with a grain of salt. People inherently dislike change, it's in our nature. Every time something new is released everyone cries foul and many threaten to quit. Sometimes it ends up being justified, sometimes it turns out being fine after some playtesting.
Jetbike councils might end up being just fine.
A side note - you're making the core of your army fluffy for fun, but you want to prepare for competitive games in the future? These are opposite directions in this case.
Fluffy units:
Eldrad
Guardians
Support Batteries
Warlocks
Hemlock Wraithfighter

Competitive units:
Jetbikes
Dire Avengers
Wraithknights
Wave Serpents
War Walkers
Fire Prisms

The more competitive you want to be, the further from your fluff you will be. Unfortunately, you'll have to try and find a middle-ground or outright abandon your theme if you want to get more competitive.

I disagree highly with bojazz, Eldrad is competitive, guardians are, support batteries are, warlocks are. Hemlock isn't.

It just depends on how your using them, guardians work well when A. in serpents, B. footmarching with BL platforms. Support batteries are 30pts each and are T7 with a 3+ armour, they come in 2 cheap flavors, S6 small blast with rending(ish), or AT weapons at range 48" S9 Ap2 if all 3 hit. Eldrad is good in a footdar army, or Deldar beast pack. Warlocks buff guardians making them even better.

Guardians will always be a good choice for their anti infantry guns, and for their AT platforms, all with a 3+ cover with a warlock in area terrian (or 2+ in ruins).

Guardians are a very good troop choice. I usually take star cannons or bright lances with them.Multiple squads of 10 with a single turret or if ou play in larger games sometimes you start bumping them up to full strength of 20 with 2 turrets. Bright lances are good for tanks and Star cannons get rid of those pesky Centurions that everyone in my area seems to like using.

As for you psykers be careful about getting too many right now. I know on my first 7th battle im going to be using a Jetseer Council to see how it runs with the new psychic phase. It could be really good or it could be complete crap and the autarch infiltrate/deepstrike/outflank army might be the way to go if you aren't running serpentspam.

Sorry, guys. I should have clarified. I did not mean that those things WERE NOT competitive. I meant that they are less used in highly competitive games. Tournament armies don't often include 10 man guardian squads, or eldrad. This does not mean that they are not useful or good. I whole-heartedly agree that they can be used effectively, especially with wave serpents, but it takes one hell of a player to go up against triptides or a flying circus with guardian blobs and come out on top. Also I attribute the success of guardians in serpents to the serpents, not the guardians themselves.

I was attempting to elude to a sort of "slider" between fluffy armies and tournament armies where the OP should try to find a happy medium, and I placed guardians and eldrad on the fluffy half of the spectrum.

Well, once again I disagree, I have used 10 man guardian units with warlocks in serpents to great success (note no platform is needed if in a serpent) the serpent move forward and shoots, then guardians hop out and delete anything non AV with 20 bladestorm shots, repeat this 6 times.

 Arbiter wrote:
Well, once again I disagree, I have used 10 man guardian units with warlocks in serpents to great success (note no platform is needed if in a serpent) the serpent move forward and shoots, then guardians hop out and delete anything non AV with 20 bladestorm shots, repeat this 6 times.

Just keep them in cover if they aren't in the serpent.

Hopping out of a transport, and combined with battle focus and fleet, makes getting into cover easier.

I think I made a mess saying also about competetive 1500+ list.
I meant I want 1 fluffy list with Elrad and Guardians (750pts)
and second - 1500-1750 pts that will be my go-to, competetive list, it doesn't have to be Ulthwe themed.

So my questions are
1) Given list from my previous post I want to add 1 more fast/elite unit to close cost of 750 pts and be in Ulthwe feel.

2) What are the best starting models for competetive 1500-1750 pts list that will be still valid after 7th ed?

Thanks for every post you wrote guys, I'm new to this so everyone helped me a lot.

Well for your questions,

1) sure, but it will be hard.

2) cannot be decided yet, but next week we can answer that!

As for your 1500-1750 competitive list, what did you have in mind? Mechdar? MC spam? Really anything works.