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Didn't Mantic Games start similarly to this idea? Kickstarting after having an established product? Though I'll admit they have their issues with materials and so many Kickstarters to manage, but for the most part they seem to be doing fine. And Defiance has other issues that are too many to list.



You're right on this one. Affordable and good looking proxys aren't in abundance although there are lots of good looking alternatives. And aesthetics wise there aren't any games that come to mind with a 40k or War Prime feel. So I feel OnePageAnon went into hyperbole, no offense. It just looks like that.

Edit: other than obvious orks rip-offs in Warpath, but generally that game does not have a 40k/War Prime feel.

The real problem with War Prime is the lack of anything truly exciting (...yet at least). I've said I like the Kelk but the rules themselves are hugely important and all we've got is a summary of them to go on. So we can't really be excited about that. The miniatures themselves are the only thing left to be excited about but there aren't even renders for the other species yet and the 3D printouts aren't great. Ironically, I was telling my friend last night that this game had potential but that Kingsmaker needed some more time before launching the KS. Next day, they launch the campaign.

Sinful Hero: So what you're saying is, the finished product will look very different from the render they've shown? And is that a good thing?

Renders will never translate 100% to the final product, and they have to rework the existing renders to use for polystyrene production anyway. The only way the final product looking different from the render being a good thing is having less detail loss.

 Barzam wrote:
Actually, they did say that they would rework the renders for plastic. As-is, these guys have their heads fixed to the bodies, but if you notice, they mention in the stretch goals adding in new heads. Plus it was mentioned that they would be doing some different shoulder armor as well. So, I imagine that the existing render was designed solely for the 3D printing and that it'll be tweaked for actual production with more appropriate cuts added in.

It's not just a case of where they choose to cut it up, unless they go for an awful lot of little, fiddly pieces. The hydraulics on the waist are problematic, as is all the little intricate detail in the soft joints. They have panel lines running around curved surfaces, undercuts on the edges of armour plates, and those little circular details on shoulders, chest and shins that would need to be warped to point in the same direction as the mould pulls off.

Without these coming an 20 pieces, I don't see any way they can make that design in plastic without a considerable amount of fudging and lost detail.

I don't know about that. If Wargames Factory can pull off the crazy details that Kingdom Death has in multipart plastic figures, I'd bet that it's possible with these, too. Besides, the parts need not necessarily separate where those details like the hydraulics are. The torso could possibly separate in such a way that the back part, with some of the abdominal details is attached to the legs (much like Mantic's Dwarves) and the front torso half have the head. Or they could just mold it up with the whole legs and torso as a single piece with arms, head, and shoulders as separate parts. It's totally doable without destroying all of the detail.

 OnePageAnon wrote:
From the kickstarter: "Our manufacture is making miniatures for other companies that also have Kickstarters. It would be unfair to them to risk their success by revealing the manufacture."

I hope it is not defiance, but why would that impact other kickstarters? It would only show us if the manufacturer made quality sculpts before and/or show us how loaded this manufacturer is with work orders.

I would assume it's an overseas manufacturer, right? Or did they mention if production would be done within the states?

If it's overseas, I can't think of any company that's got an active KS running that might be affected by disclosing that information.

Then again, what do I know...

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
I would assume it's an overseas manufacturer, right? Or did they mention if production would be done within the states?

If it's overseas, I can't think of any company that's got an active KS running that might be affected by disclosing that information.

Then again, what do I know...

They did post this pic on the KS:

 Barzam wrote:
I don't know about that. If Wargames Factory can pull off the crazy details that Kingdom Death has in multipart plastic figures, I'd bet that it's possible with these, too. Besides, the parts need not necessarily separate where those details like the hydraulics are. The torso could possibly separate in such a way that the back part, with some of the abdominal details is attached to the legs (much like Mantic's Dwarves) and the front torso half have the head. Or they could just mold it up with the whole legs and torso as a single piece with arms, head, and shoulders as separate parts. It's totally doable without destroying all of the detail.

Wargames Factory pulls off the level of detail they get by using alot of little fiddly bits. They produce the plastic models for Malifaux and those come in an odd number of peices, the models are amazing but fiddly. The last model made by them I assembled had three seperated peices that made up the head.

Wargames Factory produces stuff on a sprue and has no US based manufacturing so based upon the information given their not an option.

I'm just using WGF as an example that it is possible to retain that level of detail while still producing a figure in plastic. These figures might just have to be cut into a bunch of tiny pieces. We won't really know until we see how they finally decide to do it.

But this goes back to what I said earlier. Some people seem to just be looking for something to complain about.

No, I think people are just a bit more savvy, and perhaps jaded, when it comes to Kickstarters and...promises.

More clarity up front is important, and necessary, and a good thing for all involved.

 Barzam wrote:
I'm just using WGF as an example that it is possible to retain that level of detail while still producing a figure in plastic. These figures might just have to be cut into a bunch of tiny pieces. We won't really know until we see how they finally decide to do it.

A lot of people have more exposure to this, and so they really do know, at least in part...

The fact is that Wargames Factory and Games Workshop are absolute wizards when it comes to making figures in high impact polystyrene (HIPS). No one else comes close to being able to do what they do, except Renedra (and they're in the UK, not the US).

It takes a company experienced with making miniatures in HIPS to pull it off well. The only wargaming miniatures company I know of who has been able to go with a supplier who does not normally cast miniatures and get good results in HIPS is Hawk Wargames. And that's because he's such a wizard himself that he was able to do all the hard work of making the models such that they could be molded for production in HIPS.

This leaves only two possible explanations:

1. WarPrime has not done their homework and is planning to use a company unfamiliar with making miniatures in HIPS
2. The more likely option, WarPrime is mis-using the word "polystyrene" and is planning to use a miniature caster that is US-based, but not one that produces in HIPS

I think it is the second option, personally... but the fact is they are either out of their depth, or not being forthright... so neither option is very good, imo.

 Barzam wrote:
These figures might just have to be cut into a bunch of tiny pieces. .

...which is what I said in the first place...

LOL @ their picture of minis next to a ruler.

They don't get it AT ALL.

This thing is just one big, continuous, hilarious failboat.

 Alex C wrote:
LOL @ their picture of minis next to a ruler.

They don't get it AT ALL.

This thing is just one big, continuous, hilarious failboat.

I guess I can see how you might think that you've done what you were asked in that picture. But in a bolshy union work to rule kind of way. Or a not really knowing what you are doing kind of way. There's going to be so many giggles coming from this campaign.

That is embarrassing.

At least they extended it a little bit and didn't just sit the minis by a retracted tape measure...

"I know some of you have been asking for pictures of the miniatures with a ruler. I just added a new image that shows the Elite, Lancer, and a standard black round 25mm base (the sized used for infantry units in the most common 28mm war games) next to a ruler. I hope this helps."

This HAS to be a joke, right?

This entire KS is a joke.

I think he's having a bit of sport now. That is just hilarious. Why would he think we wanted the models lined up before a ruler, and not measuring their height?

And they're in front of the tape, so you can't even discern any sort of accurate measurements anyway...

Just saw their new update, and i am 99% sure that everything they have was part of a scrapped video game concept that they are re-working into a miniature wargame. I cannot think of any other reason why they would have all of these detailed 3d renders already made that only NOW they have to re-work to fit the scale and tooling.

Anyway, here is some more stuff from their FAQ that will keep your faith in this project strong:

"You made video games….why are you making tabletop miniatures?
I wanted to build a digital turn based game for longer than you can imagine. But getting a turn based game funded is almost impossible. So we thought if we started small, built a tabletop miniatures game first, then we would have the brand and fan loyalty that would let us make the game ourselves."

"What distinguishes you from all your competition in the miniatures wargaming space?
Our game will always be free to download and play.
Cutting out some of the nice (but unnessisary to the game) things like full color boxes that get thrown away (or chopped up to be used on bases).
No one questions why there are dozens of different car manufacturers."

It's like they literally have no idea of what is going on in the wargaming world, and again i ask how much money they can really save by not having full color boxes. Anyway i had been chatting with this guy for a while, and you wouldn't believe some of the stuff he said. Some of the quotes i could give you are straight up facepalms.

So basically they see this game as a revenue stream to fund the creation of a not-40k/Starcraft TBS, because they couldn't get funding elsewhere as nobody fancied sparring with the lawyers from GW and/or Blizzard?

Anyone like to revisit my idea that this is a bizarre, low rent, episode of Punk'd?

 Artemis Black wrote:
Anyone like to revisit my idea that this is a bizarre, low rent, episode of Punk'd?

It's looking that way.

And if the ultimate goal was to make a video game, why not just kickstart the video game? Wow.

 agnosto wrote:

 Artemis Black wrote:
Anyone like to revisit my idea that this is a bizarre, low rent, episode of Punk'd?

It's looking that way.

And if the ultimate goal was to make a video game, why not just kickstart the video game? Wow.

I believe the reasoning was, "lack of interest".

If you'd like to use this thread to explain that you won't be backing this project, that is fine.

If you'd like to politely point out the issues you think the campaign has made, that is fine.

What isn't fine, is to be dismissively rude, such as calling the campaign a joke or implying that there is some sort of impropriety going on without any concrete evidence suggesting such.


So please remain polite and classy at all times if you'd like to continue commenting.

Still kinda early, but it appears this kickstarter avoided the "U" shape that we've become accustomed to. If it funds I assume it will follow the incline like earlier kickstarters- http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-bones-an-evolution-of-gaming-min/

That's probably not unusual with a unestablished creator, but I'm fairly sure they will hit 40k.

From a distance, those 3d prints don't look bad. They're starting to grow on me, warts and all. The lancer especially.

Has anyone asked the creator to get a ruler standing up next to the figures so we can get a better sense of scale, maybe standing next to a few other figures?

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
From a distance, those 3d prints don't look bad. They're starting to grow on me, warts and all. The lancer especially.

Has anyone asked the creator to get a ruler standing up next to the figures so we can get a better sense of scale, maybe standing next to a few other figures?

He was asked to show a pic of minis next to a ruler, and we were treated to the above pic...

We'll I just suggested to them to post up a new size comparison picture, hopefully they'll do it the right way this time.

Hopefully.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Still kinda early, but it appears this kickstarter avoided the "U" shape that we've become accustomed to. If it funds I assume it will follow the incline like earlier kickstarters- http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/1513061270/reaper-miniatures-bones-an-evolution-of-gaming-min/

That's probably not unusual with a unestablished creator, but I'm fairly sure they will hit 40k.

Reaper avoided the U shape by giving away more and more stuff for free so the deal became better and better as it went along.

It is by far the exception not the norm

And I am fairly sure these guys will not hit 40k. I'm also fairly certain most of them have never even played 40k if they don't know what 'post pics of your stuff next to a ruler' means.

It's considerably more difficult to comment on this kickstarter now jokes have been banned