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I plan on using this formation from the new ork supplement:



From my understanding of the wording 10 boy squads + a warboss form 1 big unit. Can a painboy (who is now an IC hq slot) be selected to join 1 of those boyz squads and now confer FNP to the entire formation since it states this is now 1 unit?

Also since this unit is made up of troops/hq, and BRB states that units in formations retain their primary battlefield role would this unit be considered troops? Below I have included the detachment I will be sticking this formation to. The command benefit Tellyporta strike allows all non-flyers to roll a D6 and on a 6 they can deepstrike. However, troops get +1 to the roll so effectively troops get to deepstrike on a 5+. My question is can this formation deepstrike on a 5+, 6, or cant use this command benefit because it is a formation?




Cheers.

This specific formation is a single unit.

So yes, an IC can join it.

maskpking wrote:
Also since this unit is made up of troops/hq, and BRB states that units in formations retain their primary battlefield role would this unit be considered troops? Below I have included the detachment I will be sticking this formation to. The command benefit Tellyporta strike allows all non-flyers to roll a D6 and on a 6 they can deepstrike. However, troops get +1 to the roll so effectively troops get to deepstrike on a 5+. My question is can this formation deepstrike on a 5+, 6, or cant use this command benefit because it is a formation?

No. A formation is its own detachment.

Thanks for clearing that up guys.

If I recall, as an IC (even though he can't leave the unit) the Warboss gains the battlefield role of the unit he is attached to. So the whole mess is a troop choice. Also, that's a crazy powerful sounding idea, throwing a painboy in there.

 Leonus wrote:
If I recall, as an IC (even though he can't leave the unit) the Warboss gains the battlefield role of the unit he is attached to. So the whole mess is a troop choice. Also, that's a crazy powerful sounding idea, throwing a painboy in there.

I plan on throwing the big boss pole relic for 20pts on the warboss to make the entire unit FEARLESS take that mob rule!!

Just remember that formations will usually not have objective secured, so them being troops is irrelevant.

i am building the same formation and putting mad dok grotsnikk in there, to give them feel no pain, and fearless.

my green tide costs 1500 points by its self.

And rampage, from memory?

The 4++ inv kff could be good as well...

i thought about throwing him in there too
i don't expect to ever use the rampage or furious charge usrs, I'll most likely be multi charging, and getting disordered charge status.

At a glace I read the title as Can IC's join Fortifications,

lol..

Then I thought about it and was like.. Actually....

 Nem wrote:
Then I thought about it and was like.. Actually....

Don't start that one, because as Fortifications are Units, it sounds legal..... :S

Luckily IC can't join units that contain vehicles..

And Fortifications units are Vehicle units?
I'll need to find the right BrB line but i think that's correct

Page 110, 2nd paragraph:

Buildings of all types use aspects of the Transport vehicle rules. The main difference between buildings and actual vehicles is that they can't move, ...

That whole page is full of 'just like a vehicle', 'treat it like a vehicle', etc..

nosferatu1001 wrote:
And rampage, from memory?

...if your Green Tide is outnumbered in combat, I don't think Rampage is your greatest concern at the moment.

Attach a Painboy, a Mek with the 4++ Kustom Force Field, (Maybe a couple regular Force Fields to cover your bases,) then ally in a Warboss from the main Codex and take the Lukky Stikk so they all have +1 Weapon Skill. Take a couple Nobs with Power Klaws, and then a few who don't have Power Klaws. Maybe add a few Weirdboys, (6 or 7? ) roll on Sanctic Divination, try and get Hammerhand for +2 Strength, and then Sanctuary to make your super Kustom Force Field save a 3+.
And laugh. And laugh. And laugh.
Of course, this'll cost an arm, a leg, and a testicle... But it'll be hilarious.

I've thought of this same strategy: Warboss gets the Big Bosspole, two KFF Meks are in the front of the unit to absorb fire and a Painboy gets the Lucky Stikk - since the wording says they get to reroll "any failed saving throws they make", I think that would mean they get to reroll any FNP rolls, since those come from the Painboy. Playing it safe, that's at least two more FNP rolls per turn.

Even if you make the boyz shootas and moderately outfit the Warboss (big choppa, eavy armor), the total points doesn't hit 1250. You could conceivably toss in a few Big/Mek Gunz or some rokkits/big shootas, etc. to get to a standard points cost. Of course, this makes the army Unbound, if anyone cares about that (you're not getting Objective Secured anyway, though it's not like you're going to want to use the formation to camp on one). Though, you could take three more troops to, er, "validate" the extra ICs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then again, playing the Relic mission with this unit as your entire army would be hilarious

 Multimoog wrote:
a Painboy gets the Lucky Stikk - since the wording says they get to reroll "any failed saving throws they make", I think that would mean they get to reroll any FNP rolls, since those come from the Painboy.

3 points of why this doesn't work:

1). The Painboy isn't making the FNP roll, he may grant the ability to the squad, but he's not taking the roll.
2). FNP is not a save. The rule states this clearly. So the Stick's ability to re-roll saves doesn't apply to FNP.
3). Painboy can't even take the Stick. They do not have access to Gifts.

 Multimoog wrote:
I've thought of this same strategy: Warboss gets the Big Bosspole, two KFF Meks are in the front of the unit to absorb fire and a Painboy gets the Lucky Stikk - since the wording says they get to reroll "any failed saving throws they make", I think that would mean they get to reroll any FNP rolls, since those come from the Painboy. Playing it safe, that's at least two more FNP rolls per turn.

Even if you make the boyz shootas and moderately outfit the Warboss (big choppa, eavy armor), the total points doesn't hit 1250. You could conceivably toss in a few Big/Mek Gunz or some rokkits/big shootas, etc. to get to a standard points cost. Of course, this makes the army Unbound, if anyone cares about that (you're not getting Objective Secured anyway, though it's not like you're going to want to use the formation to camp on one). Though, you could take three more troops to, er, "validate" the extra ICs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then again, playing the Relic mission with this unit as your entire army would be hilarious

Are you sure, a Greentide already has 8 troop and 5 elite in the detachment, so you can really stuff the Orks in. ( I wish nid's had gotten this treatment. )

 grendel083 wrote:

 Multimoog wrote:
a Painboy gets the Lucky Stikk - since the wording says they get to reroll "any failed saving throws they make", I think that would mean they get to reroll any FNP rolls, since those come from the Painboy.

3 points of why this doesn't work:

1). The Painboy isn't making the FNP roll, he may grant the ability to the squad, but he's not taking the roll.
2). FNP is not a save. The rule states this clearly. So the Stick's ability to re-roll saves doesn't apply to FNP.
3). Painboy can't even take the Stick. They do not have access to Gifts.

Just because the wording in the unit entry doesn't explicitly say "access to Gifts" doesn't mean they cannot take them. Consider the Fixer Upperz entry in the Glossary part of the codex where it says Big Mek AND Mek can take these - while the Mek unity entry does NOT say they get access and yet the gift gives them access to it.

 Ministry wrote:

 grendel083 wrote:

 Multimoog wrote:
a Painboy gets the Lucky Stikk - since the wording says they get to reroll "any failed saving throws they make", I think that would mean they get to reroll any FNP rolls, since those come from the Painboy.

3 points of why this doesn't work:

1). The Painboy isn't making the FNP roll, he may grant the ability to the squad, but he's not taking the roll.
2). FNP is not a save. The rule states this clearly. So the Stick's ability to re-roll saves doesn't apply to FNP.
3). Painboy can't even take the Stick. They do not have access to Gifts.

Just because the wording in the unit entry doesn't explicitly say "access to Gifts" doesn't mean they cannot take them. Consider the Fixer Upperz entry in the Glossary part of the codex where it says Big Mek AND Mek can take these - while the Mek unity entry does NOT say they get access and yet the gift gives them access to it.

It really does.

They have no access to gifts, just as painboys have no access to Shokk Attack Guns.
Meks can potentially use the Fixa Upper, but currently there is no Mek with permission to purchase it (other than Big Meks).

Huh? Since when is the Shokk Attack Gun a gift? Of course only Big Mek's can use that gun...

The glossary says Meks can take Fixer Upperz quite clearly.

 Ministry wrote:
Huh? Since when is the Shokk Attack Gun a gift? Of course only Big Mek's can use that gun...

The Shokk Attack gun never says only a Big Mek can use it.
So by your logic anyone can buy it.
Just like a Mek can buy a Gift, even though his entry doesn't t allow it. Same deal apparently.

The glossary says Meks can take Fixer Upperz quite clearly.

And that would apply if the Mek was allowed to purchase Gifts.

Does his Entry say he can purchase Gifts?

 Ministry wrote:
Just because the wording in the unit entry doesn't explicitly say "access to Gifts" doesn't mean they cannot take them. Consider the Fixer Upperz entry in the Glossary part of the codex where it says Big Mek AND Mek can take these - while the Mek unity entry does NOT say they get access and yet the gift gives them access to it.

The Wargear list says Mek and Big Mek only, that excludes everything besides them.
The actual Mek-entry doesn't give him permission to take anything on that list.
Conclusion: A normal Mek cannot take Da Fixer Upperz.
And a Painboy cannot take any of the Gifts.

Best idea would be:
Green Tide Boyz + Warboss
Mad Dok Grotsnik
Maybe a Warboss with Da Lucky Stikk, but I think that is overkill.
Two Weirdboyz to get the bonus-strength and a 6++ (Ork Codex: Warpath isn't needed)
Turn some of the Boyz into Nobz and give them Klaws

PS. Can I please post this image: http://1d4chan.org/images/0/07/Trazyn.jpg

 Ministry wrote:
The glossary says Meks can take Fixer Upperz quite clearly.

Can you show me where?

OPTIONS:
• Any Mek may replace his choppa with a killsaw…
• Any Mek may be accompanied by a grot oiler…
• Any Mek may take items from the Mek Weapons list.

The entry is in the back of the codex under the Gifts of Gork and Mork as a footnote.

 Ministry wrote:
The entry is in the back of the codex under the Gifts of Gork and Mork as a footnote.

So nowhere in Meks entry is he given permission to purchase gifts?

Or do entries not matter, and Painboys can buy Shokk Attack Guns?

 Ministry wrote:
The entry is in the back of the codex under the Gifts of Gork and Mork as a footnote.

Then please quote it, or make a picture from the line that gives Meks permission to buy Gifts.
Because "Mek Only" in a Wargear-list is not permission to buy, it's a restriction for everyone else.

Kangodo wrote:

 Ministry wrote:
The entry is in the back of the codex under the Gifts of Gork and Mork as a footnote.

Then please quote it, or make a picture from the line that gives Meks permission to buy Gifts.
Because "Mek Only" in a Wargear-list is not permission to buy, it's a restriction for everyone else.

In my codex at least (iBook Enhanced Edition) the Wargear list has:

Da Fixxer Upperz (1) x points

(1) Meks and Big Meks only.

This is in the "Gifts of Gork and Mork" list.

As you say it's a restriction, not permission to buy. The Mek still can't purchase anything from the list.