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Hey all,
I was looking into starting to collect an Eldar army, and I wasn't quite sure where to start. I'm not looking to make them an awesome tourny army, it's just for fun.
I would prefer them to be shooty and have a decent amount of tanks (or whatever they may be called for Eldar), I really like putting an army on the table that brings speed and firepower.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Pretty much everything in the Eldar codex besides Howling Banshees and Falcons is pretty good in a semi-competitive or competitive meta.

Wraithknights and Wave Serpents are generally viewed as pretty nasty; take multiples of those to steamroll your opponent. Wave Serpents are kind of like tanks.

It sounds like you should check out Fire Prisms. They're pretty fragile, but pack a punch at 60".

Maybe some Jetbikes and Vypers. Warp Spiders would be good unless you're going for a fully mechanized army.

I play my space marines mechanised, so I'm branching out a changing it up a bit to get away from that. I will have to check those all out.

I'd start by getting the codex, if you haven't already.

Anyways, the only way you pair speed with firepower is by taking guns with short range. If you take long-range firepower, there isn't very much incentive to use the movement phase, which means you'll have firepower, but not speed.

I'd focus on units with shuriken weapons and meltaguns, and wraithguard. The main problem you're going to face is that eldar transports exist to gunline and you don't have any other good options, tank-wise. If you're going to run a mech list, you're just going to have to have a lot of discipline to not just sit there and roll dice because your guns are already in range.

If you make what you're carrying around expensive and short ranged, though, that will help, as you'll be stuck between the transport doing shooting and the more expensive squad inside doing nothing, or actually using the skimmer's speed and durability at the beginning of the game to transport their cargo, which will actually make use of their speed.

It might be worthwhile to consider a close-combat squad as well, to further incentivize you to move up.

Gunline could be quite nice too, it is certainly a different approach than my space marines that hit the middle with tanks and flank with bikes and speeders.

Well, I'd start with

Jetseer,

several units of 5-10 Dire Avengers or 10 Guardians,
each of which mounted in a
Serpent w/ tl scatterlaser, underslung shuricannon,

3 Warwalkers w/ dual scatterlasers,

A Windrider-themed army would be fun. Farseer and Warlocks on jetbikes. Lots of Guaridan jetbikes supported by some Guardians and/or Dire Avengers infantry in Wave Serpents (heavily-armed APCs), Vypers (like land speeders, only snootier), Fire Prisms (tanks w awesome long range gun), Falcon (multi-purpose tank) and a crimson hunter flyer would be extremely hard hitting. And because they are fast (all fast skimmers, and Eldar jetbikes can turbo boost up to 36"), you can usually gain local superiority anywhere you want, and get out of trouble almost anytime you want. Army is a finesse army, so it does take some practice, but it's super sexy

Span1shAztec wrote:Gunline could be quite nice too, it is certainly a different approach than my space marines that hit the middle with tanks and flank with bikes and speeders.

Wait, do you want an army that is fast and shooty, or an army that sits around and rolls dice in the shooting phase. Speed and gunline are mutually exclusive.

It should be, Aileros. But wave serpent.

So?

Every eldar player I've seen who wave serpent spam scarcely moves them for most of the game. Gunlines do not need to be 100% static never move ever with any units. They're a playstyle that scarcely ever moves because their guns are already in range.

Which certainly applies to wave serpents.

Speed and mobility don't really exist if you're not making much use of the movement phase. You could make riptides be able to move 72" in the movement phase and they still wouldn't be fast if they just camped their little bit of cover all game.

Wave Serpents are great this edition, just as they were last edition, you just use them a little differently. People try to shoot me to force jinks in order to save themselves from my shooting... then I say "So what?" I don't have to shoot you so much as I have to cross the board and take objectives. If I have to jink, I will use that serpent to take an objective, if not I can still use it for the firepower. I move a lot, so serpents and jetbikes allow for that. I would skip the Vypers though, I think they are still useless and can't see a reason I wouldn't rather take spiders instead. Wraithknights are great, but I never use them unless I am playing an Iyanden fluff list, they just don't fit my play style. Others abuse the heck out of them, so it comes down to you. I think that no matter how you play you will want serpents and jetbikes in most lists. Having fast moving objective taking units is key. I also love walkers though, and arm them differently (read: magnetize) depending on my needs. Just be careful, they are fragile.

 Ailaros wrote:
So?

Every eldar player I've seen who wave serpent spam scarcely moves them for most of the game. Gunlines do not need to be 100% static never move ever with any units. They're a playstyle that scarcely ever moves because their guns are already in range.

Which certainly applies to wave serpents.

Speed and mobility don't really exist if you're not making much use of the movement phase. You could make riptides be able to move 72" in the movement phase and they still wouldn't be fast if they just camped their little bit of cover all game.

First thing would be to get the codex a course then farseer along with a couple of battleforces to build up a core for your army. Unless you want to run a wraith army in that case you should get a spiritseer, some wraithguard and a wraithknight instead.

The codex aqcuisition is obvious, I already knew that. I have given it some thought and would like a more infantry based army, primarily guardians and dire avengers. I may look into warp spiders and rangers aswell. I'm not entirely sure on the HQ as of yet..
Also, could anyone give me a breif summary of how each different aspect warrior faction works? I feel that would help me decide whic units I want to take.

Also, I am planning to draft up my own craftworld, and I don't really know enough about Eldar to distinguish them - troops wise that is - from the major known craftworlds.

Well, as you're going to be an Eldar player, do the world a favor and DON'T spam Wave Serpants and Wraith units. Please and thank you, from the bottom of my robotic Necron heart.

I might have to spam them every once in a while But i'll try not to for the most part

Brief breakdown of the more well-known Craftworlds and their forces:

Biel-Tan - Focus primarily on Aspects. Troops will be Dire Avengers, Heavy Support will be Dark Reapers, etc.

Sain-Hann - Focuses on bikes and skimmers. Troops will be either Windrider Guardians or squads in a Serpent. Fast Attack would be Vypers, etc.

Iyanden - Wraith heavy. Spiritseers, Wraithguard/blades, Wraithlords, Wraithknights, and for an extra $50 you can use the Iyanden supplement.

Alaitoc - Rangers for Troops.

Ulthwe (my favourite) - Guardian and Farseer spam. One or two Aspect units, but pretty much focuses exclusively on Guardians.

I play a Iyanden force and a mixed Biel-Tan Aspect/Tank force.
My Biel Tan is much harder to play but alot of fun. Its the Swiss army knife army. A tool for every occasion.

My Iyanden force is almost unplayable at 1500-1750. So few bodies its a struggle. I just need more points. At 2250-2500 its absolutely brutal however.

Now a mix of both forces is really strong. Like really strong.

I hate the current jetbike models so I wont buy any until a decent looking model comes out. Read the codex.

Also I move my wave serpents all over the board. You can't play gunline in MoW missions or progressive objective missions. Anyone who plays gunline with Eldar is not a respectable player. We move that's what we do. Even if it doesn't make sense. We move. We are the fastest sad to hear some people don't take advantage of that.

I've had great luck with a "1 of everything" motif. Basically, page through the Dex, and decide what you like the look of. Come back with a few entries you really liked, and we can help you further.

Provided you do about 1 of of everything (except troops, of course), you'll usually be OK in non-competative environments. There are a few bad units, but not many, in the Dex. Most are good to great. And you won't be spamming (Although I was accused of 'Exarch Spam' or something, so it's not perfect defense against that claim...)

This is what I'd Do if I were you.

Buy 2 Eldar Battleforce boxs. That will give you 20 Guardians with 2 weapon platforms 2 x 5 man Dire Avenger squads ( kit them out as normal troops not with an Exarch ) 2 x Wave Serpents and 2 Viper Jet trikes.

Buy 10 more Dire Avengers for 2 more 5 man squads kitted as before with none as an Exarch.

Buy 2 more Wave Serpent transports. Kit all 4 with Scatter Lasers in the turrets and Shuriken Canons on the under mount.

Buy 2 Wraith Knight Kits and build them with the stock wraith canons x 2 and can magnetize other options.

Buy a Farseer Plastic fig and a single Windrider biker to convert into a "JetsSeer".

Buy 2 boxes of Windrider jetbike squads (for 6 bikes) and get 2 biker shuriken canon upgrade sprues so you can have a hv canon in each 3 man squad.

Buy a War Walker Squadron box for 3 of these beauties. (much outflanking pew pew! )

Buy a pack of Warlocks for leader / psychic support of the 20 man group of guardians on the ground holding an objective.)

Anything else you buy for your army is up to you but this would give you a great core army for the Eldar and have the right tools in most situations to apply boot to buns.

My suggestion after getting this might be to add a Crimson Hunter for air support when needed.

You probably wont field all of this in a given game but having it offers you the flexibility to make several sizes of lists.

Just my 2 cents. Enjoy your Games and be the kind of player you'd want to make friends with.

If you're after a highly mobile force, a good throw-in unit is the Swooping Hawks. With AI and AV weapons, they're handy in most situations, but flimsy, like most Eldar.

So, the battleforce gets you the Wave Serpent and Vyper. Guardians and Dire Avengers are handy, both being troop choices.
If you didn't want to use the Vypers as vypers, put a Farseer on the back of one, in place of the turret. It'll save you losing a Windrider model. I've still not done it myself, but can't be too hard to do.

The crimson hunter is useful against tanks, and can double-up as a sniper if upgraded to the Exarch. It hits on 2+, has Precision Shot on 5+, and has 6 shots if kitted out with the Starcannon option.

The Fire Prism is versatile, but I use it as the Night Spinner. It doesn't really fit the theme, but adds a mix of anti-infantry large-blast, and is good against groups of light vehicles.

Something else I've not looked at yet, but might fit for you, is Shining Spears. As jetbikes they're fast, have some firepower, but are a cc unit. It's usually good to have the option.

Bharring wrote:
I've had great luck with a "1 of everything" motif. Basically, page through the Dex, and decide what you like the look of. Come back with a few entries you really liked, and we can help you further.

Provided you do about 1 of of everything (except troops, of course), you'll usually be OK in non-competative environments. There are a few bad units, but not many, in the Dex. Most are good to great...

That is exactly how I play my eldars, in a friendly environment, and its really fun each time I play them.

Not every Eldar army needs to be the serpent + wraithknight + maybe jetbike spam that seems ubiquitous. There is so much more to the codex than just those!

After looking at the units the Rangers, Dire Avengers, Warp Spiders, Guardians, Striking Scorpions, Farseer and Wraithknight seemed really nice.

Bharring wrote:
Not every Eldar army needs to be the serpent + wraithknight + maybe jetbike spam that seems ubiquitous. There is so much more to the codex than just those!

It does not help anyone that GW made the Wave Serpent massively OP AND then made it the only Dedicated Transport choice

Aztec - it sounds like you're looking at Footdar.

With Aspect Warriors, remember that they each fulfill a purpose (Spiders are fast and hard hitting, but short ranged and squishy. STriking Scorpions are bullies who sneak up on enemies and cut em up). You'll use different tools for different jobs.

The Wraithknight feels out of place there, but it would work

Fluffwise, outside Iyanden, Rangers would almost never be in the same engagement as Wraithnouns. Rangers will be usually part of the initial engagements, fully engaged in the opening maneuvers in a conflict. Wraiths, on the other hand, are only used as a last omg-we're-boned resort, as not only are they risking their dead by bringing them to the field - a huge freaking no-no in Eldar culture - but also most of their weapons tear apart the Materium itself - making things easier for the Ruinous Powers. So Wraiths - especially the huge Knights - wouldn't be deployed until everything else failed. Iyanden is different, because they don't care. Douchebags.

Strategy-wise, Wraithknights are different from most Eldar in that they can take quite a beating. When put in a Wraith or Mech list, this is fitting, but in a foot list, you're answering the opponent's questions for them (the answer - put all the firepower into the squishies, not the Knight, in this case).

That being said, if that's what you want, it can work, and it can work awesome.

With the exception of Rangers, I enjoy all those units.

Guardians - everyone swears by their guns, but they are 12" range, t3 5+, and APed by Bolters. Battlefocus only goes so far. Guardians usually sit back with a heavy weapon (brightlance, usually, but I field EMLs often), and make the opponent think twice about dropping a threat into your backfield. Getting across the table is really hard for them, but used right, it's not a problem.

Avengers - Awesome Eldar troops! Keep your opponent between 12 and 18 inches, but mostly try to stay out of LOS if you're not shooting or cleaning up a threat. T3 dies in droves. Even boltguns are scary, and you're paying MEQ points (13ppm) for your Avengers. Worth it, but know their limits.

Warp Spiders - omgwtfbbq. Move an insane amount, and hit like a truck at 12". Then run away. Then JSJ even further. Preferably to safety, but your opponent should be gunning for these first, with just about everything.

Scorpions - Bullies! Think ASM, but Infiltrate and Move Through Cover instead of Jetpacks. If your ASM squad couldn't crack a unit they can't either. And they can really sneak up on people, but they can't jet across the table like ASM. Same idea, different ways of getting there.

Farseer - Always a good decision. Play around with the different tables. You don't need to make the 'right' choice. All the tables are fun (Although I'll miss Puppet Master! Barbequeing Ork Lootas with their friend's scorchas!).

Wraithknight - Big can of woopass. If he attacks something, it should die. A lot of points, but one of the bigger threats in the game short of a super-heavy. If Ghas is a LOW, this guy should be too. People see a lot of them, because they are amazingly strong.

Rangers - I still need to get me some. I imagine they're cheap campers, with the potential to remove a special weapon or something. A couple wounds a round, but nothing amazing in that regard. But they're rangers. So they win. And you, by extension, for fielding them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Morden - I was really hoping the 7th ed FAQ would fix that.

Span1shAztec wrote:
After looking at the units the Rangers, Dire Avengers, Warp Spiders, Guardians, Striking Scorpions, Farseer and Wraithknight seemed really nice.

r
Well, Striking Scorpions look good on paper. But game-wise I'd stay away from them. They are not quite and eventually never reach their target.

Don't forget Warwalkers, with dual scatterlasers they have a decent damage output.

so I play against Marines(Chaos and Loyalist) and Orks, are those units a good fit for playing against those forces?

Span1shAztec wrote:
Hey all,
I was looking into starting to collect an Eldar army, and I wasn't quite sure where to start. I'm not looking to make them an awesome tourny army, it's just for fun.
I would prefer them to be shooty and have a decent amount of tanks (or whatever they may be called for Eldar), I really like putting an army on the table that brings speed and firepower.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Scope out my blog. There are some recent articles on Eldar options. Aside from that shameless plug, the eldar are very good fun to play.

HQ and two troops is where it always begins. I can tell you that a pair of Windryders will end up in most competitive lists and so I would start with them EVEN if later you decide to go with a Guardian/Pathfinder/Dire Avenger themed list because really no matter the list, a pair of these just make it better. they are also some of the most commonly allied in troops choices. So really, a no brainer purchase.

For the HQ, that's Rough. Generally the Farseer and Autarch are the instant winners. Having an Autarch on a bike with Fusion gun is an awesome combination and the Farseer is, well... A Farseer. It may make the most sense to buy an Eldrad model which can be used EITHER as a normal Farseer OR as Eldrad. Just my two cents on that.

I would start there.

Fast Attack is the Strength of the army. EASILY. Swooping Hawks that drop bombs, can escape the battlefield, never scatter, they can kill tanks... and the Warp Spiders that are simply well armored death are probably the unrefuted kings of the slot. You have Hemlocks which can give Flying Monstrous Creatures fits with Psychic Shriek and Terrify. Crimson Hunters which are the most feared anto-flyer in the game I'd wager and it's just an awesome slot. I almost would tell you to build your army out of this before going to the other slots, once the Troops and HQ are decided. The Fast Attacks choice REALLY will determine a lot about the rest of the list and it really should be your focus

FROM there it gets far more debatable what to buy. Money is always the issue. Amongst the Heavy support choices, I personally love the War Walkers and the Tempest Launcher Wielding Dark Reapers. War Walkers are amazingly adaptable to the battlefield and the enemy. Scout em, outflank em, start em on the board, your choice. 3 War Walkers seems like a solid choice in the Heavy Support slot for anyone playing Eldar. They rarely disappoint. The Dark Reapers and the D-Cannons also, give you a barrage option, and though barrages no longer pin (lame) the reality is, some enteresting tactics open up to you when you have access to barrages, such as Null Deployment strategies.

Amongst Elites... Well I think this is probably the weak point in the Eldar Codex and therefore the one easiest to argue about. If you're trying to build a core first, maybe skip these and come back to them once the other things are purchased. But for my money the best OVERALL useful unit in the elites slot is the Striking Scorpions. Their Exarch is really really goodd, and they again offer you a ton of flexibility on the battlefield. Fire Dragons are the odds on favorite to most Elcar players, but here's the thing about them: they are what i refer to as an exchange unit. They kill and get killed, one for one. They therefore strike me as less appealing than units that can deal damage round after round reliably. Still, they are favorites for their reliability in killing a single armored or Monstrous Target. If you DO get fire dragons, dont skimp. Take a larger unit of them.

Wave Serpents are highly regarded and feared. Rightfully so. While I'm personally not a big user of them (I have one Serpent and it never leaves the shelf, pretty much) I respect the hell out of what they are capable of. Just dont get so in love with them that you miss some of the really great choice you have elsewhere.